Is it just me...?

[Bluto]

Jedi,
I agree with the sentiment that: 'War is very much a blank check, you can't know the full cost in advance.' This is why we shouldn't consider military action as a political solution until all other solutions have been exhausted. In this case, I feel there were other options available and we chose not to take them.

Regardless, however, we are occupying Iraq. We are the government there. The upcoming "transfer of sovereignty" is a joke and everyone knows it. How sovereign can a nation be with a massive foreign military force running the country? As such, we as a nation have a responsibility to rule in a just and moral manner until (if?) we leave, whenever that may be.

Your attempted justification of current war atrocities based on past mistakes concerns me. I strongly believe that we as a nation are continually growing and improving morally. In the past, our actions have been far from ideal. We have to continually expect better of our leaders.

You said, "In my mind, it doesn't matter how many people die in the battle, it is what you are fighting for that makes it worth while." I disagree. Until people can learn to mourn the loss of a single life, be it Iraqi, Afghani, American, or any nationality we can never put war in its true perspective. There must be an accounting. What are we fighting for? Why are we sacrificing our own nation's sons and daughters as well as those of innocent Iraqis? Is it worth it?

 

[Jedi_Cheese]

Jedi,
I agree with the sentiment that: 'War is very much a blank check, you can't know the full cost in advance.' This is why we shouldn't consider military action as a political solution until all other solutions have been exhausted. In this case, I feel there were other options available and we chose not to take them.

Regardless, however, we are occupying Iraq. We are the government there. The upcoming "transfer of sovereignty" is a joke and everyone knows it. How sovereign can a nation be with a massive foreign military force running the country? As such, we as a nation have a responsibility to rule in a just and moral manner until (if?) we leave, whenever that may be.

Your attempted justification of current war atrocities based on past mistakes concerns me. I strongly believe that we as a nation are continually growing and improving morally. In the past, our actions have been far from ideal. We have to continually expect better of our leaders.

You said, "In my mind, it doesn't matter how many people die in the battle, it is what you are fighting for that makes it worth while." I disagree. Until people can learn to mourn the loss of a single life, be it Iraqi, Afghani, American, or any nationality we can never put war in its true perspective. There must be an accounting. What are we fighting for? Why are we sacrificing our own nation's sons and daughters as well as those of innocent Iraqis? Is it worth it?

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." - George Santayana

Hitler sent his troops into the Rhineland in 1936. Had France responded with armed forces, there would be several million more people alive today. The war would have been over in a few months as a decisive French victory. Instead France tried a diplomatic move, and eventually ended up declaring war 3 years later.

Sometimes it is better to go to war initially than continue negociating for a few years and then eventually go to war. With those who you will go to war against, they don't respect your attempts at peace and will only make you weaker and themselves stronger while they negociate. I think that the forces that have lined up against us in this war are beyond negociating with. How do you negociate with someone that only wants you dead, even if it would cost them their own life?

You talk about wasting Iraqi and Afghan lives. Our goverment is supposed to have one thing in mind, the continued welfare of the US and it's citizens. If the Iraqi or Afghan goverments (or the people fighting in their territory) care about the people in their country, they should do what is best for the people there. The US should try to limit civilian casualties, but that doesn't give us the main burden of limiting them. I don't see the Iraqi rebellion doing this, and thus I don't care much when innocent bystanders get attacked. If you use human shields, I think it is permissable to shoot through those human shields to kill our enemies.

 

[7B2]

I think most of us will/can agree on maybe the following statement:

Shoot/ kill/ bomb the enemy while you are at war fighting, but once you've captured a pow he/she deserves a fair treatment by the Geneva Convention.

So, what I'm trying to say is that, war is war and there is nothing fair about it, untill you have a pow without weapons to kill you.

You can't just say: they did/do it to us, so therefore it becomes justified.

I'm just glad we live in a country where you may actually say your opinion, even if it is not what other people like to hear or agree with.

 

[ThomasR]

A reminder: over thirty-five hundred American men, women, and children have died so far in this "war on terror." We are fighting people who think nothing of subjecting prisoners to the most excruciating forms of torture.

Am I really the only guy out here who doesn't give a fart about embarassing photos taken of Iraqi prisoners?

I didn't read all the posts to this expression so I might be reitterating the sentiment; it is not the FACT that people torture each other, however, it is such a repuslive expression of hatred that we lose control of our perspective.