Interesting scope article

[JOPILOT]

I made the choice to leave the "well" paying CRJ Cpt. job in my mid thirties and took a $47,000 dollar pay cut the first year. I took the gamble and yes a possible 18 year upgrade, because life at a regional provides for a loss of income every year vs. cost of living!
Lifers at a regional carrier suffer more every year, so the airline can make large profits off the backs of their pilots making sub-standard wages. Say what you please but, there will never be another CRJ200 purchased for Delta Connection flying, regional fleets will continue to shrink as scope becomes less flexible and more consequential with flow downs and weight restrictions. Also, the Majors pilot group continues to grow with X-commuters that are disciplined to maintain and improve scope for the mainline pilots, and thus the potential future of Regional pilot graduates. Those of you that are contemplating "settling" to stay at ASA, SkyWest, Comair etc start planning a future with less than you have now or prepare to make the jump, SCOPE is our primary focus as Delta prepares to make a staffing cut, Delta management knows this so don't plan on anymore jet orders with connection on the side. JP

 

[ualdriver]

So what would you propose as a WORKABLE solution?. I would think that a legacy carrier would be better off capturing 100 seat flying on their list at, for example, JetBlue rates, benefits and work rules rather than seeing a subcontractor take the work or just prohibiting the flying all together in the system and seeing the company get driven out of markets by competitors.

Lots of interesting stuff written above. I don't think a "farm team" approach will work, either. Pattern bargaining can work, but it has to make small leaps and not deviate too far from the mean IMO. I think many of us currently under contract negotiations understand that we're never going to see are old rates again, but if we pattern bargain off of Alaska, SWA, etc., we could have some success. But I agree if we got Contract 2000 rates tomorrow across the industry, there would just be another JetBlue, Virgin America, Allegiant, whoever, who would come in, massively undercut the going rate like what is happening now and back in the early 2000's, and we're all in the same boat all over again. I also agree with the point that we're screwed as long as we have an oversupply of pilots in the industry. That is really the core problem, and no union can fix that.

The solution for now, unfortunately, is to take a hard line stance and stop the bleeding and say enough is enough. We've already compromised and management has already gotten enough RJ's. Now if our management, for example, came to us and gave us the 190, for the NEW JetBlue rates, I think the problem would probably be solved. However, they don't want that. They want a Mesa/Republic/GoJet/anybody but us 20K/year F/O and 50K/year Captain flying those E190's, not "overpriced" mainline pilots. Further, they want to be able to whipsaw, which they won't be able to do with E190's on the property. This issue will probably be solved, one way or the other, with the contract we're currently negotiating but unfortunately for our management, that compromising is going to have to come from their side this time.

 

[JoeMerchant]

I made the choice to leave the "well" paying CRJ Cpt. job in my mid thirties and took a $47,000 dollar pay cut the first year. I took the gamble and yes a possible 18 year upgrade, because life at a regional provides for a loss of income every year vs. cost of living!
Lifers at a regional carrier suffer more every year, so the airline can make large profits off the backs of their pilots making sub-standard wages. on the side. JP

That may be true at some carriers...but that hasn't been the case at ASA...My income has outpaced the cost of living over the past 15 years with at least two payraises every year, and some years three payraises....How many mainline pilots can say the same thing over the past 15 years?

I make enough money to pay all my bills and live a good lifestyle with toys....What I desire most now is time off and choice of schedules...That's something I would lose if I made the "leap"....

 

[Lolikoka]

Good thread

This is one of the most intelligent threads on FI in a long time; with little to no name-calling and finger-pointing, I actually have hope that some pilots are starting to try to figure out this industry and fix it. It's probably too late for me given my age - I can't support my lifestyle and pay for the kid's college with the paycut at a major if/when they start hiring again, but maybe there is hope for the future.

I grew up in an airline family and saw the glory days - I doubt it will go back to that, but it's got to be better than it is today.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

I made the choice to leave the "well" paying CRJ Cpt. job in my mid thirties and took a $47,000 dollar pay cut the first year. I took the gamble and yes a possible 18 year upgrade, because life at a regional provides for a loss of income every year vs. cost of living!
Lifers at a regional carrier suffer more every year, so the airline can make large profits off the backs of their pilots making sub-standard wages. Say what you please but, there will never be another CRJ200 purchased for Delta Connection flying, regional fleets will continue to shrink as scope becomes less flexible and more consequential with flow downs and weight restrictions. Also, the Majors pilot group continues to grow with X-commuters that are disciplined to maintain and improve scope for the mainline pilots, and thus the potential future of Regional pilot graduates. Those of you that are contemplating "settling" to stay at ASA, SkyWest, Comair etc start planning a future with less than you have now or prepare to make the jump, SCOPE is our primary focus as Delta prepares to make a staffing cut, Delta management knows this so don't plan on anymore jet orders with connection on the side. JP

Very well said. This accurately describes what I've seen from my peers with few exceptions.

 

[Scope out RJ's]

That may be true at some carriers...but that hasn't been the case at ASA...My income has outpaced the cost of living over the past 15 years with at least two payraises every year, and some years three payraises....

And yet you still sued and tried to steal someone elses job!

How many mainline pilots can say the same thing over the past 15 years?

Keep telling yourself that's the reason why you're stuck at ASA. We all know the real reason you and the rest of the rjdc girls are stuck where you are!

I make enough money to pay all my bills and live a good lifestyle with toys....

Quite frankly what you and Lynn do with your lousy paycheck is quite---->uke:

What I desire most now is time off and choice of schedules...That's something I would lose if I made the "leap"....

Le'ts not forget, try another lawsuit to sue for another pilots job that he/she earned. Something you losers would know NOTHING about!