Is Flight Options Close to Bankruptcy?

[RJL]

Is the stuff written in the post below true? I was looking at some other fractional online boards and saw this about Flight Options- Just when I am getting close, the bad news always rolls in... I heard some stuff about bills not being paid and some FBO's holding Flight Options aircraft for non-payment- Is this a common thing?

COPIED FROM ANOTHER BOARD

A Nervous Employee - Some Honesty Needed from Kenn
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
There needs to be some honesty on Kenn's weekly calls-
We all know about the immense money problems we are having. Shares aren't being sold, our vendors are getting very angry, people are cutting us off for non-payment, and our customers are starting to notice- this company is in real trouble.

A sales guy told me that our sales numbers are getting worse every month. This is a bad situation that is getting very scary. How are we going to get an investor to help us out? Kenn needs to stop comparing us to our competitors and start fixing what's broken at home. Be honest, we will understand. We have been through this before.

I want to work for a stable, honest company. Not one that tries to buy pilot's dedication and silence for a lousy $25 gift card. That's just ridiculous. Come on- tell us what's going on. Are we about to go bankrupt? I hear it every day from too many people a lot smarter than me.

I heard today that Kenn has been asking for special deals and favors from vendors that we owe a ton of $ to. How far behind are we? The economy is getting worse - Customers are telling me that they need to fly less and save $$$ themselves. A few have said they want to sell and get out, but can't afford the huge loss due to the bad jet market right now. - There is no way we will be able to afford the Premier 1's next year. How is that going to happen? How can we even afford the Citation X's, not to mention the training and maintenance, etc. Please, let us know.

 

[GooseHZ]

Merlin????????



This comes up every month or two....from what i heard is that we have a big invester out of NY. Dont take what you read on union board from merlin as anything but BS.

Fly safe.....

 

[RJL]

Thanks- That will help me sleep a little better. I hope to be on the short list for Flight Options.

 

[fracman]

Reality is all fractionals are losing money in this economy, even the mighty Netjets. At the end of the day, those with the deepest pockets will be the ones to survive, and those short on capital will fade away.

I personally don't know Flight Options financial status, but for the sake of all those employed there I hope Kenn is being honest about the funding.

 

[Apeman]

I have been at OPT for 2 and change. It's true that these rumours come around every now and then. When people post this stuff about us on other boards, never has any factual information been shown by the people alleging this information. As far as scared owners--a couple of tours ago , I was able to talk with the owner for quite sometime. He told me that he can sell his share of the BJ for more than what he bought it for 2 years ago. He also got his friend into one of our F-50s, and is ready to move into the Cit 3, or a HS-125 shortly, while retaining his BJ share. In my opinion, there are a few gutless slugs who like to stir up the rumour network on a monthly basis. They have a case of the brown-hole against everybody! Let them say what they want, cause it will get them to shut up faster (for awhile). If we owe vendors money, let's get all the facts b4 we decide that the world is ending. There are many possibilities as to why a bill is not paid ontime.

Tailwinds!

 

[flexlrpilot357]

"Reality is all fractionals are losing money in this economy, even the mighty Netjets. "

Actually, Flexjet is operating at a net gain. That's not to say that business and sales have never been better, but we are performing well.

 

[Lrjet55]

Just spoke with some of our sales folks at a static the other day and we have waiting list for several aircraft programs. NetJets is doing just fine.

I want to see this industry strive to levels none of us ever imagined but Flight Options management is going to detract from that. All the pilots I have ever met from Flight Option have been great, the only problem with that company is the owners(of the company, not A/C) and management. If thsi Ricci guy would take his head out of his A-- and try to make his company better instead of trying to point out the faults of every other fractional company he would have much more succes. Just my opinion.

 

[fracman]

Very good point - Kenn's definately not making any friends in the industry.

 

[IronManNDFW]

Hummm...

