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How to say no

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Gearmunky

Far Beyond Driven
Joined
Aug 5, 2004
Posts
195
OK guys/girls, I figured that this would be the best place to find an answer to this question considering we all do the same thing for a living.

I need to know how one says "No" in a proffesional manner without getting on the other guy's bad side or make him mad. I'd prefer not to go into details because of the thought of prying eyes, but this is really eating at me. I feel like I'm starting to get taken advantage of, and want it to end before it gets worse.

Any and all help will be greatly appreciated, Thanks.
 
Hey man, if she's movin' too fast tell her you want to wait until your married.
 
No. N - O

Though this probably doesn't apply to your situation, it did remind me of an old NFL film with the coach giving the newbies (uh...I mean rookies) a little piece of advice considering their new wealth in the NFL.

No means no!

Maybe means no!!

Yes means no in the morning!!!

Anyway...good luck with your situation.

2000Flyer
 
Come on Munky,

I only asked you to wash and wax my truck and car, rake up my yard, paint the fences and clean up after the dog.

It is what all gear bitc^es are expected to do for their Capt. LOL ;)
 
Hmmmm, (Medievel Judge Theodoric of York ponders the dilemma)

Nice way #1: Tell him at hotel at check-in that you bought him an all-day adult film selection on Spectravision right before you tell him "No, ain't nothing gonna happen with us".

Nice way #2: Tell him right before refueling FBO freebie redemption, he'll forgot immediately just like number 1.

Not nice way but profitable: You're in a Gulfstream, seek psyc help about harrasment issues, break down on video during sim ride about pressure, file lawsuit and then own your own Gulfstream, then hire me as a cabin boy so I can repeat the cycle.:D

Humor aside, good luck.
 
Please don't take this the wrong way, but unfortuneately it looks like you are pretty replaceable. No offense. I would imagine that someone hires an 800+ hour pilot to pull gear in a G4......as well as all of the other stuff that somebody with more experience would say no to. I hope you are not in one of those "single pilot" G4's where the Captain only wants gear up, flaps up, shut up.

I guess you can either sit it out and gain some more time and maybe a type rating, or you can put your foot down and risk having to find another job.

My suggestion to you is to sit down and simply talk to your employer. Ask him what exactly he expects of you both in and outside of the cockpit. If the answers to your questions are not acceptable to you, start looking for other employment.

I know, I know.........easier said than done. I wish you the best of luck.
 
Well with out really knowing what you are saying no to. There is only one way to say that I know of and that is NO!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can't think of any other way to say it.
 
seriously, if you aren't going to give us some details dont expect any useful advice other than to grow a set of balls and speak your mind.

what are you expecting here other than that?

:confused: .
 
Hey, I'll ask the obvious question...

The captain want's to bang you, right?

Well, no means no, and I'd tell him that then head over to HR if he persits. And I'd tell him that too.

Very simple.

No job on earth is worth your dignity.
 
Without knowing the situation, it makes it difficult to give good advice. But then again free advice is cheap.

One thing I have noticed on this board and others like it, is a certain negativity. Sometimes you have to say no without saying no. Saying no is easy. Saying we can't do it that way, but we can accomplish what you want this way, is much harder. It seems very few people can do that.

Pick your battles.
 
Given your experience level, I would expect that you were hired because you could easily be managed and/or manipulated. You might just find that saying no is a "bet your bar" type of decision. Which is to say, is it important enough to bet your job on? With your experience, unless you have an initial at SimuFlite or FS under your belt, you are extremely replaceable.

That being said, if safety is benig compromised, then look for a way to solve the safety problem without getting into a power struggle with the guy. I would bet that since he has hired someone with such low experience, that he has an ego problem and has a hard time hearing that he might be making bad decisions.

Your best bet with a safety issue would be to lead him to the solution so that it is "his idea". I have found this works very well with ego maniacs. Anyway, best of luck.
 
