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I'm SOOOOOO Proud!

AA717driver

A simpler time...
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Both the NW FA's and ALPA (whoda' thought?) refused to cross the AMFA picket line.

The next time someone laments the weakness of our "profession", I'm gonna resist the urge to come across the table after them and, instead, remind them of this 'shining moment' in labor history.

Good luck, NW folks, you just voted for your next concessionary contract.

I'm actually glad I got laid off and took a $30k/yr. pay cut. Not belonging to a worthless union is worth every penny!TC
 

English

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What happened? What did I miss?

Linky?
 

Andy

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Easy trigger. There's more than one way to skin a cat.
Let's hope that most NWA pilots and FAs will find a LOT of discrepencies on their aircraft ... enough to keep the lowlife scabs busy for a very long time. Long enough to delay/cancel a lot of flights.

For those of us at UAL (OK, I've been furloughed for longer than I worked for UAL), the 'summer of love' demonstrated Ghandi-like passive resistance very well.

This is truly a landmark battle for all unions. All the best to my brothers and sisters at NWA.
 
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AA717driver said:
Both the NW FA's and ALPA (whoda' thought?) refused to cross the AMFA picket line.
Are you saying the FA's and Pilots are honoring the AMFA picketline and refusing to work? Where did you find this out?
 

rightrudder

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VampyreGTX said:
Everywhere I look I see mentions of the pilots and FA's stating they will cross the lines and work. Do you have a link to back up the comments you made?
You all fail to notice the sarcasm in the original post. The original poster is pointing out the hypocrisy of the NW pilots and FA's in crossing the picket line.
 

FN FAL

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rightrudder said:
You all fail to notice the sarcasm in the original post. The original poster is pointing out the hypocrisy of the NW pilots and FA's in crossing the picket line.
oh brother...if the mx strike is legal, how can the pilots and flight attendants cross? I'm not trying to be a smart ass here, but to me, the crossing appears to be the begining of the end.
 

TonyC

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FN FAL said:
oh brother...if the mx strike is legal, how can the pilots and flight attendants cross? I'm not trying to be a smart ass here, but to me, the crossing appears to be the begining of the end.
A strike is not something that a bunch of folks just up and decide to do. A legal strike is sanctioned by the NMB, according to the RLA.

Well, I take that back. We could just up and do it, but it wouldn't be legal, and it would likely result in us getting fired. So, I guess you really do have a choice; you can work or get fired.

NWA AMFA has been released by the NMB to self-help. There are a number of avenues they can persue, and a withholding of services is one. Since it's condoned by the NMB, the company can't fire them just for striking.


Some Collective Bargaining Agreements (contracts) allow workers to engage in sympathy strikes. Some do not. I don't know what the NWA ALPA contract allows. If a sympathy strike is allowed, those who engage in it are afforded the same protections as the unit on strike. If it isn't, well, again, you work or get fired.

If a sympathy strike is not allowed, then those employees are essentially being forced to continue working. As you might imagine, those employees that are being forced to work during such an event won't be the happiest or most productive employees the company has ever had.


Can the Union member Police officer provide security at the airport on the other side of the picket line? Yes. Can the union member firefighter fight a fire on the ramp on the other side of the picket line? Yes. Can a retired American mechanic perform maintenance on a NWA airplane on the other side of the picket line? NO, that's struck work, and that would make him a scab.



.
 

FoxHunter

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TonyC said:
A strike is not something that a bunch of folks just up and decide to do. A legal strike is sanctioned by the NMB, according to the RLA.

Well, I take that back. We could just up and do it, but it wouldn't be legal, and it would likely result in us getting fired. So, I guess you really do have a choice; you can work or get fired.

NWA AMFA has been released by the NMB to self-help. There are a number of avenues they can persue, and a withholding of services is one. Since it's condoned by the NMB, the company can't fire them just for striking.


Some Collective Bargaining Agreements (contracts) allow workers to engage in sympathy strikes. Some do not. I don't know what the NWA ALPA contract allows. If a sympathy strike is allowed, those who engage in it are afforded the same protections as the unit on strike. If it isn't, well, again, you work or get fired.

If a sympathy strike is not allowed, then those employees are essentially being forced to continue working. As you might imagine, those employees that are being forced to work during such an event won't be the happiest or most productive employees the company has ever had.


Can the Union member Police officer provide security at the airport on the other side of the picket line? Yes. Can the union member firefighter fight a fire on the ramp on the other side of the picket line? Yes. Can a retired American mechanic perform maintenance on a NWA airplane on the other side of the picket line? NO, that's struck work, and that would make him a scab.



.
Are you saying that if in the future ALPA at FedEx strikes and FedEx contracts with Polar, Atlas, Gemini or others that they would not be considered Scabs according to your definition?

Was the ALPA strike in support of the IAM legal at EAL? Just trying to learn.:(
 

anjinoo7

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Yeah, good job with the strike and all the support. All the employees can now maintain their pride while searching for a new job. Congrats.
 

Lear70

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TonyC said:
A strike is not something that a bunch of folks just up and decide to do. A legal strike is sanctioned by the NMB, according to the RLA.

