Help a furloughed pilot decide please

[Quimby]

Netjets, Netjets Intl', World (home based) as other options

 

[blingair]

A little hesitant to post this on FI, but what the heck.

Can't really keep this short in order to provide adequate background, but I'll do my best...

I am furloughed USAir and recalls are getting reasonably close to me. I expect an opportunity to return there on a 737/Airbus within a year or so, or to the E190 in a few months (I will definitely bypass that initially due to low pay $46/hr). I am an Eagle EMB FO just barely able to hold a line. I came back to Eagle 10/04 (I was here 94-99) after bouncing around post 9/11 to justify moving my family back to DFW and because Eagle is a good regional job, relatively speaking. But...things here seem very cloudy, at best I'd expect a Saab upgrade in another 2-3 years IF we can recruit enough newhires to avoid AMR putting our flying out for bid by others. I don't need a ton of money but I certainly am struggling on FO pay and even SF3 CA pay would barely allow saving anything for retirement. I have small kids (twins) in Kindergarten and cherish my time home, so commuting (to reserve especially) would really be a bummer (we won't be moving anytime soon due to wife's family in the immediate area).

I have less than 1000 turbine PIC but plenty of TT. I can go to Republic as an E170/175 Captain under the Jets4Jobs program (basically like an AA flowback but at year 1 longevity and seniority). If I do that it would be strictly to book the 1300 turbine PIC before I go back to USAir, in case history re-repeats itself and I wind up on the street for a 3rd time (#2 omitted for brevity). That would give me the option of the A list jobs as well as SWA and AA in the DFW area in the future. The pay difference is only about $500/mo over the course of 1 year there because: I'd lose a month's pay, have 1 month of COBRA expenses, and by the time I fly 85-90 here vs. 75 there and pay crashpad expenses it just isn't as much more as it seems ($57 or 63/hr there E170 or 175). Hardly worth it monetarily for the hassles IMO.

So, should I bother going there? Should I go to USAir straight from Eagle? Should I just stay at Eagle and call it a career? Truth is I'm so dang gunshy of making another wrong decision I don't know what the heck to do! Does Eagle have a reasonable future for me anytime soon? FWIW $60k is about the livable wage point for us, assuming wife at home for the kids, which I prefer. I couldn't really care less about flying a 737 vs. an EMJ. Truthfully I don't really wanna go commute to reserve at RPA, or LCC for that matter, and then get stuck junior at LCC when age 65 takes effect. I'm almost 40 and I have a hard time envisioning a 25 year commuting career, but financially I'm just not sure I can stay here and have a reasonable retirement stash. Plus, I'm a little tired of trying to salvage what seems to be a toasted career. Perhaps I need to just enjoy not commuting and wait it out to upgrade here?

Your honest thoughts and insights are appreciated. Flaming is not.

Thanks,
Swaayze

I would show this post to any one considering a life as an airline pilot. Such a crazy industry.

 

[RJLooser]

I have less than 1000 turbine PIC but plenty of TT.

How much less than 1000 turbine PIC? That kind of factors in, too.

I left eagle after a little over six years to chase the PIC as well. The jury is still out as to if it was the right decision or not. The PIC has open some doors for me, however, commuting did cause a lot of problems at home in the personal life. Maybe it didn't cause them, but sure didn't help. I feel for ya, man. Good luck with the decision...

 

[Swaayze]

Wow, thanks for all the replies. As I feared y'all make good points on both sides of the argument, and that's what I can do making this a difficult choice.

I'm fully onboard with the family first plan, and I have basically spent the last 5 years making that choice first at the expense of much lost income and other job opportunites including earlier J4J Captain seats. The question is when, if ever, do I go back to devoting more time to get my career on track so I can afford retirement?

I have about 550 turbine PIC now so about a year on the line would probably check the box at 1300. I like the idea of getting the monkey off my back but is it really necessary? I think the J4J program is coming to a close so I need to do it soon if I'm gonna do it. In my mind I have to commit to mainline U to justify going, and likewise once (if) I go to RPA then I'll have committed to mainline (with the option of applying to SWA and the others in the future of course). It's also difficult to leave Eagle again because had I just stayed the first time I'd be a mid-level jet captain in DFW making close to $100k flying 2-day trips so I know what patience may bring even at Eagle (though I'm not convinced the future at Eagle is too bright with all the industry code share RFPs, Eagle unable to crew their flight hours requested from AA, and no growth or 70 seat abilities for the future).

