Gulfstream Airlines to Major?

[citabriapilot]

I have read lots of stuff on these forums about how everyone looks down on the pay to play FO's at Gulfstream, but what about the street captains that get hired?

I have a potential in over there to walk in as a captain, but wanted to get the opinion of some of the pilots at Southwest, Airtran, UPS, etc. and see if there is any bad feelings towards the captains who got their time the legitimate way and then worked at Gulfstream. Pro's/Con's?

I could stay with my current company and fly a 1900, but it would be singlepilot, same runs everyday, no 121 experience. What are your thoughts?

 

[pilot error]

assuming this isn't flame bait, to work there is to support their system. don't.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

All you need the right qualifications and the proper attitude. Sure we don't like this whole PFJ thing.....

If you want to be liked by the cool dudes...then don't.

However, if you have the right attitude, excellent airmanship and a FedEx or UPS ID card, the cool dudes can't say jack..... oh they'll try, but you'll be laughing to the bank while they fester in thier own misguided bitter...

 

[radarlove]

I would stay away. You'll spend the rest of your career explaining how you may have worked there but you weren't PFT. It really is a big black mark, for right or wrong.

 

[AAflyer]

Ask PCL-128, He has been there. He also has said that he did not understand the situation before he entered into the program. Not sure if he would do it again if he had the chance , but get his perspective.


AA

 

[mach zero]

I would NOT recommend Gulfstream. If it was up to me, (which it's not of course) SWA would NOT ever hire a Gulfstream Airlines pilot.

 

[avrodriver]

I know back in 2004 they were hiring guys into the left seat on the up and up. Shortly after that I remember they started making guys pay for training to go straight into the left seat. Which one are they offering you?

 

[islandhoper]

In the hopes that this isn't flame bate..........

1) Most people here don't know how Gulfstream academy works. So you'll get only negative info which is mostly wrong....

2) Gulfstream is NOT currently hiring of the street captains....

3)If you do the academy program, it does not mean you'll have a job with the airline.

4)If you get the job, you'll be fine. I did it and went to Airtran directly from there. I'm not the only one. I have friends that left to American, United, Delta,ATA (back in the days) Southwest, Airtran, and Continental this past couple months.
Nobody has ever made me feel bad or put me down except at Flightinfo. I usually stay out of the fights since they are pointless.

If you get hired, the contract is one of the best 1900 contracts in the U.S. (made 70 thou my last year as an Inst/Procheck) And you get benefits through Continental Airlines (travel)

Last time I checked they were not hiring of the street captns. It is not common. They only do it if there are no ugrades due to time requirements.
Pilots are represented by teamsters.

 

[islandhoper]

I would NOT recommend Gulfstream. If it was up to me, (which it's not of course) SWA would NOT ever hire a Gulfstream Airlines pilot.

Obviously not up to you, I have a few friends that went to Southwest directly from Gulfstream....

 

[AAflyer]

I would NOT recommend Gulfstream. If it was up to me, (which it's not of course) SWA would NOT ever hire a Gulfstream Airlines pilot.

That's crap, I know of two of them there right now. Met one in STL at Chilli's 2. He was a young looking captain. Asked how his career path got him to SWA. He said GIA.

AA

 

[avrodriver]

That's crap, I know of two of them there right now. Met one in STL at Chilli's 2. He was a young looking captain. Asked how his career path got him to SWA. He said GIA."

He said if it was up to him.

F these guys.......if you meet the minimums and have contacts at your dream career airline, you have just as good of a chance as everyone else.

 

[islandhoper]

I would stay away. You'll spend the rest of your career explaining how you may have worked there but you weren't PFT. It really is a big black mark, for right or wrong.

Never had to explain myself, except at Flightinfo; Gulfstream is a regular 121 regional airline that codeshares with Continental, United, Northwest and Copa Airlines.


No flames, just truth

 

[Helos2Galaxy]

I was a direct entry Captain in 1997 (though I did a right seat gig for 3 months) and did not have to pay for training.

I went from GIA to the right seat of a 747. Did that for 6 months and then got on at Delta. Nobody ever questioned my career path, though a few delta Captains were asking if it was worth sending their kids there as 250 hour F/Os.

If you can deal with the laid back life style, the GIA Key West crew base is a blast. Most of the pilots party together a few times a week and chase the Michigan girls down on vacation. It's the closest thing to comraderie in an airline you'll ever see.

Back in '97, Tom was paying the Key West bubbas an extra three bucks an hour as a cost of living offset.

 

[YourPilotFriend]

I just don't understand why anybody would pay to work at a regional. I don;t see anybody paying to work at mcdonalds, which, has comparable pay.

 

[islandhoper]

I just don't understand why anybody would pay to work at a regional. I don;t see anybody paying to work at mcdonalds, which, has comparable pay.

Mypilotfriend,

You have no idea how Gulfstream International Airlines and Gulfstream Training academy work. They are 2 different things...

The airline is great I think. And they only hire "academy graduates" WHEN AND IF they need pilots.

