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Is Flight Options Close to Bankruptcy?

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I am glad that FLOPS had money to buy planes, build maintenance centers and repaint Hawkers. A good paint job on a Hawker is about 50K.

They have not paid the vendors for charter services. I am one of those guys and I talk to others daily. We use to get paid in the standard 30 days. The it slipped to 60 days in March. Now it is getting close to 90 days. Again, let me stress that an employee for the Company can't do much about this situation.

I was promised a check on the 6th of November, and I hope it is "in the mail".
 
Easy fix, if your story is true, just don't do charters anymore for FO, or get an amex # up front. Easy as that! I know before my old company did a charter they always demanded payment up front unless it was for a creditable company that they had a good history with. If they even had a hunch that they would not get paid the plane would not leave the ground. I'm sure many companys would like business from Flight Options. What is the name of your company and what kind of aircraft do you operate?
 
Avlor was a few years late and a half billion short. Wonder if UAL will ever get their cash back from Gulfstream?
Flex have you heard anything about Flexjet merging with Options? Last week i talked to a guy that knows a girl who's mom's son, who flys for Flexjet told her that many Flex people were flying into CGF for meetings. I'm not kidding!
 
That would be a very interesting partnership - Raytheon/Bombardier/Flops! At least Kenn would achieve his dream of being the biggest frax program.
 
The charters for FLOPS use to be paid in the standard 30 day period. I did not think of asking for a credit card on an established three year old account. This was a good account with good activity and a 300K credit limit.

We have not flown for FLOPS in the last 56 days because we do not accept flights from past due clients. Lori calls once or twice a week, but my hands are tied.

We fly Hawkers.

If you have more questions, send me a private message with your telephone number. I will call you on my dime.
 
Yeah, that'd be real great, having a FlexJet merger. Then we could run another modified date of hire merger and watch the seniority list grow in front of us again.

They talked about 2,400 pilots by the end of 2005. I'm not sure they could hire that many in the next three years. If that's going to happen, it'll be with mergers. I sure hope it doesn't happen.
 
Nah, no chance. FlOps couldn't even buy our used 31's.
 
Can't give those 31's away these days. Way to small inside compaired to a Beechjet or a Premier. Are they still making new 31's? YO CLAP how ya been? 2400 pilots by 2005? A merger must be in the works. Now my new # does not sound so bad! That date of hire thing was lots better than the other options i think. Putting the TA guys at the end of the list would have been really bad though.
Later!
 
Last edited:
LR31 shares, though out of production, are still pretty popular. I'd put them up against anything in the class anyday.
 
LR31 shares, though out of production, are still pretty popular. I'd put them up against anything in the class anyday.
Click to expand...

How so? That is a pretty broad statement. I don't believe the 31A is the top airplane in it's class. For one thing, as was already stated, the BE400A has quite the cabin for it's class. I'm not trying to pick a fight, that was just a pretty broad statement.
 
Ok, Lear 31 wins for the engines and climb rate. Cruse is not much off from a beechjet. Fun jet for the pilots flying it, if your not to big/tall. I'f i was riding in the back, it would be a beechjet no questions asked. That 31 tube is way small. Wonder what a beechjet would look like with those big engines?
 
oh come on, just LOOK at a Beechjet next to a 31!

;)
 
The beechjet has it's warts. How many jet aircraft have a fuel bladder inside the presure vessel? The deice/anti-ice systems are not up to par. It is under powered.

I will give you the cabin comfort. In the end, the seat in back is what sells airplanes.
 
31A

Big problem with the 31A in the frax world is baggage and the forward lav. Does look great on the ramp though.
 
Citation Xs

No flame bait!

Just looking for facts. It is november 8, and I was told that the Citation X deal fell through. Any FO pilots know the facts?

Thanks,
Slim
 
2 Things:

First, if KR did buy FX I don't think FO would be bigger than NJA - Maybe larger than the US division but still much smaller than the NJA operation (430+ airplanes world-wide).

Second, what’s the story on the X's with FO? I haven't followed the issue at all; on the road I heard they weren't going to be flown by FO pilots but contract.

Just curious?

Fly safe
 
Flops X's

I believe they will be flown by contract pilots until the shares are sold, then Flops pilots will take over. Going to be interesting to see how they back-up the aircraft with only 5 in the fleet.
 
We started flying for F/O on the 1st of Nov (I happen to be one of the contract X pilots), and we've all been flying our butts off. Even as we started to fly Options trips, there were still some details to be hammered out, but as far as I can tell the deal is still on. Just got word from management yesturday that we are going to phase in the Options uniforms so that was one more hint that things are a go. It's true that making the program work with just five X's would be tricky since the plane can be a hanger queen at times, but word on the street is Options is looking at other tens on the used market. I'm confident that the program will be a success, the pax we've flown seem to be excited about it, but what the future holds for us contract X pilots is still a mystery to us.
 
Contract Pilots

I am not sure what the contract pilots will do but I am sure Flight Options will offer them employment once we have transitioned our existing pilots into the X's. For the sake of senoirity I am sure the X pilots will be offered jobs at the bottom of the list. I can't imagine it any other way. It is understood that we can't simply send guys to X school and throw them into the aircraft without any experience, so once that experience is aquired with a little flight time, etc. I am sure they will upgrade to Cpt (400 hours?) and then the contract pilots would be phased out. No one gets hired at FO other then at the bottom of the list and I am sure this will be no exception. We are all excited about the X program and look forward to the opportunity to fly them.

Just my 2 cents...
 
Contract pilots

It's true that Options hires only into the bottom of the list. We have however seen them place guys higher on the list without regard to seniority. A look at the list and aircraft being flown will show the discrepancy. I only hope Kenn does the right thing this time. Lately I am starting to question his thought process.
 
I agree

Well HawkCapt I would have to agree with you, lately FO has been doing some very strange things. I also would hope that FO do the right thing and place any "new" pilot at the bottom of the list and in a light jet for fairness. Only time will tell....
 
JP Morgan Report

Dated 11/11/02 - I think this says it all:

Neutral-rated Raytheon's 10-Q confirmed financing problems with Flight Options. Consistent with the note we wrote dated
10/28/02 on the fractional jet business, Raytheon's 10-Q disclosed that its Flight Options joint venture is experiencing delays in
obtaining outside equity financing. We believe this speaks to the deteriorating appeal of the fractional business, and also
presents Raytheon with another issue it needs to address. Raytheon currently has $83 million in exposure to the Flight Options
JV, largely in the form of debt owed to it by Flight Options.
 
Once again

Here we go again!!!

Dont listen to AIN. Even after having the Editor of AIN come on this board to defend himself they are still wrong. NJA has not slowed taking deliveries of aircraft. If anything NJA was hoping to receive them quicker. NEVER EVER listen to AIN!!!!! no matter what they say. They are on the verge of being considered a tabloid for the aviation industry.
 
Financing

Right now finding money for aviation ventures is not very easy. That is not reflective of Flight Options as much as the over all situation in our economy.

It is even tougher for someone in the airline business.

Obviously fractional sales will level off at some point. The growth has been amazing. The net effect on the used aircraft business, the effect on corporate flight departments, and other factors are yet to be determined.
 
Raising the capital had nothing to do with Raytheons desire to, or not to, sell. My understanding is it was to fund ongoing operations.
 

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