Yes, this does come about every few months. Yet, it is also true, and no big secret that FO is in financial trouble.

FO has been started in 23 different states, the latest is Ohio.

About 2 years ago before the merger FO wasn't even sure they would make payroll. Many companies had them opn a cash only basis. Of course you will read that it never happened, or didn't happen here. Yes, it did, but Corporate hides things very well.

Is this the same investors in NY that invest every time FO needs money? New blood? Hard to believe in this economey. Wait until you learn it is none other than RTS of NetJets! You think you have seniority issues now.

Ask around about a true count of how many XRTA pilots you still have? As of last count there were 108 out of almost 500 XRTA pilots "no longer with the company." Why do they still show up on the "revised" pilot seniority roster?

Why does maintenance pincle whip the books on "jobs performed?" Is it becaus ethye get a bonus for an aircraft being up? The answer is yes, they do get a bonus for aircraft returning to servce quickly.

To answer your question - At least 1 Falcon 50 in teh LA area is being held for non-payment. Raytheon Aircraft Services (RAS) has put FO on notice and will not extend additional credit.

As one poster stated, Kenn shuld stop bragging about how FO is #2 or that they are gaining on EJA, and fix what is broken.

Yea, the $25 gift card is a joke along with the proposed $40.00 for a cell phone that we will have to provide. Let's not forget that the extra 40 will be listed as income an dyou will get the taxes taken out of that amount.

And what happened to the big pay raise?

not Merlin, but not stupid either.

 

[learflyer]

hey ironman, obviously, you don't work for options. First of all, that 40.00 dollar voucher for the cell phone isn't going to happen. we are all keeping our calling cards. Second of all, none of those "ex rta guys" who were let go are still on the seniority list. Yes, the mx dept. does have an incentive program, but safety is not compromised. Late

 

[IronManNDFW]

Wrong Oh Buck Oh

I will admit to not having visited the site in a few weeks. The last I saw the seniority upated was 8-02, and it still had XRAT pilots who are gone on the list. I suspect that some are still on the list.

Hadn't gotten the news yet about the $40.00, thanks for the update Kenn. Of course I haven't called in for the lastest "message" either.

Glad to know that we won't be making the same mistake Flex did with the cell phones. Hey when your right you're right, I'll admit it.

Safety is not compromised? Can you read a MEL? Some of the birds I would even let Cartman into, for fear it would fall down around his fat a$$. Now they are not all in that bad of shape, but you know as well as I do (if you work for FO) that things are always "getting through the cracks" in the maint. dept.

Now about the Falcon???

 

[Dep676]

IronmanDFW

If you do work at Options, why? You obviously don't like it there. I don't think they are making you stay. Again if you actually work there. Are you one of the ExRTA guys that left or were terminated? There are plenty of other guys just waiting to take your spot. As far as the senority list it was updated 9-27. So look again and see if the guys you say are still there.

No job is perfect. Every company in aviation is always in the hole. That is just how this industry works. Just look at the airlines. They never make any money.

Again if you are that unhappy leave. No buddy is forcing you to stay.

You say that FO has started in 23 different states. Where did you get that info from? The only place I have ever seen an address for Options is Cleveland.

Don't let the door hit you in the a$$ on the way out.

 

[X/2000 driver]

If FO is in such bad shape, then why are the buying Cit. X's?

 

[IronManNDFW]

"Stupid is as Stupid Does"

Dep676 good-looking Glock Auto. I perfer a Ruger or Sig myself. Is that your favorite play toy or pacifier?

FYI - I do work for Opts, LLC. Obviously you don't by the look of things. I didn't every say that I did or didn't like it at FO. I said that I wasn't stupid. Thanks for trying to put words in my mouth.

As I stated above I haven't looked at the seniority list in a while. How is it that you know what the numbers are? Do you have access or do you work for FO?

You are right - Airlines don't make money, except Southwest. Most companies have problems. So how is it that they always loose money but stay in business year after year?