 

[Benhuntn]

I personally don't like flying with people who have flown other than Boeing aircraft, are democrats, sleep on the left side of the bed, pay for sex, chew with their mouths open, or say "hey dude". Pay for training isn't on that list is it?

 

[PCL_128]

Ask PCL-128, He has been there. He also has said that he did not understand the situation before he entered into the program. Not sure if he would do it again if he had the chance , but get his perspective.


AA

All correct. I would not do the PFT program again knowing what I know now, but citabriapilot seems to be going the non-PFT route. GIA has occassionally hired pilots into the left seat without PFTing. Not sure if they are now, but if so, it might work out for you.

The idea that GIA looks bad on your resume is ridiculous. I flew at GIA prior to 9/11 when the major airline hiring machine was still humming along. Every CA I flew with that had his 1000 PIC either had an interview or an offer from one of the majors. A typical conversation started with the CA saying something like "I've got job offers from Delta, American, and UPS. Which one do you think is best?" None of the majors care one bit where you got your PIC time.

That being said, I haven't worked at GIA in 4 years, so I'm not really up on how things are going down there right now. The IBT signed their first CBA with GIA shortly after I left, and I remember that it was a pretty good deal for a BE-1900 operator. Trips/duty rigs, min day, decent pay, etc... Schedules were all pretty good, as long as you don't mind working hard on the days you work. You'd fly 6-9 legs a day, buy you'd get 16 days off even as a junior line-holder. Again, not sure if that's still the case.

I believe that The_Russian still works at GIA, so she might be able to give you the latest info. You could try PMing her for the latest. Good luck.

P.S. AAflyer, what's up with the recall petition in your signature? I don't keep up much on APA politics, so I didn't know you guys were having problems with the leadership. We would love to have you back at ALPA even after all these decades.

 

[AAflyer]

All correct. I would not do the PFT program again knowing what I know now, but citabriapilot seems to be going the non-PFT route. GIA has occassionally hired pilots into the left seat without PFTing. Not sure if they are now, but if so, it might work out for you.

The idea that GIA looks bad on your resume is ridiculous. I flew at GIA prior to 9/11 when the major airline hiring machine was still humming along. Every CA I flew with that had his 1000 PIC either had an interview or an offer from one of the majors. A typical conversation started with the CA saying something like "I've got job offers from Delta, American, and UPS. Which one do you think is best?" None of the majors care one bit where you got your PIC time.

That being said, I haven't worked at GIA in 4 years, so I'm not really up on how things are going down there right now. The IBT signed their first CBA with GIA shortly after I left, and I remember that it was a pretty good deal for a BE-1900 operator. Trips/duty rigs, min day, decent pay, etc... Schedules were all pretty good, as long as you don't mind working hard on the days you work. You'd fly 6-9 legs a day, buy you'd get 16 days off even as a junior line-holder. Again, not sure if that's still the case.

I believe that The_Russian still works at GIA, so she might be able to give you the latest info. You could try PMing her for the latest. Good luck.

P.S. AAflyer, what's up with the recall petition in your signature? I don't keep up much on APA politics, so I didn't know you guys were having problems with the leadership. We would love to have you back at ALPA even after all these decades.

PCL

Many feel the current APA administration is to management friendly. Many feel they are simply parroting what management says they want and need to stay competitive. There seems to be a large discord among the pilot group. After NWA and DAL settle CAL and AA will have industry leading contracts in respect to the legacy carriers (not talking about UPS,FEDEX or even SWA). There will be more of a pressure to stay competitive. Many do not realize we can early open Section 6 this May, however there seems to be a consensus that now would not be a good time.

The petition is to re-call the president, however we have domicile elections this month and there may be enough of a shake up to the BOD to squash what our president is trying to slip past us. Many are convinced he is trying to weasel his way into a management position. These are just thoughts and comments I have heard.

I have heard some of the current BOD say we need some type of national pilot union, there was a strong push here a couple years ago, thousands signed a petition, however the many current BOD members and the president squashed the idea. Not sure what the future holds.

regards,

AA

 

[PCL_128]

Thanks for the update. Interesting stuff.

 

[(o) (o)]

Buddy of mine had an ex Gulfstream B1900 F/O in his CONTINENTAL AIRLINES NEW-HIRE CLASS (the 3rd class of their hiring spree)

25 year old..son of a senior Captain.

So it's not the end of the world if you worked there, as long as your dad knows someone.

 

[citabriapilot]

A friend of mine got hired off the street back in the fall of 2005. You're right, I'm not sure that they are hiring captains again at this point either, but he made it sound like it was something that happened pretty often these days. I think there were at least 6 in his class and they were looking for 6 more a couple of months later.

Someone said "Why do you want to fly for a regional?" Personally, I don't, but I'd make the move over to the regional side if I was guaranteed PIC time. No sense in giving up the turbine PIC I'm getting now to go sit as an FO. Also want to be back in FL. I saw something on ClimbTo350 that Colgan was hiring street captains as well.. I'd consider that if they were in FL, but unfortunately the aren't.

Thanks for the honest and fair answers. I'm just trying to do my homework, not stir up the hornet's nest.

 

[dabandermac]

Also want to be back in FL...I'd consider that if they were in FL, but unfortunately the aren't.

