G450 type rating question

Spooky 1

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If you have no previous Gulfstream ratings period, and you receive a rating in the G450 does that carry over to the G550 as well and what about the plain ol'e GIV? If the 450 does not get any 550 credit, what more needs to be done for the G550 rating to be effective?

Thanks in advance..........
 

typhoonpilot

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This from a Flight International article on the 450. " PlaneView, based on Honeywell's Primus Epic integrated avionics, was first certificated on the ultra-long-range G550 and is now fitted across the company's expanded, four aircraft large cabin line, which includes the G350, G450, and G500. All of these aircraft and the earlier GV, now share a common type rating. "


Hope that answers your question.


Typhoonpilot
 

AA717driver

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Step aside, you wide-body airline puke... ;)

Spooky--The G350/450/V/500/550 are all the same rating. The IV doesn't count. Now, having said that, Flight Safety will tag you for a differences course that will make your eyes bleed when you get the bill.

We're getting a 450 to replace the IV (since the ashtrays are full...) and we will all have to do the differences course.TC
 

mzaharis

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This is pretty academic to me, but this one has always bothered me. I can understand why the G350/450/500/550 have the same rating. I can understand why the IV and the 350 and 450 don't share ratings. But why do the V and the 500/550 share ratings? The difference between a V and a Planeview cockpit looks pretty substantial.

Could a V pilot get into a 550 without a differences course? Does someone with a V rating need an additional LOA for the 350/450/500/550, for the Planeview cockpit?
 

semperfido

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mzaharis said:
Could a V pilot get into a 550 without a differences course? ?
when i went from a g5 to a g550 i went to a g550 differences course. it was about a week long. a glorified recurrent. :)
 

Spooky 1

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I can dream can't I?

I do wish it was for me but it is another low life former airline pilot who will get it. I guess I am just stuck on the Boeing until I pull the plug. Sure is nice though when I can crawl under the sheets when my rest time comes. The humidifier, IFE, four reclining seats, two bunks and a full size head, plus a seperate crew galley, not to mention the four lovely flight attendants makes for a very nice ride. All out of sight from our pax. The grass always looks greener on the other side, I guess.
 

AA717driver

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THAT'S IT! As soon as I can extricate myself from the crew rest booth I'm gonna kick Spooky's a$$! ;)

mzaharis--yeah, it's screwed up. TC
 

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mzaharis said:
This is pretty academic to me, but this one has always bothered me. I can understand why the G350/450/500/550 have the same rating. I can understand why the IV and the 350 and 450 don't share ratings. But why do the V and the 500/550 share ratings? The difference between a V and a Planeview cockpit looks pretty substantial.

Could a V pilot get into a 550 without a differences course? Does someone with a V rating need an additional LOA for the 350/450/500/550, for the Planeview cockpit?
This because the G-350/G-450 now share the G-V systems completely. They are very different from the G-IV in that respect (which is huge)... The only common thing between the G-IV and the G-350/450 is the airframe and engines (however the 350/450 are a different dash number and they now have FADEC, they also now have the G-V NORDAM TR's as well). Even the airframe of the 350/450 has been tweeked vs. the G-IV.
 

semperfido

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how about the wing (new or not?), vspeeds (lower than 4?), brakes (dare i ask), elec sys (like 550?) etc, etc. just asking because i am going to school on the 450 soon and don't know much about it. know about g4, g5 & g550, but only what i read on G's website about 450.
 

mzaharis

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Falcon Capt said:
This because the G-350/G-450 now share the G-V systems completely. They are very different from the G-IV in that respect (which is huge)... The only common thing between the G-IV and the G-350/450 is the airframe and engines (however the 350/450 are a different dash number and they now have FADEC, they also now have the G-V NORDAM TR's as well). Even the airframe of the 350/450 has been tweeked vs. the G-IV.
Thanks, everyone. I guess it's less of an issue of the PlaneView cockpit than I had thought.
 

G4G5

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mzaharis said:
This is pretty academic to me, but this one has always bothered me. I can understand why the G350/450/500/550 have the same rating. I can understand why the IV and the 350 and 450 don't share ratings. But why do the V and the 500/550 share ratings? The difference between a V and a Planeview cockpit looks pretty substantial.

The only real difference between the 5 and the 550 is the cockpit. Their are some minor differences (like APU air available for T/O) but nothing significant. Other then that the systems are much closer then a 757 is to a 767 or a Falcon 50 is to a Falcon 900ex. While a non SP(no asc 166, brake by wire) G4 has signifficant differences from a G550 or even a G350

Could a V pilot get into a 550 without a differences course? Does someone with a V rating need an additional LOA for the 350/450/500/550, for the Planeview cockpit?
The FAA had to draw the line in the sand somewhere. IMHO, they no longer look at avionics as something that differentiates type ratings. Lets face it once the basic airframe systems (flt controls, engines, lgd gear yada yada) systems are in place little if anything ever changes (I know about the G5 hyd syst). But avionics on the other had are constantly evolving. WAAS, CPDLC, HUD, EVAS, Synthetic EVS, you name it. All of these things could be in you aircraft or they could not and you would still have the same type rating as the next guy.