How is it that if a company has problems you want them to stick their head in the sand? Have you heard of the Tylenol approach? Yep, when the tampering was going on with Tylenol, the manufacturer PUBLICLY said they were pulling it off the shelves (even in places that haven’t had a case of tampering) until the issue was resolved. They admitted there was an issue, publicly announced it, took corrective action and has been a case study in colleges and universities ever since (as to what or how to do the right thing).

My original response was to the original post about FO being in financial trouble. As you state aviation companies by nature are financially unstable.

So why do you want to be a pilot?

BTW what type of kerosene does a BE-10 burn anyway? J

 

[xrated]

Hey X/2000 driver, don't worry about it. When you start flying for Flight Options you'll be eating all the curry you can handle, so what if its in a King Air.......hey, you have King Air time don't you? Got that going for you!

 

[fracman]

"If FO is in such bad shape, then why are the buying Cit. X's?"

I hear Swift will continue to own and operate the X's until they are sold to the share owners - technically FO is not buying the X's, just selling them.

 

[Dep676]

Well Ironman I do work for Options. You never answered the question about Options being in 23 different states. Are you an Options original or Ex-RTA?

Maybe I did put words in your mouth about being unhappy. I didn't mean too. From your posts though. It would appear that you aren't very happy about being there. That is just my thought. I guess if liked the place were I worked I wouldn't be posting stuff like that. If you are really unhappy nobody is forcing you to stay.

As far as a BE-10, it burn the same kerosene as any other turbine.

 

[IronManNDFW]

23 States

This information is accessible to anyone. Take the time to lookup (run a National Comprehensive Report) on the company and the leadership on an Internet database. You will learn a lot about the people whom we work for. Ok, you will actually have to spend money for this type of a search.

It has actually been 26 states not 23. Some of the 26 are: IN, OH, KY, NV, IA, CA, TX.

Corporate Wings the Parent of Flight Options was originally started in the State of Texas 5/30/1985. The company filed a PIR (Public Information Record (before an IPO)) on 5/19/1990 with no revisions. The state of Texas Rejected the filing due to TAX/Accounting problems.

The company filed again on 5/17/1993 with revisions. On 2/15/1994 the Secretary of State of Texas DISSOLVED the company due to TAX forfeiture.

12/4/1996 the State of Nevada closed the company for Illegal Activities! Imagine that Nevada closing a company for illegal activities. Nevada??? Oh now how bad was it?

States filed in range from California to Ohio. The companies have been closed or moved for various reasons.

Public record shows on 10/7/1992 there was an Action filed by the state of Ohio against Corporate Wings, Inc. A Partial release and amendment was filed on 8/25/1993, with the termination of the issue on 5/31/1995.

The 2 at the helm of the company have played this scheme in many states. Some of the states shut them down; some have allowed them to move on to other states.
Ohio is just the latest.

Again this is to help you make a better informed decision. Don't believe me. Do your own search, do your own investigation, read the report with a open mind, but be mindful of what is in the report.

Yes they (CW, FO ) have had money problems in the past, and it appears they still do. I will, like many ride this one as long as it lasts. Then on to the next gig..

This does not mean that I don't have a back up plan or company to fly for.

For those nay Sayers that say then "go and don't let the door hit, yada, yada." Better people than you have told me this non sence.

Do your own independent investigation, make your own decision.

Heard of many planes, not a BE-10. Is that a KA 100?

 

[Dep676]

Yes BE-10 is a KA 100.

Thanks for info. Just have to wait and see if anything will happen.

 

[RJL]

I met a guy last week that told me Flight Options is starting to take back (or is it buy back) more aircraft fractions than it's sellling- Is that true? He said that sales really stink right now. I know times are hard for everyone, but it was a surprise for me that so many people were looking to get out of doing business with Flight Options.

My heart goes out to those pilots- I've been there. I hope things get better fast!