Why the f**k would you want to come (back) to florida?.....this place is a cesspool.

 

[FlyingFarmer]

Just an FYI

To all of those that are willing to pay for training all I will say is this.
There are many people on interview boards at many airlines that feel very strongly that what you are doing is wrong. Those that make it through the cracks and get on at those carriers will never know how lucky or how connected they were. I'm not going to get into a pissing match with a scumbag FO during/after IOE. Just know that the above is how we really feel about you. There are many people who try to make sure that you DON"T get that job. Be warned.

 

[K-Mart]

There are many people on interview boards at many airlines that feel very strongly that what you are doing is wrong.

Which airlines are these?? There is only a few hiring.

Those that make it through the cracks and get on at those carriers will never know how lucky or how connected they were.[/QUOTE]
You don't know that.

There are many people who try to make sure that you DON"T get that job. Be warned.[/

What are people to be warned about?? Why would somebody try and make sure somebody can't get a job?? So, some folks have parents that are loaded and can afford to send there kids to GIA. Who really cares though... I don't. I don't think most people do either. Remember: an advantage is an advantage. It might be money, connections, pure luck, high IQ, good health, or what ever you dream up. I can remember from high school, a long time ago, having peers whose parents were multi-millionaires and could have bought the GIA. A lot them have ended up doing nothing much but mooching off dad and mom. So much for that advantage huh?! Give the GIA guys and gals a break. Just my thoughts!

 

[citabriapilot]

Farmer,

This thread isn't about dropping 25K and going to GIA. It's discussing street captain positions, which, as far as I know don't require any money out of pocket.

To Everyone Else:

Can anyone point out the difference between GIA and all those corporate jobs advertising on the employment boards that require you to either pay for your type or pay for your initial training? I personally couldn't afford to drop 18K for a in initial Citation/Learjet type, but looks like a lot of jobs out there require that to break into corporate flying. Do all you guys who hate PFT'ers try to make it where these guys don't get hired at places like SWA, UPS, Airtran, Etc. as well?

dabandermac,

Florida is my kind of cesspool, too... Why do you hate it so much? Maybe you lived in the wrong area? Personally, I loved it and still do. Plus I'm tired of living 3,000 miles from anyone I know and all my family.

 

[PCL_128]

To all of those that are willing to pay for training all I will say is this.
There are many people on interview boards at many airlines that feel very strongly that what you are doing is wrong. Those that make it through the cracks and get on at those carriers will never know how lucky or how connected they were. I'm not going to get into a pissing match with a scumbag FO during/after IOE. Just know that the above is how we really feel about you. There are many people who try to make sure that you DON"T get that job. Be warned.

LOL!!! What a joke. I certainly don't advocate for PFT, since it certainly isn't good for the industry, but this is just a load. As I said, there are GIA PFTers at every major and national airline in this country. They've been getting hired since GIA opened shop in '91. You're living in a dream world if you think the majors care one bit about where or how you got your PIC time.

 

[FlyingFarmer]

Are you for real?

Now who is smoking that rock? Do you actually think that when a bunch of pilots are sitting around talking about who is going to get hired PFT doesn't enter into the equation? You guys are either fools, or are lying to yourselves in the hopes of feeling better. Trust me I won't be giviing ANY specifics but I've heard it does come up. So what if a few of you losers made it through. The rest of us know that what you've done hurts us all.

Enough said.

 

[optimater]

I would NOT recommend Gulfstream. If it was up to me, (which it's not of course) SWA would NOT ever hire a Gulfstream Airlines pilot.

Am I the only one that sees the irony here? Don't you have to PFT to get hired at SWA?

 

[PCL_128]

Now who is smoking that rock? Do you actually think that when a bunch of pilots are sitting around talking about who is going to get hired PFT doesn't enter into the equation? You guys are either fools, or are lying to yourselves in the hopes of feeling better. Trust me I won't be giviing ANY specifics but I've heard it does come up. So what if a few of you losers made it through. The rest of us know that what you've done hurts us all.

Enough said.

You can listen to rumors and a bunch of bravado by guys that don't do the actual hiring, but I've seen the reality. I worked at GIA pre-9/11, and I saw the 20-30 pilots a month leaving to go to the majors. Many of them had offers from multiple airlines. Most of them left with the bare minimum flight times, some with well under 1000 PIC. When the majors start hiring again, the same will be true. As I said before, you're living in a fantasy world if you think the majors care at all where you built your time.

 

[dabandermac]

dabandermac,

Florida is my kind of cesspool, too... Why do you hate it so much? Maybe you lived in the wrong area? Personally, I loved it and still do. Plus I'm tired of living 3,000 miles from anyone I know and all my family.

mostly giving you a hard time...

but really.. it's over priced, and many of the people living in south fla are glorified trailer trash. i think anyone that lives in the area now-a-days can atest. i live and go to school in tallahassee and to me it is a breath of fresh air. my dad has been thinking of getting out of the palm beach area also. he says it's just so dang depressing these days.

but if you know what you're getting yourself into, have family in the area, and can afford anything then Enjoy..