To answer your question about the plain view, no it's not that difficult. When we had EVS installed in our G5, FSI screwed up and scheduled me for training in a 550. It's extremely intuitive, in little or no time at all my partner and I were able to fly th 550 to 0/0 for HUD EVS demonstrations.

Now I am not saying I would know what to do if 3 of the 4 tubes failed but navigating through the plain view is fairly simple and that's why I believe the FAA bought off on the same type rating. After all avionics are not meant to make our life more difficult. If all of the basic systems are the same and the avionics got easier, why not a same type rating?
 

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semperfido said:
how about the wing (new or not?), vspeeds (lower than 4?), brakes (dare i ask), elec sys (like 550?) etc, etc. just asking because i am going to school on the 450 soon and don't know much about it. know about g4, g5 & g550, but only what i read on G's website about 450.
OK, here is a rundown from GVFlyer about the improvements that make the G-450 better that the G-IV:

- Tweaked aerodynamics
- Vref's 5-8 kts less than G-IV depending on weight
- Appr speed is now Vref+5 (instead on +10 on the G-IV), total cumulative speed decrease can be as much as 13 kts.
- RR TAY engines, but different dash number and FADEC now, same thrust (13,850 lbs)
- NORDAM thrust reversers (same as G-V)
- Cabin main entrance door moved aft a few feet (relative to the G-IV) which mean more cockpit room (vs. G-IV)
- Brakes, not sure, think the G-V brakes (still very touchy)
- Electrical system identical to the G-V/G-550
- All systems now identical to the G-V/G-550

I was in the G-450 & G-550 at NBAA, cockpit was identical, overhead panel identical...

Looks like great machines, I can't wait to go for differences next summer!
 

semperfido

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FC: thanks for the refresher ....i think i might have read that too. :)

G4G5: for component failure---you just learn a bunch of new acronyms and use common sense and if all else fails- press on :)
 

sydeseet

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Looks like great machines said:
Capt,

Are you guys phasing out the falcons for the G450's or just adding some new birds?

Also, what was with the crowd of your folks I saw the other day at TEB. I think I counted three of your airplanes on the ramp at different times during the day. I overheard one crew mention the word "punishment" (smiling of course!)

Signed,

Curious in a hotel.....
 

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sydeseet said:
Capt,

Are you guys phasing out the falcons for the G450's or just adding some new birds?

Also, what was with the crowd of your folks I saw the other day at TEB. I think I counted three of your airplanes on the ramp at different times during the day. I overheard one crew mention the word "punishment" (smiling of course!)

Signed,

Curious in a hotel.....
The Falcon's are going to be phased out for G-550's / G-450's...

As far as why we were there... Well I could tell ya, but then I'd have to... well, you know the rest... ;)
 

sydeseet

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Falcon Capt said:
The Falcon's are going to be phased out for G-550's / G-450's...
What no 7X's???? Cool new rides though!


Falcon Capt said:
As far as why we were there... Well I could tell ya, but then I'd have to... well, you know the rest... ;)
Roger that!!!!!
 

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G450 Addendum

The 13,850-pound-thrust Tay 611-8C turbofans, though rated at the same takeoff thrust as the G400’s Tay 611-8s, provide 6 percent more thrust at 5,000 feet (ISA +15 degrees C) and 2 percent better fuel burn, giving the airplane 250-nm more range than the G400, for 4,350 nm at Mach 0.80. On a 3,000 nautical mile mission, the G450 will burn 1,300 pounds less fuel than the G400. The -8C also incorporates FADEC, a larger-diameter fan, modified high-pressure turbine and new bypass/core mixer. Maintenance intervals have been extended to 6,000 hours for midlife and 12,000 hours for full overhaul.

The GIV’s dispatch reliability rating is 99.7 percent, but Gulfstream still looked at addressing and upgrading those systems that historically required the most service attention. The company took the top 10 high-removal items on the GIV and were able to improve nine of them on the G450.

The more capable and reliable electrical power system of the G550 replaced the G400’s electrics. Two 40-kVA integrated drive generators and a 40-kVA APU generator provide improvements in electrical power capacity, no-break power transfer capability and added redundancy. A new Honeywell 36-150 APU provides improved reliability for engine starting, better performance for cabin temperature control and better high-altitude electrical power capacity. It also runs quieter than the G400’s APU.

Cabin comfort is enhanced by a dual-pack environmental control system based on the G550 air-cycle machines and a three-zone (cockpit plus two cabin zones) digital temperature control. A G550-style passive door seal and dual digital pressurization system give added redundancy and safety. Maximum cabin altitude has been reduced from 6,500 feet to 6,000 feet.

Other systems that the G450 shares with the G550 include the nose landing gear, nosewheel steering, oxygen system and fire-extinguishing system. The G450’s wing and tail are the same as those on the GIV/GIV-SP/G400.

Word on the street is that Ford would like to replace their Falcons with G350's.

Enjoy.....

GV
 
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