Homebasing? Anyone? Anyone?....Buehler???

[h25b]

How does your question differ from those commuting on their own time in the airline industry. What if you can't get a jumpseat and don't make it to your starting point on time?

I believe a lot of airline contracts have a "commuter policy" that protects pilots from action if they can prove they failed to make a certain number of flights to work...

 

[Seat 0A]

I believe a lot of airline contracts have a "commuter policy" that protects pilots from action if they can prove they failed to make a certain number of flights to work...

Could be. I wouldn't know since I never whored myself out that way.

Anyhow, this entire thread has boiled down to this:

If NJA is for you then you either:
a) Move all your sh*t to one of the 5 bases
b) Try the commute bit

Glad we could clear that up!

 

[imacdog]

Could be. I wouldn't know since I never whored myself out that way.

Oh give me a break. Last year NJ was paying its pilots nearly identical wages to some regionals. I went to a regional last year because they paid better than NJA, plus travel benefits and a commuter policy for commuting pilots. You guys are paid better now but it wasn't always like that. Amazing how you can forget how low your pay was just six months ago.

 

[be-400xpdriver]

Look, this I know a little about. I have a close friend here who is doing this successfully. He is waiting until the end of the last day to do this. Has not had any problems so far. Seems most of the tickets travel books are refundable.

As for the contract, I know the sections that I need to quite well. These sections do not affect me and if they ever do I know where to look.

The information/suggestion I gave initially regarding not having to move to work here is a viable option for some. I have met several folks on the road who didn't even know it was possible.

If you know so much about the contract why did you get it so wrong?

 

[Seat 0A]

If you know so much about the contract why did you get it so wrong?

Yeah, it would be that part I wrote about knowing the parts that affect me (such as 19 and 28). I don't know what the rules are on maternity leave either. Suppose I better get studying.

 

[h25b]

Yeah, it would be that part I wrote about knowing the parts that affect me. I don't know what the rules are on maternity leave either. Suppose I better get studying.

But the parts you jumped on here to speak about were the ones that you were screwing up. We weren't speaking about maternity leave...

 

[Seat 0A]

But the parts you jumped on here to speak about were the ones that you were screwing up. We weren't speaking about maternity leave...

Once again you have distorted things. I tried to give an alternative to moving. I blew the fly from home for training and the 30% rule, mostly because I am not affected.
The fact still remains that you do NOT have to move to a base. And once again since you have a short/selective memory, there are a lot of folks out there who are not aware of the options available.

Now the chances are that you are really an NJA pilot in hiding who is trying to get others to not come here (there is an effort by some to do this to try and force the company to suffer by lack of recruitment), but some folks would really just like to have the information.

 

[be-400xpdriver]

Yeah, it would be that part I wrote about knowing the parts that affect me. I don't know what the rules are on maternity leave either. Suppose I better get studying.

OK every thing you wrote about was wrong? I dont thing you got one thing right, ok maybe the addition but hey you can do that on a calculator.

So which part affects you?

 

[h25b]

The fact still remains that you do NOT have to move to a base. And once again since you have a short/selective memory, there are a lot of folks out there who are not aware of the options available.

Well for a guy like you making 6 figures it may seem like an option.. Seems pretty pathetic to me though. But hey, it's a small price to pay for the cool ties and unlimited Rudy's Catering. :erm: I used to have to eat that crap airborne when I was flying the Hawker on quick turns out to the west coast and back. I believe I'd rather use the per diem to get the heck out of First Aviation and over to the Sea Shack for some decent food rather that scraping it together for pay for a self funded fly-from-home deal that could get my arse fired.

Now the chances are that you are really an NJA pilot in hiding who is trying to get others to not come here (there is an effort by some to do this to try and force the company to suffer by lack of recruitment), but some folks would really just like to have the information.

I'm not, but if there are guys like that, God Bless them because they understand what a big screw up this issue was in the TA...

 

[Seat 0A]

Well for a guy like you making 6 figures it may seem like an option.. Seems pretty pathetic to me though. But hey, it's a small price to pay for the cool ties and unlimited Rudy's Catering. :erm: I used to have to eat that crap airborne when I was flying the Hawker on quick turns out to the west coast and back. I believe I'd rather use the per diem to get the heck out of First Aviation and over to the Sea Shack for some decent food rather that scraping it together for pay for a self funded fly-from-home deal that could get my arse fired.

