Is Flight Options Close to Bankruptcy?

[Lrjet55]

Well, since I value your opinion so much I will make sure that I never get comfortable at my job. Furthermore I will make sure that the day I lose my job i personally contact you first so that you, of all people, will have the grandiose oportunity to say those 4 choice words, I Told You So. I am currently staring at my computer screen awaiting your approval.

Listen Junior, people on this forum may have it out for your company, others may simply be stirring the pot and most, unfortunately, just dont have a clue. From an industry perspective this Ricci guy, who is running FLOPS, has a reputation and character perception of someone to, say, not be trusted. If FLOPS suddenly starts delaying or even cancelling orders for airplanes it is only natural that the naysayers will come out of the wood work to voice their opinion. If you would have read some of the prior messages I posted, never did I wish ill will or criticize the pilots at your company. I conveyed my opinion regarding Ricci and nothing further. I happen to have several friends at FLOPS and I wish them nothing but the best.
Next, with regards to NetJets, people are less quick to second guess our descisions about ordering or cancelling aircaft orders. Again this could, in part, be due to the industry image we hold. My saying "I love uncle Warren" was in no way a derrogatory comment towards FLOPS nor some miss guided Freudian slip.
Finally, whether people want to believe it or not the competition between the two companies is healthy. People are obviously going to weigh in either way with their opinion. I am happy people do so.
To sum up my commnet, NO you did not touch a "nerve" and no I did not resort to name calling. "Sally" unfortunately does not fall into what I would catagorize as name calling. I have several others if you would like try them out! I cant believe I just spend 5 good minutes dignifiying a response... its a sad, sad state of affairs in my life.

 

[LR45JI]

Deep 676,

I was refering to August 12/13, 2001 when Midway filled for Chapter 11 protection and laid-off 700 employees overnight - before 9/11.

Midway ceased operations in Sept. 12th

 

[fracman]

DRVSM

Any idea how FO is planning to upgrade their fleet to meet this requirement? Huge issue, especially for the used programs.

 

[Jetz]

Question

To borrow a question from another thread here on the lovely fractionals board...do y'all think that the accidents and lawsuits brought forth therewith have anything to do with Flight Options bad financial situation?

 

[sweptwingz]

Come on, can't we all just get along?

I am amazed at the genuine glee that some of the pilots here seem to have
when another fractional company seems to have (rumors only) some sort of
financial troubles.
I want ALL of the fractionals to thrive. Why? Simple economics. As long as
pilots are gainfully employed, salaries trend UPWARD. When hiring stagnates,
or the market is pilot glutted (like now) salaries tend to stabilize, or trend downward.
I believe that there is plenty of pie out there...enough to give every fractional
company and their pilots a large slice. So instead to cackling with joy that your
rival may be hitting hard times, perhaps a word of encouragement might be
in order. And remember....the only SURE thing in aviation is that your current
career position in NOT guaranteed.

 

[Cliff]

See how much you like "Unlce Warren" when he dumps you guys to the way side. When he can't write it off as a loss anymore. Don't think that he's not either. Why would any buddy keep a company that isn't profitable? Sound like non-sense. Don't think they way too much.

Again nobody cares to chime in why they are so worried about us at Options.

Hey Pistol! Do you mind if I call you Pistol??? Anyway Pistol, Uncle Warren just paid for 112 airplanes in MCO at the NBAA.. That's paid for as in wrote the check.. for 50 g150's with options for 50 and 12 X's... By the way FLOPS is in my prayers...

 

[Disco]

"That's paid for as in wrote the check.. for 50 g150's with options for 50 and 12 X's... "

Did Unc Warren "pay" for them with a big check that was 6 feet wide? Was Ed McMan by his side? Did you know you can't take one of those big checks to the bank and cash it? If Warren is such a smart business man why would he pay cash when placing on order for aircraft options - not firm orders - and why would he pay for airplanes that are not delivered yet?

 

[boxcar]

"If Warren is such a smart business man why would he pay cash when placing on order for aircraft options - not firm orders - and why would he pay for airplanes that are not delivered yet?"


Maybe because he's smarter than you.

 

[fracman]

No one in this business pays cash for orders. Standard practice is a minimal deposit followed by progress paymants as delivery nears.

 

[boxcar]

It's not a matter of MAKING Netjets pay up front. The manufacturers need money now just like most other corporations. Uncle Warren has tons of money and is always looking for ways to invest. He subsidizes the manufacturers and will later get his money back (with interest) in the form of deep discounts on the aircraft purchased. Bottom line is Cessna, etc. avoids debt on it's balance sheet and WB avoids taxable income.

P.S. WB doesn't care much about how it's always done.

 

[fracman]

Ever hesrd of a "Most Favored Nations" agreement? I know the Cessna system pretty well when it comes to the frax business.

 

[Lrjet55]

Make all the jokes, cracks and wize comments you want. There is a reason WB bought into NetJets and there is certainly a reason why WB is one of the richest, most succesfull men in the world. Personally it makes me sleep a little better knowing that he is part of my company.

 

[fracman]

How did this thread get so off topic - I thought we were talking about FLOPS??

I don't think anyone is implying that Buffett/NJ is in any type of financial difficulty, certainly not me.

 

[mike]

I find this subject of interest. My company is having trouble collecting charter fees from Flight Options, LLC. The problem began early this year when the standard 30 day pay became a 60 day pay. Today I called about past due bills. I was promised a check this week, but Christine told me that Flight Options was unable to send out any checks this week, and that they would not promise any payments until November 6th.

 

[hawkercpt]

HORSECRAP!!

If it's true then add your name to the list of lawsuits whiner!

 

[mike]

Hey Hawker Captian, I am not crying in my beer. Just sharing an experience. That is why I found this topic of interest.

 

[hawkercpt]

give me more information

so I can look into this more. As an employee I'm interested in finding out if this is true. I may be able to find out more for all of us.

 

[mike]

I can give Hawker Captian some information. The person at Flight Options is Christine and she works in the accounts payable department. You can ask her if the Company is behind in it's obligations. At the end of the day there is not much an employee can do about this situation.

Some of you that feel the current economic times dictate this type of fiscal management. I will disagree. Many companies have been forced to lay off good employees and forego improvements to meet our financial obligations. The slow down started in 2000, and I fear it will be with us for a few more years.

Good luck.

 

[fracman]

Trying to raise money

It's no secret FO is trying to raise $100 million in additional capital from "a major Wall Street firm". If they didn't need the money, I doubt they would go the the trouble to bring in an additional investor and dilute the existing shareholders equity.

Big question is - what if they don't raise the money, will Raytheon step in with additional funding? Rumor around Wichita is this is happening already.

 

[Answerguy]

I was in CGF last week, the word around is that they want to replace the challengers with G4's. Takes major money to do things like this. 100 million does not go very far in the aircraft world these days. I've been hearing ever sense I've been flying for Flight Options about money problems. But I have not seen money problems. We have gotten pay raises, new aircraft's, G4's, Citation X's, seen a very successful merger with TA, and 4 maintenance bases go up, major$$ i'm sure to put these things together. They are even repainting all the TA birds with Options colors. I think a hawker costs 30,000 to paint, so if they were having money problems the last thing the would be doing is repainting airplanes. Think about it!

Hearing is nonsence, seeing is everything!