Thanks, but first of all my sweet virgin @ss is not in jeopardy (Sorry, I borrowed that from Half-Baked)

No more worries my friends, in the mean time I got in touch with an old friend of mine and we discussed it. I actually came out ahead on this one -pardon the pun:)

I just have a habit of letting things build up and get to the point of combustion, before I decide to act. I know that I'm not an effective communicator in that respect and when it comes time to really say "No" I'm about as mad as a queer with tonsilitis on Valentine's day. And end up with negative results.

As for the replaceable part, I do have all the proper training (FSI initial) and RVSM. I'll be taking the IP course on my next recurrent when I'm scheduled to be typed. This is all fine and dandy, but numbers are what I lack especially PIC, I have time where I acted as PIC, but with no type they're useless outside of the fact that I did it and gained experience. I've been thinking about towing banners or spraying to build PIC time on my days off, but I don't know if it's worth the risk just to become marketable. Otherwise, I'm pretty happy, but as we all know-no job is permanent.

So really how do you say no without ticking anyone off?
 
Last edited:
An open mode of communication, CONSTANTLY, will prevent these kind of situations in the future.

I can't imagine letting frustrations build to the point you write about. Safety depends on good CRM - the basis of which is good communications. You don't have to be adversarial, but you do need to express your thoughts and feelings.
 
Gearmunky said:
OK guys/girls, I figured that this would be the best place to find an answer to this question considering we all do the same thing for a living.

I need to know how one says "No" in a proffesional manner without getting on the other guy's bad side or make him mad. I'd prefer not to go into details because of the thought of prying eyes, but this is really eating at me. I feel like I'm starting to get taken advantage of, and want it to end before it gets worse.

Any and all help will be greatly appreciated, Thanks.
Click to expand...

Hmmm.....let's see here, 800 hrs TT, pullin' gear in a G4, and can't be specific about how to handle a sexual harassment problem.
Puleeeezzz, even in our time of EEOC enlightenment, did you think you were hired for your engine-out, single generator, circling approach to mins. at night, deft stick and rudder skills ?

Could be, that you and the Cpt. of Air-Force One have something in common.



Both......Bush pilots. :)
 
When you say you will be qual'd as IP, you don't mean instructor pilot, do you? I don't imagine that would come in handy anytime soon.

It is good if you get typed, but I am afraid your resume may look a little "top heavy" if you know what I mean. I highly recommend getting some time instructing or flying jumpers or banners. I know for a fact that people doing hiring (both HR homo's and pilots) like to see time as an instructor. It not only shows that you are willing to pay your dues, but also that you've learned a lot since your commercial ride.
 
Why are you telling this guy to go instruct when he's flying a Gulfstream?

Sit tight, do what you have to and you are golden.

Put your time in and take your abuse (unless if it's causing a safety issue). In a few years you will have perfect times and you'll find the perfect job.

All the "free" advice around here costs people in the long run.
 
Dinger said:
When you say you will be qual'd as IP, you don't mean instructor pilot, do you? I don't imagine that would come in handy anytime soon.

It is good if you get typed, but I am afraid your resume may look a little "top heavy" if you know what I mean. I highly recommend getting some time instructing or flying jumpers or banners. I know for a fact that people doing hiring (both HR homo's and pilots) like to see time as an instructor. It not only shows that you are willing to pay your dues, but also that you've learned a lot since your commercial ride.
Click to expand...

No, by IP I mean International Procedures so I can be of use when we go across the pond. As I'm sure you know I can't go over there without a type, so I have to wait for my next recurrent to get typed and take the course.

I went a different route than most people and got away without having to get my CFI, and on top of that I don't think that instructing is my cup of tea. There's no sense in spending the money becoming a CFI if I'm not going to put it to use.

Flying a cropduster or something like that is more of my thing, it's just risky. I've wanted to get my tailwheel for a long time and this would be a great way to build t-wheel time for my ultimate goal of a T-6 when the finances permit.
 
Lmao

cptsesso said:
Come on Munky,

I only asked you to wash and wax my truck and car, rake up my yard, paint the fences and clean up after the dog.

