Jack-O-Lantern
The Central Scrutinizer
- Joined
- Mar 8, 2005
- Posts
- 200
Welcome to Flightinfo.com
- Register now and join the discussion
- Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
- Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
- Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
- Share the passion for aviation
- Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun
Its all up to Comair now!
- Thread starter Jack-O-Lantern
- Start date
- Watchers 10
Welcome to Flightinfo.com
- Register now and join the discussion
- Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
- Invite your friends
- Share the passion of aviation
- Friendliest aviation community on the web
That precedent was set a long time ago. It aint no race...more like a full on power dive. The worst is it will be repeated about every five years for ______ your airline name here.
This is no game and the employees think it is.
My prediction: One of the 3 employee groups (pilots, f/a, mechs) will blow the deal with DAL....leading to the ultimate demise and liquidation of Comair within 90days. Skywest will take over.....What? You thought their massive plans to hire and aircraft orders were just a coincidence?
BTW: Here is an Associated Press link to DAL spokesman saying it's ALREADY too late thanks to the Comair pilots.
http://us.rd.yahoo.com/finance/news...z.yahoo.com/ap/060928/comair_unions.html?.v=2
My prediction: One of the 3 employee groups (pilots, f/a, mechs) will blow the deal with DAL....leading to the ultimate demise and liquidation of Comair within 90days. Skywest will take over.....What? You thought their massive plans to hire and aircraft orders were just a coincidence?
BTW: Here is an Associated Press link to DAL spokesman saying it's ALREADY too late thanks to the Comair pilots.
http://us.rd.yahoo.com/finance/news...z.yahoo.com/ap/060928/comair_unions.html?.v=2
Last edited:
imacdog
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 12, 2005
- Posts
- 4,196
Nice link except it's a Comair spokesperson doing the talking. We all know how much management likes to throw out propaganda. I realize the seriousness of the situation as I will be among the first to be furloughed if Comair loses flying (it will be my second furlough in a year), but when the company is no longer negotiating in good faith then it's time to pack up and move on. I believe most in our pilot group are willing to make a fair deal but what the company is doing is reaching beyond what they truly need.
Last edited:
General Lee
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 24, 2002
- Posts
- 20,442
AP
Comair Doubts It Can Make Winning Bid
Thursday September 28, 7:42 pm ET
By Lisa Cornwell Comair: Concessions Needed to Win Bid for Delta Service Unlikely
CINCINNATI (AP) -- Comair likely will not win union concessions soon enough to make a winning bid next week for regional jet service from its parent Delta Air Lines Inc., Comair's top executive said Thursday.
Comair President Don Bornhorst said that without competitive costs, it's unlikely that Comair can keep flying all the 50-seat and 70-seat jets that are part of its bid. It's also unlikely the carrier will be awarded a contract to fly new aircraft.
"I don't know where our air operations will stop shrinking without a competitive cost structure," Bornhorst said. "I know the first steps will be the 70-seaters going away, not winning new planes and maybe some of the 50-seaters."
If Comair's air operations continue to shrink, the airline will have to focus on growth in other areas such as ground handling of passengers or maintenance operations, Bornhorst said.
"We are all out of time," he said.
The airline, based in nearby Erlanger, Ky., planned to meet again Friday with flight attendants and was meeting with the mechanics union Thursday.
Bornhorst said he was most concerned about the pilots union, which he said had not scheduled talks with the company again until next week, after the bidding deadline.
"Overall, the pilots union seems to believe that this is a game Delta is playing," he said. "Getting them to recognize the seriousness of this and what is at stake is one of the most challenging things we've had to undertake."
The pilots understand what's at stake and want a deal, said J.C. Lawson, an executive vice president with the Air Line Pilots Association representing Comair's 1,500 pilots and master chairman of the local union.
"The company is the one that chose not to meet until Oct. 3," Lawson said. "We have been ready to meet anytime, anywhere."
