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Great Lakes Lost UA Codeshare

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All I really know is that Mesa will be flying 10 Dash 8's out of DEN soon. Air Whiskey is returning their 328s.

I heard somewhere that Mesa is going to operate 1900s out of DEN under a UA codeshare.

If Lakes can't make the 1900 work, what makes Mesa think they can. Heck, Lakes even has Raytheon behind them, don't they?
 
We have known we were losing Casper and 3 other cities at least a month ago.. For example, Lakes ran a mix of 1900's and Emb120's on the route, I think 5 flights a day. The avg load was about 19 people (on the Emb), and approx 50% of those folks were UAL code share.. I am not sure how many Embs SkyWest is going to run, but it is going to cost United more to run two cost plus flights a day, than to pay for their individual pax.

Our code with Frontier is up 700% from 1 month ago. Quite frankly our loads have been really good here lately, I haven't seen the terminal area packed like this in ages. We have really turned around: 98-99% complete, and 90% on-time. We have been bringing back furloughs... So it makes it difficult to comprehend Lakes demise.

Also it is interesting to note that GLA is still a creditor of United... They still owe GLA $$
 
Last edited:
wooferdog said:

If Lakes can't make the 1900 work, what makes Mesa think they can. Heck, Lakes even has Raytheon behind them, don't they?
Click to expand...

Mesa is quite interested in the DEN 1900 routes of 'Lakes. JO has indicated before that Mesa can break even on the 1900 with EAS, but not w/o it.

Regarding 'Lakes possibly losing the UA codeshare and YV in DEN, here's the latest from Orenstein himself: "The GLUX implications could be significant for us - particularly on the EAS markets in DEN. "

-Boo!
 
Seriously, I can't believe they want to run the Dash in WY. Rock Springs, Cody, maybe in the summer, Laramie, Riverton, hey why not Worland too. No way. Too expensice and not enough peeps up in those parts to make $ on a 37 seater, unless of course they hire Freedom pilots. Anyway, its too bad about Lakes. No matter what anyone says, what a kick a$$ place to work. Great pilots, and nothing beats flying into TEX. You can't put anything but a 1900 on most of those markets, and it would be sad to see someone else doin it.
 
"The GLUX implications could be significant for us - particularly on the EAS markets in DEN. "
Click to expand...

Does JO think that UAL controls who gets the EAS cities? Even if UAL drops Lakes, Lakes still has the EAS contracts..

I would say that if JO's business plan is based on the failure of any other airlines, that is a terrible plan. He should stick to the things he can control. Being poised to pick up the pieces is one thing, but banking on a failure is another.. Maybe he has a crystal ball
 
canadflyau said:
Does JO think that UAL controls who gets the EAS cities?
Click to expand...

No, but, w/o a codeshare, many EAS markets would be interested in an EAS operator who had the codeshare that their EAS used to have, and JO knows that fo' sure!

I think Lakes is going to get a quick lesson is how persuasive JO can be. I 'pity the fool' who underestimates JO.

-Boo!
 
many EAS markets would be interested in an EAS operator who had the codeshare that their EAS used to have
Click to expand...

Maybe true, but unfortunately that is not a condition for who gets awarded the EAS contracts by the Fed gov... but one thing that is, Completion. Lakes new CEO knows that, and MESA's completeion performance has been sub-par... like I said, I think JO should not be betting on which horse may or may not fail, and keep shaping up the ops he has.. Frontier is not a happy customer right now, and that is one thing that is for sure..
 
A couple of clarifications:
1. Mesa used to fly 1900's and Dashes out of denver about six years ago. They got into a pissing contest with united then, and presto, we have Great Lakes. Mesa couldn't handle the pressure then, they can't do it now.

2. The new Rocky Mountain Airways isn't going to use Dash-8's, at least not at first. They are going to use Dash-7's, just like the old days. The first step isn't going to be an airline, persay. They are just going to do charters for a while to get things figured out while they work on the 121 Cert.

I hope GLA sticks around, I like them a heck of a lot more than Mesa. I have a some friend at GLA I don't want to see on the street. However, I do hope RMA gets going soon for I can have a job.
 
One other thing that is in the works at Lakes is a Shuttle. I'm not talking air shuttle, I'm talking buses. They want to run busses like a plane, screen the PAX at the airport, load them on the ramp and ship them to the GLA gates at DEN. They want to do it out of the close markets and a few others. Laramie, CYS, FNL, Pueblo, etc. I know GLA dosn't fly into FNL or pueblo, but they want start driving from there.
 
Why would an airline get in the Greyhound business? I’m sure the passengers would be really happy when the found out they paid all that money to fly and instead got a bus. If GLA does start this service it will be doomed to fail.
 
Buses,

Hows that weed. No way on earth that Lakes in running buses. Why? Why pay to drive to Pueblo when you could do it your **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED** self for way less. And, the pilots would never let it happen. Why? They're drenched in urin from continually getting pissed on from Cheyenne. Trust me when I say those pilots will take that company down and not think twice. Its just punishment after punishment around there. Great people to work with, but everyone is tired of taking it in the deucehole. The cntrtact has been in negotiaitons since the DC-3 came out. Its ridiculous. All airlines have thier problems, but you'll never really know until you've been a LAKER.
 
Skyward, did you forget that your company serves ABE from EWR with a bus, and other cities with "codeshared" rail service? It was a route served by a Beech once upon a time. Even British Airways throws it's flight numbers on the Chunnel trains and a few others. I still think it's an inane idea, but there is historical precedent.

If this is true, at least the company is leaving no stone unturned in its fight for survival. But I'm not sure that bus service can pull Lakes out of their $30 million hole, nor fix a -12% operating margin. Even Raytheon realizes the company is a dry hole. Their bailout is like United selling a transcon seat for $199 - you're losing money either way, but at least with this scenario, the longer the company survives, the more payments they will have made. Chances are those aircraft may never be placed with another lessor, or perhaps sold for pennies on the dollar to replace some DC-3 in Angola.
 
I might add, or to replace some oldies in Alaska, actually the 1900 is quite popular up here.......
Alaska Central Express has at least one ex GLA 1900, the tail number is N***GL or N**GL, can't remember.
 
Just a glorified bus driver

If I have 25,000 TT in automobiles, but only 20 hours of big bus time, do I qualify for Great Lakes Buslines, or do I have to PFT on the short yellow bus so that I might one day get picked up by 'Lakes?

And what do I say when people tell me I'm just a 'glorified bus driver'? :)

-Boo!
 
Cardinal, you are correct CAL does service ABE with a bus, but there is an important distinction to be made. Those CAL passengers are going to EWR to connect to somewhere in the CAL system not as a final destination, they are also getting 500 FF miles. That is the only bus route in the CAL system. With this purposed GLA service a much bigger % of their routes would be made up of bus routes, and without a code share partner are they really connecting to somewhere?
 
We are still code with Frontier, even if the supposed decision is made to lose the UAL code. It is amazing how pissed folks get when they won't work out a pmt plan, and it is UAL needing to work one with Lakes.
 
I guess I should elaborate my statement. The busses will not replace the planes. All the flights will go that already go. GLA doen't serve Pueblo or Fort Collins. This is going to be a low cost thing, $38 buck one-way. Sure people may be able to drive them selfs, but they won't be checked in, screened, and they will have to pay for parking. This also isn't a for sure thing, they are just kicking around the idea right now. I know you think I smoke the real good stuff, but I was in the meeting when Voss threw out the idea.
 

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