BTW the frax were considered but for some reason 7 full days away twice a month for the next 25 years just isn't appealing. It may be silly but 4 on 3 off just seems better to me, probably just because it's the devil I know. And the younger me? Irrelevant but I'd have chased the dream, gone for the PIC and the goal of getting to the brass ring (in my case AA then, add SWA now). The brass ring jobs are now tarnished beyond belief and I'm trying to be smart enough to make better decisions not based on just fulfilling a career goal but rather on what's ultimately best for my family.

Keep the constructive thoughts coming please and thanks again.

 

[flexpilot]

Stay Put

Stay put, apply to NetJets. When you get the job, you won't have to commute and you'll be bringing home $100K within five years.

 

[LearLove]

I think the J4J program is coming to a close so I need to do it soon if I'm gonna do it.

Yes its very close to the end of offers at Rep. The next bid closes on the 13th. The number of CA slots in the bid should get all the way thru the list (down to VE at the very bottom) thus there will be no more offers (unless there is another order for more jets contracted out - God please no).

When we were learning to fly and starting out as commercial pilots we all thought that checkrides, wx and a real emergency was the wrost thing we would have to deal with. Now looking back after 10 years making a living as a pilot I'd say that flying stress stuff is nothing compared to the way "job move" type decisions weigh on your mind. Especially after your "in" the bizz and have to make a move reguarding that "God Almighty Anchor" that is the senority number.

Good luck Swayz - make your decision based on your best possible information - say alittle prayer - then sit back and let her ride.

 

[Oneflap]

Im at Republic, There is so much growth here that they are holding J4J pilots at republic even if you get called back....they need pilots. The Contract says they can do this and it really sucks for the guys getting called back. Lots of Upgrades so you can plan on being on reserve for the whole time. 90 percent of the guys I fly in with IND are J4J and all they want to do is leave. the J4J guys that were able to hold a line are now moving backwards into reserve lines because of the new upgrades and Few J4J's coming because of republic holding them for a year and a half per contract. Trust me when I say you dont want to be on reserve with our Scheduling running your life. Led by One Grand Master Scheduler that has to approve all request for anything to do with scheduling. One year here and he has not approved any request that I have ever made. I am very glad to be off reserve. Lines at Republic are imposible to commute. IND has only 540am and 630am shows, very few 1200pm shows. Ive heard the same about PIT and DCA. returns are all 900pm or later.

Im going to be honest because it will not help me or you if you come here. It would slow down my upgrade and you would be stuck in a J4J hell for a year and a half min if not longer. You would be better off if you came here from off the street and would have a line in a couple of months. I have not had a line here in the past 6 months with less than 15 days off at about 85 hours. just the opposite for reserve, DCA reserve hardly ever fly's and IND Reserve never stops and all have min 11 days off and nothing more. 1 and half hour reserve call out. I hope this helps and good luck to you where ever you go.

Good Luck,

 

[Lear70]

Stay put, apply to NetJets. When you get the job, you won't have to commute and you'll be bringing home $100K within five years.

How's that?

If I had stayed at Flex back in '99, I'd be 8 years now, still unable to hold CL left seat, and only drawing about $90k.

Plus, I'd still have to deal with RH.

 

[BenderGonzales]

He said NetJets not Flex.
The moral of the story is that there is far more out in aviation than simply airline jobs. Hop the fence to the corporate side and ditch the golden handcuffs of seniority.

 

[Lear70]

He said NetJets not Flex.
The moral of the story is that there is far more out in aviation than simply airline jobs. Hop the fence to the corporate side and ditch the golden handcuffs of seniority.

Heh heh... yes, he did. Saw the Flex in his name and missed the Net in the next paragraph.

Yes, there is more outside airline life, and I've done both (as well as Boeing cargo). I prefer knowing my schedule in advance and more days off I get here than in the fractional world, and I'm reasonably comfortable that I'll make roughly the same money (within $500,000 over a 30 year career) at my LCC than I would at NJA.

It's all about what you like to do and where your priorities are. Mine are max days home, regardless of base income (I make more money outside of aviation right now than in it). I'm running about 20 days off a month - can you do that at a Fractional consistently each month?