Here is goes...leave CMR for Flex

[TonyC]

I have a 6mo old son, so time at home is important.

You only get one chance to raise him right!



Congrats, and Good Luck!

 

[ozpilot]

Hi Gordon24

I left Comair for Netjets at the end of the strike three years ago. I was a third year Captain at Comair. I not too familar with working conditions at Flexjet so bear in mind my comparison is only to Netjets.

For me it was the right decision. All the good points posted about Netjets are pretty much true. You should be aware however, that flying for a scheduled airline – such as Comair – does have some advantages over fractional flying. Its like comparing driving a limo vs. driving a bus.

As a limo driver you will be expected to have a greater interaction with the passengers, and you will not have the level of support in the field that you have at an airline. If you piss off a passenger at an airline and they don’t come back, it has a minimal impact on the company’s bottom line. If you do it at a fractional where the owner is a multimillionaire it can mean your job.

At Comair its easy to fly a four day trip and never even talk to a passenger; At Netjets you are expected to be not only the pilot but also the customer service representative. You are also expected to be the baggage handler, caterer, aircraft cleaner, security, EMS person etc. etc. Remember that unless you are in the Falcon or the BBJ you will not have the benefit of a Flight Attendant. There’s a reason our company recurrent takes a week! Our job is not just transportation; it is to spoil our passengers rotten. At Netjets ‘whatever it takes’ means just that. Personally I like dealing with my passengers at this level, but if you think your job as a pilot is to simply fly the plane it may not be for you.

At Netjets they expect two things from their pilots: Performance and Attitude. Netjets will tell you that safety is number one and they mean it. In the year that I have been here I have seen numerous examples where the company has put safety before customer consideration. So you must be able to meet the performance standards.

Attitude is also important. Fourteen hour days are not uncommon and you will be expected to deliver the same level of service on the last leg as you did on the first. On the plus side the company is smart enough to realize that the level of service expected by our owners, at the end of the day, is delivered by the pilots. The company will go to extraordinary measures to help us deliver. If you visit Columbus take a tour of the Operations center. Half the people support the customers. Guess what the other half do? They support the pilots. I don’t recall too many of those at Comair.

The bus driver also has the advantage of a fixed schedule. As a limo driver you work schedule is subject to constant change. There are only two things you can be sure of: the company will not touch you on your days off and you will get at least 10 hours of rest each day. But unlike Comair you will find yourself in situations where you are available to the company but not on duty as far as rest is concerned. Its complicated so let me use an example.

Say you finish a trip at 4 in the afternoon. The company tells you that you will be starting you next trip at 10 am the next morning. So far, so good. But according to our contract the company can (and often does) call you out ten hours later (at 2 am) for a trip. So what do you do? Do you go to sleep at 4 (assuming that you can) in order to be awake for 2 or plan to sleep later for the 10 show? The problem is that your14 hours of duty commence when the company calls you, not at the end of your rest period.

If they call you at 2 its possible that you may not have had sufficient sleep. Now let’s say you go to sleep immediately and awake at 2 am but you don’t start until 10. Now its possible for you to be awake for 22 hours (8 + 14) before you next rest period.

Does this sound like a fatigue issue? You bet it is, but here’s the big difference between Comair and Netjets. If you tell Netjets you are too tired to fly then that’s the end of the story. The company does not want you to fly fatigued. Work rules in the Comair contract are more stringent but I believe they are there because they need to be.

I expect the work rules to change with the passage of 91K, but that probabily won't be until next year.

Bottom line: For me the disadvantages of working at Comair had everything to do with how the company treated us and little to do with the nature of the business. At Netjets the disadvantages are all related to the nature of the business which the company does its best to minimize. I love it, but its not for everyone.

Good Luck.

 

[SDCFI]

? for ozpilot

ozpilot - as someone who is trying to decide between airline vs fractional I was just wondering how the pax treat you at Netjets. Do you feel they see you on the same level as themselves or as a bellboy at their beck and call. Also, if you had a problem with a customer treating you like crap would the company back you up or is the customer ALWAYS right? Thanks.

 

[ozpilot]

SDCFI,

A very good question! There are some owners that treat you no better than they treat their domestic staff. These folk consider you no better than a limo driver. The good news is that these owners are in the minority.

Most owners are polite and treat the flight crews well. Most simply want to get on the aircraft and get to where there going with a minimum of fuss.

If an owner seems friendly during the initial greeting, I will usually go back at some point in the flight and see how they are doing. If they are not, or are just indifferent, then I will leave them in peace.

Its intereseting to note that in all the owner surveys that the company has done, the owners rate the service they receive from the pilots as the best part of the program.

As far as a conflict between a passenger and a crew member is concerned: if an owner complains about a crew member then you can bet the pilot will hear about it. He or she may even be invited to Columbus to explain their actions.

Having said that, my experience is that the company will give the pilot a fair hearing. The best way to avoid this problem is to notify the company immediately there is a conflict with an owner. In most cases the problem is resolved right there.

In terms of safety, I have not seen a situation where the company has pressured me to compromise safety to please an owner. If the owners pissed, but the crew made the right decision thats the end of the story. A good example is if we have to divert because the weather is below minimums at the destination. In this situation it is a good idea to give the company a heads up as soon as possible so they can start working out another plan for the owner. The owner may be pissed and complain but the company will back the pilot.

Having said all that, the issue of duty times and crew rest can be an ugly one at Netjets. Scheduling will often ask crews to fly 14 hours with 10 hours rest several days in a row. Many pilots here feel the pressure to get the job done. The company expects you to just say no if your fatriqued but it is your decision. I have called in fatiqued several times and have never had a problem.

 

[Heavy Set]

Yeah, but at the end of the day, you're flying at 0.92 mach and leaving everyone else in your dust... Wave goodbye to the CRJs, 737s and 757s way below.

 

[gordon24]

Thanks for all the advice. I think I agree with gunfyter the most. I don't really see Flex as a place I want to retire from. I don't think it's a smart move to leave CMR to go to Flex to leave there to go to Netjets or Fltops. I'll hold out where I am, enjoy my fairly decent schedule and hopefully get on with Nets or Fltops one day. Again, thanks for the help.

 

[On Your Six]

Good decision. Seriously, try to network better with Netjets and FLOPS pilots at local GA airports or look for contacts in your home city. Networking counts - don't give up...

 

[FracCapt]

Yeah, but at the end of the day, you're flying at 0.92 mach and leaving everyone else in your dust... Wave goodbye to the CRJs, 737s and 757s way below.

I hope you meant that in jest. The fact that so many people want to fly the Cit X just because it is the fastest bizjet in existance is certainly not a help to the pilots of NJA when it comes to negotiations for their new contract. I always have to laugh at the people that think they are cool because they fly the CX, or the DA2000, or a GV....they're pilots, plain and simple. Some get paid more than others. Some have more time than others. I could fly any airplane at Flight Options, but I have no desire to fly a GIV, Legacy, Challenger, etc., just because of the type. I care about 1) Schedule(pretty simple, we're all on the same sched here) and 2) Pay(to go to any airframe besides Hawker I would be an SIC, therefore a pay cut). If Flight Options offered to pay me 100k a year to fly a C172....I'd be all over it! Keep me flying(something), pay me well, and give me a good schedule...and I'll be a happy camper.

 

[AA717driver]

FracCapt--You broke the code. TC

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Just curious. A year later -- do you feel as though you made the right decision for you and your family?