Well, I take that back. We could just up and do it, but it wouldn't be legal, and it would likely result in us getting fired. So, I guess you really do have a choice; you can work or get fired.
Incorrect.

BOTH the ALPA and PFAA contracts allow for a sympathy strike, but both units have decided AGAINST such an action, stating that "... it would not be in our best interests..."

The main issue here is that AMFA is not AFL-CIO and, as a result, they don't get any NATIONAL support from anyone except other AMFA groups.

The only people who would be "technically" considered "SCABS" would be other mechanics from other airlines (furloughed or not) who come to work, cross the picket lines, and turn wrenches on the aircraft.

Everyone else (pilots, F/A's, etc) are slaves to their short-sighted MEC's decision to work and have no choice.

Personally, I believe those employee groups with INTEGRITY and HONOR for the professional (as well as common sense to see their own future riding on this), should write up every single nut, bolt, rivet, light, seat cushion, WHATEVER is not EXACTLY to specs. Without their union's support, it's all they can do.
 

COpilot

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Like I said on the other thread;

Won't it be a great picture to see the Leader of the National Union crossing the MX picket line to go fly his big jet, on the cover of ALPA magazine.
 

COpilot

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FoxHunter said:
Are you saying that if in the future ALPA at FedEx strikes and FedEx contracts with Polar, Atlas, Gemini or others that they would not be considered Scabs according to your definition?

Was the ALPA strike in support of the IAM legal at EAL? Just trying to learn.:(
I agree! Where is the difference between these two?

At EAL you had Frank and management team tearing a airline apart, taking advantage of the employee groups. MX strikes and pilots honor. Pilots that flew are called scabs until the end of time.

Well it looks to me every NWA pilots that fly a jet today are no different. Where am I wrong on this?
 

Dodge

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You won't see Duane Baby flying anything. But back to the scab mechanics.....its about time we got a list of these losers. There is a rumor that a handful of Mesaba mechanics went to the NEW NWA.
 

Beaver_Liquors

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COpilot said:
I agree! Where is the difference between these two?

At EAL you had Frank and management team tearing a airline apart, taking advantage of the employee groups. MX strikes and pilots honor. Pilots that flew are called scabs until the end of time.

Well it looks to me every NWA pilots that fly a jet today are no different. Where am I wrong on this?
The difference is that the EAL MEC decided that they were going to sympathy strike which meant that no eastern airline pilots we going to fly.So any pilot that flew crossed thier own picket line. Last night, the NWA MEC decided that they were not going to sympathy strike, so the pilots have no picket line of their own. Thats the difference.

BL
 

doh

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FoxHunter said:
Are you saying that if in the future ALPA at FedEx strikes and FedEx contracts with Polar, Atlas, Gemini or others that they would not be considered Scabs according to your definition?

Was the ALPA strike in support of the IAM legal at EAL? Just trying to learn.:(
Hey Fox, it gets really complicated. When I was on strike, we got a guide from the MEC that was made in conjunction with ASA, ACA and Delta. It explained what struck work is and what to do if asked to perform it. It is impossible to memorize all the stuff, but rest assured, thosewho need to know the definition of struck work know! And woe be unto those who show up anyway!
 

TonyC

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Lear70 said:
Incorrect.

BOTH the ALPA and PFAA contracts allow for a sympathy strike, but both units have decided AGAINST such an action, stating that "... it would not be in our best interests..."
If both contracts allow for sympathy strikes, then what you have added is correct also. That doesn't make what I said incorrect. Absent such a Sympathy Strike provision, a group can't just up and strike.






Y'all are wasting your time responding to FoxHunter. He is not "just trying to learn." He is only here to stir the pot. He withdrew his membership from ALPA, stopped paying dues, lost his vote, and lost his voice.



.
 

AA717driver

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Thanks, Lear. Actually, I have encouraged an illegal strike. When Hank Duffy and the Exec Council failed to go ahead with the SOS in the 80's over drug testing and security for crews, the die was cast. I would have walked over that one.

The CBA's at UA and USAir today (and the forthcoming one at NW) are the inevitible result of the failure of labor to maintain cohesion over the past couple of decades. We are getting what we asked for.

ALPA National is run by a bunch of politically motivated ground hogs who are more afraid of airplanes than a class of "fearful flyers". At least the people in the class are trying to get in an airplane instead of desperately trying to avoid it.

Good luck NWA people. Remember, you can't fly an airplane if you writer's cramp. ;) TC
 

FoxHunter

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TonyC said:
If both contracts allow for sympathy strikes, then what you have added is correct also. That doesn't make what I said incorrect. Absent such a Sympathy Strike provision, a group can't just up and strike.






Y'all are wasting your time responding to FoxHunter. He is not "just trying to learn." He is only here to stir the pot. He withdrew his membership from ALPA, stopped paying dues, lost his vote, and lost his voice.



.
No Tony, I have not lost my voice. You have just no chosen to listen. You are one of the guys that spoke in favor of the FPA/ALPA merger. Your are correct that I opposed it. I had always stated that ALPA had become weak and inefffective. FedEx pilots were sold a Lemon.:(
 
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