It is what all gear bitc^es are expected to do for their Capt. LOL ;)
Click to expand...


Man, am I really glad I didn't get that job now

So how is the New Blue Jew Canoe comin along, I heard it's a pretty nice ride it just needs some new clothes. I hope your enjoying your time off with that cute kid of yours:)
 
semperfido said:
is this an operational issue or a personal issue?
Click to expand...

It was a things that were getting out of hand when I'm not flying issue. It's not totally resolved yet, but a lot better.

I'll try and clear this up a little.

I relocated for this job, I showed up with my clothes, truck, and my fishing rods (gotta keep it real:) ) Anyway, I was being pressured to buy a house real quick and throw down all kinds of roots thinking that that will be some security on their part.

Well, that's the trap and I saw it coming. I had my initial before I came here, and they have yet to spend any money on me as far as training is concerned. I wasn't going to get all in debt, and become a slave to this job when they haven't spent any money yet to keep me, which of course is no real reason anyway. Where I'm at isn't exactly a busy corporate airport and if safety issues were a problem or something of that nature-things you won't find out in an interview- I could go back home and continue doing what I was doing flying contract and charter on everything I could get my paws on.

Well I just got approved to start flying one of our other airplanes (Lear) and build more time grabbing every flight I can in either one. The other guys like it because they will get more time off if I can fly both. More happy people, better flight department. This will also be better for me because it will be less time bored off my rear and less time getting caught in the office and if I want a few days off I just say the word. Were not that busy in the summer so I have to get it while the gettins good if you know what I mean.

Before this all happened I kept having to do more and more non-flying duties on my days off and I felt like I was becoming a flying office hand. I'm not in a "set for life" position just yet. I love this job, and were a really cool flight department, but things don't always last forever and until I get a few thousand hours, I have to keep moving forward at full throttle.
 
This thread is a waste of time. Gearmunky wants "help" with a "problem" - needs to know how to say "no" to something that he/she is unable to communicate about. After the usual round of both serious and stupid responses, relates in a nearly incoherent post he/she is has communications problems, "I know that I'm not an effective communicator in that respect and when it comes time to really say "No" I'm about as mad as a queer with tonsilitis on Valentine's day. And end up with negative results."

Give me a break! It is flamebait or just plain stupidity and everyone gets what they deserve, including the owner of the GIV that dies because he/she was too cheap to hire a real crew and have a professional flight department.

I have already wasted too much of my time on mindless drivel, bye, bye!
 
just keep doin what you are doin...don't buy a house...keep your options open...try to be diplomatic when it comes to the "office"- when you get pissed off- go do something else, like fishin, to get your mind off whatever it is. that's it :)
 
irapilot said:
This thread is a waste of time. Gearmunky wants "help" with a "problem" - needs to know how to say "no" to something that he/she is unable to communicate about. After the usual round of both serious and stupid responses, relates in a nearly incoherent post he/she is has communications problems, "I know that I'm not an effective communicator in that respect and when it comes time to really say "No" I'm about as mad as a queer with tonsilitis on Valentine's day. And end up with negative results."

Give me a break! It is flamebait or just plain stupidity and everyone gets what they deserve, including the owner of the GIV that dies because he/she was too cheap to hire a real crew and have a professional flight department.

I have already wasted too much of my time on mindless drivel, bye, bye!
Click to expand...

No thread is a waste of time!! Gearmunky felt the need to gather opinions... he doesnt need your negative a$$ attitude even though you yourself are entitled to post on here... what did Mom used to say?? If you can't say anything nice, don't say it at all!! Geesh!!
 
pa56pa - you are right, I am wrong - this unclear, rather inane thread has such value for all of us.

So sorry.
 
irapilot is miffed because he was passed over for the underquaified instead.

I agree with you on just about everything you said, friend. Calm down and change the channel if you don't like what is on. Hey, QVC has those anatomically correct porcelain dolls on again! Oooh! they come in negro now!

100-1/2
 

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