Luckily we can CHOOSE to pay for our own food in those instances.
As for being fired, they generally keep the good ones so I can see why you would be concerned.
For the record, doing your own commuting is not the "illegal" covert op you are making it out to be. You get there the night before and just like anything else you may do in life someday you might not make it in time. You may drive to an interview someday and your car breaks down 10 miles away and you are just as screwed. Get over it.

 

[h25b]

As for being fired, they generally keep the good ones so I can see why you would be concerned.

Then how the hell did you slip by ???? I don't even work there, nor would ever imagine wanting to, but man, what's your secret? Especially since you're knowledge is worthless in terms of your own CBA...

be400XPdriver and I have pretty much proven that your employee funded, do-it-yourself, fly from home program is pretty much unworkable (or at least for those that aren't single or married to a "suga mama". Do have anything else you'd like to add ??

Have you ever seen what the on-time percentages are for the airline flights going in to the NYC metro area for a guy that would be based in TEB ??? Let alone the cost of the airline fares ? A quick look at the DOT statistics shows they all average in the low 60% range of on-time arrivals. Looks to me like I'd rather be doing a "covert op" than trying that game...

 

[be-400xpdriver]

be400XPdriver and I have pretty much proven that your employee funded, do-it-yourself, fly from home program is pretty much unworkable (or at least for those that aren't single or married to a "suga mama". Do have anything else you'd like to add ??

There where alot of guys that drove many hours or jump seated under the old "gateway" system. Example Helena to Centennial. Sheridan, WY to Centennial. I aslo think it was harder under the old system for first day shows before 91K. But it can be done. I think if you want the job bad enough then come on over. But now the facts before you come. But paying for your own airline ticket home each time will get costly.

 

[h25b]

There where alot of guys that drove many hours or jump seated under the old "gateway" system. Example Helena to Centennial. Sheridan, WY to Centennial. I aslo think it was harder under the old system for first day shows before 91K. But it can be done. I think if you want the job bad enough then come on over. But now the facts before you come. But paying for your own airline ticket home each time will get costly.

I know, I know.... I'll ease up on the poor guy now. It's time to go have the airplane pulled up to the line anyway.

 

[Fozzy]

It is one of the weak spots in the contract. No question. It sucks. I did the 4.5 hour commute for years. I feel for the commuters. My answer is that we were just tired of the fight.
Sorry. :erm:

 

[BengalsFan]

H2B2

I don't work for NetJets, but really want to... but then again I am willing to move to Dallas... anyways... you seem really against them. I am not going to ask you to divulge who exactly you work for, but can you tell us if it is airline, fractional, corporate, or other... just so we know where you are coming from. Thanks

And for the NetJets guys/gals... is this contract potentially a really good deal until it becomes ammendalbe (I assume in like 5 years or so)? Basically, do you think that you (hopefully WE) will be able to get this improved in the future (home basing, better pay, merge with NJI, etc), or is it already to good, and it will start going the other way?

Take care

 

[Guitar Guy]

One gets what one bargains for. The current contract made some big strides forward but obviously the CBA is not all things to all people. To quote our local's president, "it is what it is."

By the way, being a Bengals fan is an automatic disqualifier at NetJets! (Just kidding.)

 

[Ultra Grump]

Have you ever seen what the on-time percentages are for the airline flights going in to the NYC metro area for a guy that would be based in TEB ??? Let alone the cost of the airline fares ? A quick look at the DOT statistics shows they all average in the low 60% range of on-time arrivals. Looks to me like I'd rather be doing a "covert op" than trying that game...

On-time stats don't really apply. Completion stats would. If you're coming in the day before, it doesn't matter if the flight's late. It does matter if the flight is cancelled.

Seat 0A made several mistakes, but his point is still valid: it CAN be done. SHOULD new hires do it? That's something each person would have to decide for themselves.