Delta announced Aug. 22 that it had requested bids for some of its regional jet service, much of which is now handled by Comair. Five days later, Comair Flight 5191 crashed in Lexington, Ky., killing 49 people, and Delta agreed to extend the Sept. 18 deadline for Comair to Oct. 2.
Comair and Delta are trying to emerge from Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection filed last year. Comair has said that it must have concessions from flight attendants, mechanics and pilots to get out of bankruptcy and compete with other airlines.
Bornhorst said that the airline is at the point where it will have to reach a deal with the International Brotherhood of Teamsters representing Comair's 970 flight attendants or impose contract changes approved through U.S. Bankruptcy Court. The flight attendants have said the cuts asked of them go deeper into their wages and benefits than those demanded of pilots and mechanics and have threatened to strike if concessions are imposed.
Teamsters spokesman Galen Munroe confirmed that the union would meet with Comair on Friday.
Comair had earlier reached an agreement with its pilots for $17.3 million in cuts and for $1 million from its mechanics, but those deals were contingent on Comair getting $8.9 million in givebacks from flight attendants. Talks resumed with the pilots and mechanics after Comair said it has reduced the flight attendant concessions to $7.9 million.
Bornhorst said Thursday that Comair has reduced pilots' concessions to $16.3 million, but Lawson disputed that, saying that the company had only lowered the concessions to about $17.2 million.
"We have proposed $14 million, and that amounts to a great deal for the pilots," Lawson said.
The International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers representing Comair's 550 mechanics and the airline said they agreed not to comment on mechanic concessions while talks continued. Comair has 6,500 employees and operates about 882 flights daily to 103 cities.
Bye Bye--General Lee
Comair Doubts It Can Make Winning Bid
Thursday September 28, 7:42 pm ET
By Lisa Cornwell Comair: Concessions Needed to Win Bid for Delta Service Unlikely
CINCINNATI (AP) -- Comair likely will not win union concessions soon enough to make a winning bid next week for regional jet service from its parent Delta Air Lines Inc., Comair's top executive said Thursday.
Comair President Don Bornhorst said that without competitive costs, it's unlikely that Comair can keep flying all the 50-seat and 70-seat jets that are part of its bid. It's also unlikely the carrier will be awarded a contract to fly new aircraft.
"I don't know where our air operations will stop shrinking without a competitive cost structure," Bornhorst said. "I know the first steps will be the 70-seaters going away, not winning new planes and maybe some of the 50-seaters."
If Comair's air operations continue to shrink, the airline will have to focus on growth in other areas such as ground handling of passengers or maintenance operations, Bornhorst said.
"We are all out of time," he said.
The airline, based in nearby Erlanger, Ky., planned to meet again Friday with flight attendants and was meeting with the mechanics union Thursday.
Bornhorst said he was most concerned about the pilots union, which he said had not scheduled talks with the company again until next week, after the bidding deadline.
"Overall, the pilots union seems to believe that this is a game Delta is playing," he said. "Getting them to recognize the seriousness of this and what is at stake is one of the most challenging things we've had to undertake."
The pilots understand what's at stake and want a deal, said J.C. Lawson, an executive vice president with the Air Line Pilots Association representing Comair's 1,500 pilots and master chairman of the local union.
"The company is the one that chose not to meet until Oct. 3," Lawson said. "We have been ready to meet anytime, anywhere."
Delta announced Aug. 22 that it had requested bids for some of its regional jet service, much of which is now handled by Comair. Five days later, Comair Flight 5191 crashed in Lexington, Ky., killing 49 people, and Delta agreed to extend the Sept. 18 deadline for Comair to Oct. 2.
Comair and Delta are trying to emerge from Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection filed last year. Comair has said that it must have concessions from flight attendants, mechanics and pilots to get out of bankruptcy and compete with other airlines.
Bornhorst said that the airline is at the point where it will have to reach a deal with the International Brotherhood of Teamsters representing Comair's 970 flight attendants or impose contract changes approved through U.S. Bankruptcy Court. The flight attendants have said the cuts asked of them go deeper into their wages and benefits than those demanded of pilots and mechanics and have threatened to strike if concessions are imposed.
