George Will

[pilotyip]

If deregulation has wrecked anything, it is the airline industry.

Life was good for a few pilots under regulation. There are probably 4-5 times as many pilot’s jobs now as there was in 1977. Back in reg time it was about 90% military that went to the majors. Dereg opened up a lot of airline job to non-military pilots. To return to regulation would raise ticket prices, reduce the number of passengers, and therefore reduce the number of pilots needed. BTW SWA the low cost provider has near the top wages, this was done under de-reg. Still is still a great way to make a living.

The CEO has little control over the airline, the airline is run by regulation and union contracts. They are at the mercy of the purchasing public, who with Internet access has made the airline ticket a perfectly elastic commodity.

People change airlines for a $1.00, Spirit is now one of the most profitable airlines, but has the cheapest fares. However they are now thinki9ng of a charge to use the lav.

 

[tzskipper]

It is just crazy talk to say that (as an industry) airlines as a business have been successful since deregulation.

By just about any metric used, with the exception of the price of a ticket, deregulation has been an epic failure for both investors and employees.

Potential to be a good job? Maybe. Career? Never, unless you believe a career is made up of multiple employers and the hope of some 401k balance upon hitting retirement age (having to start over a few times will pretty much ensure that there won't ever be enough). Oh yeah, and having a spouse that works.

We are about to see for the first time, the true size of a sustainable airline market once US and AA merge. Four carriers controlling 90% of the domestic traffic. With capacity discipline in place, I doubt we will ever see a true pilot shortage.

S

 

[maru657]

I heard PilotYips argument before. Though long since retired there were plenty of non-military pilots at the major airline I retired from. There were plenty of non-military pilots at most of the airlines, and to specify when I say non-military, I mean not military trained although many like myself had served in the military. The only airline that seemed to go almost entirely military eventually was Delta. They paid for this in the 80's. There was not as much movement because as a career you could pretty much count on staying at one carrier until retirement, with a pension. Yes there's movement now but it seems to be a lot of movement between airlines, with no decent retirement package or pension involved.

 

[Poahi]

... with the exception of the price of a ticket,...

It's a key metric.

 

[tzskipper]

It's a key metric.

Only to the fact that it has been historically priced below cost since the advent of deregulation. Just because the consumer is happy doesn't mean the industry is healthy.

S

 

[Poahi]

Only to the fact that it has been historically priced below cost since the advent of deregulation. Just because the consumer is happy doesn't mean the industry is healthy.

S

The CAB did require carriers to fly below cost on short haul routes and was infinitely inflexible on new routes and changes in technology. It didn't really work.

The idea behind capitalism is to keep the customer happy. It's going to be interesting to see how Obamacare impacts health....

 

[inline]

Life was good for a few pilots under regulation. There are probably 4-5 times as many pilot’s jobs now as there was in 1977. Back in reg time it was about 90% military that went to the majors. Dereg opened up a lot of airline job to non-military pilots. To return to regulation would raise ticket prices, reduce the number of passengers, and therefore reduce the number of pilots needed. BTW SWA the low cost provider has near the top wages, this was done under de-reg. Still is still a great way to make a living.

The CEO has little control over the airline, the airline is run by regulation and union contracts. They are at the mercy of the purchasing public, who with Internet access has made the airline ticket a perfectly elastic commodity.

People change airlines for a $1.00, Spirit is now one of the most profitable airlines, but has the cheapest fares. However they are now thinki9ng of a charge to use the lav.

Well put.

 

[waveflyer]

The CAB did require carriers to fly below cost on short haul routes and was infinitely inflexible on new routes and changes in technology. It didn't really work.

The idea behind capitalism is to keep the customer happy. It's going to be interesting to see how Obamacare impacts health....

Once again, believing propaganda about Obamacare, instead of the truth about it.: ie- it's mostly republican, free market ideas- and not even close to the liberal win you guys make it out to be.
But go on and drift away

 

[Poahi]

Once again, believing propaganda about Obamacare, instead of the truth about it.: ie- it's mostly republican, free market ideas- and not even close to the liberal win you guys make it out to be.
But go on and drift away

The discussion was about the pros/cons of government taking control of an industry. Regulation wouldn't work in today's marketplace just like Barrycare won't.

 

[waveflyer]

That's my point- Obamacare takes control of nothing and, if anything, is a corporate blowjob to private insurance companies in attempting to mandate purchase.
But keep stretching