You're overstating one point: you keep talking about the cost of raising a family in LAX or TEB vs first-year pay and the cost of commuting, but overlooking the fact that they'd be commuting from somewhere else with most likely a lower cost of living. Again, it can be done, if the new-hire wants to come here badly enough. I wouldn't recommend it, but that's just me.

 

[h25b]

You're overstating one point: you keep talking about the cost of raising a family in LAX or TEB vs first-year pay and the cost of commuting, but overlooking the fact that they'd be commuting from somewhere else with most likely a lower cost of living. Again, it can be done, if the new-hire wants to come here badly enough. I wouldn't recommend it, but that's just me.

Not overstating at all. I don't care where you're commuting from. If you've got a wife, kids, and mortgage the cost of buying those airline tickets would not be affordable. And there's no way on earth you could buy the year's worth of airline tickets plus hotel for $6500.

H2B2
I don't work for NetJets, but really want to... but then again I am willing to move to Dallas... anyways... you seem really against them. I am not going to ask you to divulge who exactly you work for, but can you tell us if it is airline, fractional, corporate, or other... just so we know where you are coming from. Thanks

To answer the other guy's question, I have nothing against the NetJets pilots at this point other than I feel like throwing the new hires under the bus by bargaining away fly from home was pretty low and it was the perfect opportunity for an aviation union to set a standard by looking out for the junior guys. I can also tell you that there are a lot of people out there that aren't going to forget that whole idea of trying to scab list 135 pilots. They probably could've have kept fly from home for everybody if they weren't so wrapped up in the whole NJI integration... That whole deal will only benefit a very few people at the top of the seniority list and fly from home for everyone takes care of the majority.

 

[Fozzy]

h25b,

Please give it a rest. I did it and so did many others. Mortgage, baby, stay at home Mom. And I commuted. No I did not buy plane tickets, but I did drive 300 miles each way and paid for hotel. That was about 4-5 grand a year.
It can be done. I was 38K first yr capt pay the first year and 39K second yr capt the second year. It is called a budget.

You have an axe to grind. My guess is you did one year at a Union shop and was pissed that you did not get the "big" pay from day one. Sorry, name one job you make great money year one. They call it "climbing the ladder" for a reason.
So please stop your crying. It can be done.

What dog do you have in this fight, other than Union bashing???????

BTW, cute kid.

 

[h25b]

h25b,

Please give it a rest. I did it and so did many others. Mortgage, baby, stay at home Mom. And I commuted. No I did not buy plane tickets, but I did drive 300 miles each way and paid for hotel. That was about 4-5 grand a year.
It can be done. I was 38K first yr capt pay the first year and 39K second yr capt the second year. It is called a budget.

You have an axe to grind. My guess is you did one year at a Union shop and was pissed that you did not get the "big" pay from day one. Sorry, name one job you make great money year one. They call it "climbing the ladder" for a reason.
So please stop your crying. It can be done.

What dog do you have in this fight, other than Union bashing???????

BTW, cute kid.

You've really got me all wrong, truely...

I have no axe to grind and believe me, paid my dues. I actually shoveled dog crap and mowed lawns to pay for my CFI ticket... :0 And hey, if a union is the way to go, GREAT... I think they have their place. It would just be nice to use their power to look out for the whole group, not just the top. And I'm not just speaking of your union, it's throughout the whole industry. By the time a person qualifies for a position at NetJets they've paid their dues and shouldn't have to scrape by and pay for their own commute. Especially if all the guys they're flying with don't have to. But hey, as long as a few guys get to fly a Gulfstream screw 'em... That might not be your attitude, but that's how it would seem if I were the one trying to figure out how to get to TEB or PBI on my own dime..

Just because you made it work doesn't mean everyone behind you should have to suffer as well. I can't tell you how many times I've read your pilots on this board telling us how great the home basing was, and they were right, it is a great thing. So great in fact that it should've been sacred at the bargaining table and many of you were on this forum puffing up your chests saying it was.

It's just my opinion, no I don't have an axe to grind and yes, I'm truely happy for your group as a whole. It's nice to not have to hear all you guys huddle in to a corner at Signature whining and complaining. You all seem like a much happier bunch.

Best of luck and fly safe.