Teamsters spokesman Galen Munroe confirmed that the union would meet with Comair on Friday.
Comair had earlier reached an agreement with its pilots for $17.3 million in cuts and for $1 million from its mechanics, but those deals were contingent on Comair getting $8.9 million in givebacks from flight attendants. Talks resumed with the pilots and mechanics after Comair said it has reduced the flight attendant concessions to $7.9 million.
Bornhorst said Thursday that Comair has reduced pilots' concessions to $16.3 million, but Lawson disputed that, saying that the company had only lowered the concessions to about $17.2 million.
"We have proposed $14 million, and that amounts to a great deal for the pilots," Lawson said.
The International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers representing Comair's 550 mechanics and the airline said they agreed not to comment on mechanic concessions while talks continued. Comair has 6,500 employees and operates about 882 flights daily to 103 cities.
Bye Bye--General Lee
General Lee
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 24, 2002
- Posts
- 20,442
Give me an actual example in HISTORY that shows such a colapse, thanks to a 9-11 event, economy colapse, high oil, etc. Go ahead and bury your head in the sand.
Bye Bye--General Lee
wmuflyguy
flunky
- Joined
- Feb 3, 2004
- Posts
- 2,006
Our management team is laughable. They are blaming this all on the pilots. Comair's management did absolutely nothing all summer, then all of a sudden they want us to "negotiate".
The managemnet is the reason for this game of brinksmanship, not the pilots. The company knew along time ago they were not going to get the full amount from the flight attendants and they dragged thier feet. They are the sole reason we are in this precarious position.
Management has refused to negotiate. If the situation was as dire as they say, wouldn't you want to get some kinda of concession? They refuse to budge off 16.3ish million. If they negotiated I'm sure they could get the union to bite on a 12-14 million dollar deal (wether it would be ratified is another story). Isn't something better than nothing? Same BS as Mesaba.
I got the resume ready and ready to apply to the other regionals and if that doesn't work out, back to college.
The managemnet is the reason for this game of brinksmanship, not the pilots. The company knew along time ago they were not going to get the full amount from the flight attendants and they dragged thier feet. They are the sole reason we are in this precarious position.
Management has refused to negotiate. If the situation was as dire as they say, wouldn't you want to get some kinda of concession? They refuse to budge off 16.3ish million. If they negotiated I'm sure they could get the union to bite on a 12-14 million dollar deal (wether it would be ratified is another story). Isn't something better than nothing? Same BS as Mesaba.
I got the resume ready and ready to apply to the other regionals and if that doesn't work out, back to college.
I don't say much on this board, just read, by I have to agree with wmuflyguy and say something. All this time, it's been flight attendants, blah, blah, blah. I may have been in la la land and perhaps should have paid more attention, but I thought the deal had been struck and we were going to stick by our first give. Well, all of a sudden LESS than a WEEK to go, it's all on the pilots again. Excuse me? That is laughable. I loved it on the conference call when one of our senior pilots brought it to their attention that when you figure seniority in we are the second lowest in the industry. They want us to be middle of the road. I can't see how we are not competitive. It is unreal. This is unreal, and I WILL NOT give any more. NOT ONE RED CENT. NO MORE. NONE. ZERO. ZILCH. ZIPPO. NARY A PENNY. NOTHING. If I have anything to do about it. So when everyone else is flying Comair's and have a quick upgrade, just remember you are next, my friend.
Share this page
Latest posts
-
-
-
-
MOD Upgrading the ignition backup battery in a Carbon Cub FX-3
- Latest: Cactus Charlie
Latest resources
-
-
-
-
-
AC 90-89C - Amateur-Built Aircraft and Ultralight Flight Testing HandbookAmateur-Built Aircraft and Ultralight Flight Testing Handbook
- Neal
- Updated:
