Is XO really hiring?

[NJAowner]

It is not just about "cheaper". XOJet (and I have seen many of the numbers) is a much more efficient operation than NetJets. A good part of it is that XOJet (1) has pricing flexibility and (2) has flight flexiblity, 2 items that NetJets and the other fracs do not have. XOJet only flies flights it deems profitable (or charges much more for less profitable flight). And except for a very few customers at the highest level, XOJet does not guarantee that it will handle any flight any time (like the fracs). So it can price accordingly. The frac model needs to spread the extra costs of the inefficient flights onto the longer profitable flights. XOJet does not need to do that. Except for someone who flies rarely, XOJet is not a pure substitute for a fractional share -- however, it is a substitute for part of a shares. Many people I know have cut their NJA hours in half -- they fly 50% (mainly ling flights on XOJet for about 1/2 the NJA cost), and then use their smaller fractional share for shorter flights and when they absolutely have to be there and XOJet cant handle the flight in a cost effective manner.

 

[brokeflyer]

NETJETS.....When you absolutely HAVE to be there.


thats gonna add at least 2 more pages to this discussion.

 

[NJAowner]

NETJETS.....When you absolutely HAVE to be there.

Let me rephrase that -- when you actually have to schedule a flight. When you get there is another issue.

 

[X-rated]

NJAowner, and it seems many of his friends, have figured out how to game the system and bypass the inefficiencies. The reality is some owners at Netjets are getting great deals because their short and remote flying is subsidized by those owners who use their shares for longer more profitable routes. The flip side is the poor bastards who fly mainly cost to cost with Netjets are getting ripped off. As more owners figure it out, NJA will be stuck with all the high cost undesirable legs while other operators cherry pick the more profitable flights.

Don't hate the playa; hate the game...

 

[NJAowner]

X-Rated --- BINGO! you hit the nail on the head -- or as they like to post on this website -- winner winner chicken dinner.

I do not know of anyone who has given up all their frax shares for XOJet -- just downsized the share. In my opinion, XOJet is the first charter operator to bring frax safety and service levels to the market on a wide scale basis.

 

[JokerFuel]

Screw Net Jets...screw em all! I hope XO and everyone else hires these great people that need good and viable employment. I'm a Frac guy.... No ********************e. As pilots, all we should focus on is where we make our living. There will always be competition. I wish everyone the best.

 

[imacdog]

Personally I hope the companies that pay the best are the ones doing the hiring, but that's just me.

 

[Praetorian]

It will be interesting to see how the upcoming major airline hiring boom effects the fractional industry. With a projected 2-3 thousand pilots expected to retire from the majors, starting this year and running through 2035, we are sure to see a significant reshuffling of pilots throughly the industry.

Factor in the 1500hr rule and experienced pilots will be in demand. The majors will not be able to get away with the, "just be quiet and don't touch anything son", approach to co-pilot training they employed during the last hiring boom in the 60's. And the Fracs can't really get away with hiring low time pilots.

So I think experienced pilots will be a commodity. Where will they chose to work? The majors and also good corporate jobs (few and far between), will attract a lot of these pilots. That leaves the frac companies that have unions to gobble up most of the rest.

Why? Because, simply put, the work rules and job protections contained in a cba have great value. This is also one of the reasons the majors are at the top of a lot of pilots lists.

Question for Flops and NJ guys. Can you ever imagine going back to work for a large non-union company?

Question for NJOwner. Is XO going to seem like an attractive place to be if all its pilots are 20 something?

 

[eightdriver]

I was hired into the pool at XO Jet last May.... Am currently #4 of 12... Still waiting for a class date. So i would say they are not currently hiring.

 

[Sparse]

I was hired into the pool at XO Jet last May.... Am currently #4 of 12... Still waiting for a class date. So i would say they are not currently hiring.

At last an answer. Thanks

 

[gunfyter]

In the past I had a mix of difficult and relaxing trips ... I have noticed the density of difficult trips has increased over past couple of years ... so may be something to the idea people are leaving the difficult trips on frax shares...

I had thought scheduling had it in for me ...

 

[hammer2]

In the past I had a mix of difficult and relaxing trips ... I have noticed the density of difficult trips has increased over past couple of years ... so may be something to the idea people are leaving the difficult trips on frax shares...

I had thought scheduling had it in for me ...

I think we all have felt that way.

