Future outlook for FedEx & UPS

[WinstonPilot]

I didn't want to come off as if military pilots were the only sharp pilots in the business. From personal experience I know a former RJ pilot who did most of his training in the late 80s and early 90s and logged 1900 hours of C-172 and C-150 time while trying to get picked up by a regional. When he was picked up in 96 by CC Air I think he had around 2500TT and in 99 he was picked up by Northwest with 4500TT. My point is, even when times are good surely they wouldn't give as much weight to someone with over a third of their time coming from 172s as someone who has been through a structured military training program.

 

[UPS Capt]

My point is, even when times are good surely they wouldn't give as much weight to someone with over a third of their time coming from 172s as someone who has been through a structured military training program.

They might...and don't call me Surely(Shirely)!

Don't kid yourself about hiring military over civilian time or what is better. This argument of military vs civilain backgrounds and hiring practices has been beaten to death on several forums. It's not the background so much as the individual involved. Good and bad pilots come from all sectors of aviation.

Also, it depends on what the other 2/3 of the person's time consist of. In your example, your friend had 2000 hrs of turbine time combined with his general aviation background for a grand total of 4500. You will have around 2000 total time...period. And, your turboprop (C130) time will be up against pure jet time of the RJ drivers.

Listen, you're doing fine. I'm sure you'll eventually get on with a major and probably in the next 5-7 years. It's just not a given, no matter what your background is or the amount of time you have, that some major airline will hire you. One thing I've learned in 20 years of airline flying is that luck and timing play a big part of the overall equation. There are just some things you can't control like the economy and hiring trends.

Good luck.

 

[Capt TedStriker]

Low time Pilots...and the "MAJORS"....

Winston pilot,

Do not be discouraged about the flight time "numbers" to be competitive to get hired... I have found that you will get hired by your attitude, persistance, and motivation before the flight times are taken into account. What I mean by this is that getting hired in a competitive job market means that you must network and have someone on the inside to get your application from the big stack (of 17,000 at UPS) to the small stack (less than 500). After you are in the small stack you must be relentless in you pursuit. Get SEVERAL recommendations from pilots/management from that company that will go to bat for you, get to know who the H.R. folks are...talk to them on the phone... meet them at airinc/obap/wia conferences, talk to other pilots, get the gouge from buds that have been through the process. Finally make it a full time job to get hired... follow-up every lead and keep your application updated at the minimum interval. The bottom line is that the numbers people talk about are "averages"... That means that some lucky b@stard gets in with less than the average - which could be you. This could me hundreds of seniority numbers and we all know what that means in this environment.

I say all of this because I flew C-130's and was called for interviews at NWA, DAL, AMR, and UPS for interviews. I had 2350 total flight time. By the way NWA AMR and UPS use 61.51 for logging flight time PIC so you end up logging half you time as PIC.
Fair or not... that is the way that the game is played... figure out who wants what on their applications and go with it... Everyone is different on PIC.

Good luck.... Life on the "other side" is better than can be imagined... hope to see you here soon,

Bleeding brown.

 

[P3tarbaby]

Winston,
just wanted to throw in my 2 cents. One thing that hasn´t come up in this thread yet is the fact that military guys typically don´t build time as fast as the civilian sector. I am now a reservist but I spent the last 5 years of my active duty time as a TAR (Training and Administration of Reserves) where I was active duty in a reserve squadron. For the last 5 years I have been the high flight time pilot in my squadron and I still only get about 300 hours a year. ANG Hercs may be different, but my point is that it took me 12.5 years on active duty to get where I am now and over 10 to be competive for the airlines. Guys that do training command tours can built time faster but you´re still talking 6-8 years minimum. And with the current job market, competetive mins are even higher. Who know´s what it will be in 3 years.

My recommendation: set your goals and don´t ever lose sight of them. Fly your a** off. NETWORK, NETWORK, NETWORK. In an ANG unit you´ll be flying with guys/gals from all the majors and that will be a HUGE advantage for you when you plunge into the job market. That is how I got my interview with Fedex last month and how I got my interview with Alaska next week.

Good luck.

 

[WinstonPilot]

Thanks for the Advice

I have a good idea of where I stand and how I need to get where I want to be. I sounds very similar to what I just went through to get a guard slot. I spent many hours networking, reading and preparing over a 6 month period in hopes of just getting one chance to interview(one for one).

During the interview one of the board members told me I could expect to stay very busy just "guard bumming". He said it was realistic to expect 600-800 hours a year if I wanted to work that much.

 

[46Driver]

Just curious to know if UPS counts helo time (I understand that FedEx does not). I know I have to meet the minimum multi-engine jet PIC requirements but do they count rotary wing time in the total time? Thanks.

 

[BrownTailGuy]

They used all of my helo time. I converted it to Part 61 time. It helped me. Of course the fixed wing time is a necessity but it was nice using those extra 1500 hours.

Don't sell yourself short. Include everything you can. And find someone at the company (preferably a management type and not necessarily a pilot type) to get friendly with.

Also get a line pilot or 20 to write recommendations for you. Walking resumes in to HR isn't what it used to be, but have you're buddies pester the HR folks once a month. Make sure your name is on their minds when it comes time to start sending out Flight Time Summary Sheets. If you get one of these, you are on the right path @ UPS.

Good Luck.

p.s. Hey Striker don't I know you? Peace...

 

[46Driver]

What is the minimum for UPS? 1000 PIC Jet or 1500? And I'm afraid to ask what the competitive mins are..... Thanks