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wingnutt said:good post SD...if youre ever in Dallas, i owe you a beer
P.S. 46, military is a whole other ball of wax, you know thats not what hes talking about...
Timebuilder said:How can I resist?
I had the money for PFT in spades, and due to the wisdom of some experienced pilots, I decided against it.
While some young people (to me that's under 40!!!) may not care a whit what I or anyone else thinks, there are some who will listen to reason, and still turn away from PFT.
Personally, I think that military aviators should only be required to have an MEL certificate, not hundreds of hours in a piston twin or a turboprop to qualify for a 121 job.
The helo guys should be given the opportunity for fixed wing transition training before they leave the service.
SDdriver said:Whirlwind,
When I say PFT is bad, I am meaning it has a negative result on the industry as a whole. That fact is proven! It does not have any positive effect on this industry, the only positive effect is on the individual.
That individual should remember that he is a part of this industry as a whole, so what he is doing for himself might be good (even though I can argure that it ultimatly is not), he is hurting the industry he is a part of by doing it.
As far as the kid that can buy his way past me could care less what I think. He might care when I am his Captain and I don't respect him for his methods of getting to that right seat.
15k could teach you the basics of flying that jet or King Air, it could also teach a monkey the basics. But is that 15k going to teach you the experience you need to handle real life problems in that aircraft? No, it will qualify you, but you won't be safe.
Hey here is a good one, Do you think a guy that just got his Multi is a SAFE multi-engine pilot?
How can you really relate anything from a 172 to a CRj? Sure maybe something as basic as turning or climbing, but other than that it is totaly different. He has nothing to fall back on.
Now imagine if I had never had one incedent in my life because really I only had 300- or 400 hrs.
My Co-Pilot was really shaken up, but he looked to me and said, I know you have had all kinds of things happen to you before, so I know I am going to be ok.
He felt safe because he knew I had experience to turn to, even though he didn't.
Now imagine same situation except in an Rj and the Captain is knocked unconcious, FO has 300hrs of flying 172s and such under training conditions bascically.
DO you think the PAXz are goign to be more trusting of their lives to the guy with 300hrs or the guy with 1500hrs and the differences in expereince of both. I hope you see my point.
My point is you start in 152s you then move to 182rgs then you move to Barons, then to King Airs, then to Saabs, then to Rjs. That is logical progression, throughout all of those small steps up, you gain a little biit more knowledge and skill, but you arn't exceeding your limitations.
Whirlwind said:I totally agree, and if my last posts implied otherwise, then I wasn't being clear.
wingnutt said:holy crap man, you spend all that time dissecting his posts, breaking down every little comment, and quite frankly saying very little, when you really said it all in the first line...
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Actually, I'm going to have to disagree with you here. I'm willing to bet that you could take my fixed-wing CFI who has 1,500 hours total time and 170 multi, spend $15K on her to train her to fly a King Air, and I'll bet she would be safe.
knowing your limits and respecting the airplane goes a long way.
Now that isn't fair, it all depends on each pilot's experience.
I've had a few experiences that would raise your blood pressure, and I didn't even have a co-pilot. I'm still here, but I used up some of that bag of luck to get here.
No problem, it's just a plane with wings and engines, just fly it.
Hell, I've never flown a jet, but I have confidence that I could land a CRJ in such a situation. It wouldn't be pretty and the plane might or might not be reuseable again, but we'd survive.
As the pilot, I don't really much give a damm what they think. No one on the ground can climb up and jump into the plane, so I'm what they've got to work with. They can all just sit down and shut up and let me fly.
So forever, for all time, everyone must start out in little puddle jumpers?
If someone wants to learn to fly in a Bonanza A-36, I'd be happy to teach them. Why not? Sure, it will take longer than in a 152, but if they've got the time and money...
SDdriver said:Ok,
Well lets see..
As far as the person not caring no matter what, well I can ASURE you that will catch up to him and kick him in the ass in full force sooner or later. You just can't go through life not giving a damm about anything, and you sure can't work in an industry this small and it not catch up with you.
She would be competent yes, safe maybe, but experienced not really.
I will say this though, 1500hrs and she would be a lot safer than a 300hr pilot. Remember we are talking about guys with 300 to 400hrs here, not people with 1500hrs.
She has probably seen a lot in her 1500hrs especially if she has been instucting that whole time. I would trust her a lot more than a 300hr guy that you trained in that King Air.
I hate to burst your bubble, but I use to think when I was a private pilot and even after I became a commercial pilot and had my multi, that I could land a jet if something happened to the pilot, having never flown one before.
Well when you ever fly a jet you tell me if you feel the same way.
Well flying paying Paxs you better care what they think, cause without them you don't have a job. Remember TWA? Once people lose faith and trust, it is over.
Sure you can get your private in a 737 if you have enough money. Do you think that is a logical thing to do though?
As long as I can remember in aviation, people have started out in trainers to learn the fundementals of flight, and to learn how to use those skills to fly an airplane.
You brought up some good questions. Thanks for engaging in the conversation, it is a learning expereince for us all.