 

[say again]

In the past I had a mix of difficult and relaxing trips ... I have noticed the density of difficult trips has increased over past couple of years ... so may be something to the idea people are leaving the difficult trips on frax shares...

I had thought scheduling had it in for me ...

What's a difficult trip as compared to a relaxing trip?

 

[gunfyter]

I guess its somewhat a matter of opinion ...

I prefer going from one ILS airport to another both with nice long runways , in areas where there is almost never icing or runway contamination, obstacles like mountains ... etc. Preferably on days with no atc traffic issues and slow downs ....

I rather go to Manhattan Kansas than DFW or Newark ...

 

[brokeflyer]

What's a difficult trip as compared to a relaxing trip?

relaxing trip = home base airport....somewhere else.....home base airport.

Difficult trip = 0330 wake up, aspen in feb - teb - hpn - somewhere else crappy....repeat.

 

[Pattern-Master]

Oh come on who does'nt enjoy going into TEB every other day and waiting for over an hour to takeoff because there is a cloud over one of the departure fixes. It' extra fun when it's your last day on and trying to get home!

 

[CE750Driver]

NETJETS.....When you absolutely HAVE to be there.

Let me rephrase that -- when you actually have to schedule a flight. When you get there is another issue.

Mr NJAowner,

Could you please point me to a better option for getting you somewhere. Including fractional, charter, airlines, or any option. For getting you somewhere, when something goes wrong.

Because, lets be honest. Planes break, weather goes bad, and situations arise. Can you please point me to a better option.

Because your reply here implies Netjets is inferior. I believe you are wrong. And your keeping a smaller share proves me right.

 

[NJAowner]

CE750Driver -- none of my complaints have ever dealt with weather or mechanical issues or any issues other than NJA did not want to deliver a plane at the specified time --it was "more economically efficient for them to provide me with my contractual credit rather than provide the flight at the requested time". Those are NJA's words, not mine. I have been around long enough to understand delays caused by weather, mechanical issues, pilot fatigue, etc. Things happen - I understand. But now it seems someone makes a determination of the cost to get a tight flight to happen versus delay it a few hours and let an aircraft and crew who will be there later handle it. That is what upsets me -- when my contractual call out time is something the company just sort-of tries to meet. Many years ago it seemed liked all the "stops were pulled out" to get me a plane when I needed it -- even if it meant upgrading an Excel to a Falcon 2000. That does not happen much anymore.

Keeping my smaller share is strictly an economic issue -- it was underflow for a while (purposely) and if I terminate I do not get a credit for the underflown hours.

 

[brokeflyer]

CE750Driver -- none of my complaints have ever dealt with weather or mechanical issues or any issues other than NJA did not want to deliver a plane at the specified time --it was "more economically efficient for them to provide me with my contractual credit rather than provide the flight at the requested time". Those are NJA's words, not mine. I have been around long enough to understand delays caused by weather, mechanical issues, pilot fatigue, etc. Things happen - I understand. But now it seems someone makes a determination of the cost to get a tight flight to happen versus delay it a few hours and let an aircraft and crew who will be there later handle it. That is what upsets me -- when my contractual call out time is something the company just sort-of tries to meet. Many years ago it seemed liked all the "stops were pulled out" to get me a plane when I needed it -- even if it meant upgrading an Excel to a Falcon 2000. That does not happen much anymore.

Keeping my smaller share is strictly an economic issue -- it was underflow for a while (purposely) and if I terminate I do not get a credit for the underflown hours.

its the unions fault.

 

[gret]

CE750Driver -- none of my complaints have ever dealt with weather or mechanical issues or any issues other than NJA did not want to deliver a plane at the specified time --it was "more economically efficient for them to provide me with my contractual credit rather than provide the flight at the requested time". Those are NJA's words, not mine. I have been around long enough to understand delays caused by weather, mechanical issues, pilot fatigue, etc. Things happen - I understand. But now it seems someone makes a determination of the cost to get a tight flight to happen versus delay it a few hours and let an aircraft and crew who will be there later handle it. That is what upsets me -- when my contractual call out time is something the company just sort-of tries to meet. Many years ago it seemed liked all the "stops were pulled out" to get me a plane when I needed it -- even if it meant upgrading an Excel to a Falcon 2000. That does not happen much anymore.

Keeping my smaller share is strictly an economic issue -- it was underflow for a while (purposely) and if I terminate I do not get a credit for the underflown hours.

Interesting that nobody wants to maturely respond to this post.