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Furloughs and junior manning

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skypine69

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 22, 2002
Posts
796
I had lunch with a buddy that is at American Eagle the other day while I was on a layover and he told me that scheduling is junior manning pilots even though they have pilots on furlough. My question to those of you that fly that junior man trip is this: What the He!! is wrong with you??? Do you care that little about your fellow pilot that you will step on their backs to make a couple of extra bucks? Dont answer the phone on your days off or if they get you while on duty call in sick for it. I cant believe this is happening!!!! Put yourself in the position of the guy on furlough! You are collecting unemployment and your "buddy" is out making time and a half at your expense.

Disgusting!
 
Bingo

From one 'pine to another, well put man. I like it when I have to work 16 hour duty days or get fired because the company is too cheap to hire anyone new.
 
boscenter said:
Not as bad as those at CAL who flat out pick up open time w/ pilots on the street...

CAL? You can't possibly be foolish enough to think that this is just happening here and no where else.
 
I don't know of anyone who likes being jr. manned.
Generally, jr. manning is involuntary, i.e. the pilot has no choice. To refuse the assignment or call in sick while on duty to avoid it would be an illegal job action under the RLA and subject the pilot to termination.

What's bad is companies where pilots are furloughed and they are still picking up trips. CAL was mentioned.
Delta pilots are still putting in Green Slips. Now THAT's sad. I can't believe these are the same individuals that have the nerve to lecture us for "destroying the profession" with RJs. In my view, picking up trips voluntarily while your fellow pilots are on furlough is a form of scabbing driven by pure greed.
Sad times we are in.
 
ifly4food said:
Generally, jr. manning is involuntary, i.e. the pilot has no choice. To refuse the assignment or call in sick while on duty to avoid it would be an illegal job action under the RLA and subject the pilot to termination.

You sure about that illegal job action and RLA bit? I'm gonna take a stab without the facts to back me up, but my understanding is that the RLA doesn't govern a contract once it is signed, it is simply the "rules" of creating/amending a contract. Once a contract is signed, if it is perceived to be violated, either side can grieve the dispute in a predetermined manner (generally a system board with a neutral arbitrator...not employed by the NMB).

In the case of refusing an assignment, if the company perceives the individual pilot did not adhere to the rules of such assignment, disipline can be involved. But this discipline will not include the NMB, court injunctions, a PEB, congress, the president, nor the Sec. of Trans. (who does not fall under the RLA, but somehow has managed to get involved in recent years). These are all things that would happen with an "illegal job action" vs. individual disipline.

As for jr. manning itself, I remember the CoEx contract said you had to be "legal and available" to accept the assignment. Lots of things could make you not legal and unavailable and I was always happy to discuss this with my chief pilot the next time I came to the airport ..... Delta has somewhat similar wording, but the bottom line is if reporting to work means you have to leave your 2 year old home alone, you don't have to go in.

Don't forget, it's your legal duty FAR wise to inform the company you are unable to fly if you feel sick or fatigued... to do otherwise puts your licence in jeapordy.



What's bad is companies where pilots are furloughed and they are still picking up trips. CAL was mentioned.
Delta pilots are still putting in Green Slips. Now THAT's sad. I can't believe these are the same individuals that have the nerve to lecture us for "destroying the profession" with RJs. In my view, picking up trips voluntarily while your fellow pilots are on furlough is a form of scabbing driven by pure greed.
Sad times we are in.

How true this is... at DAL however, most of the folks that are greedslipping probably couldn't point out the differance between an RJ and an ATR in Atlanta neverless be aware of the effects the regional carriers are having on their airline.... all they see is $$$$
 
To make myself clear I am talking about any pilot that flys a trip that should have been covered by a reserve. It seems very easy to me to get out of it......1) dont answer your phone unless you know who it is. 2) If they get while at work for a later date, when that day rolls around simply call in sick.
Maybe I have living in a fantasy world thinking that we would all pull together. I guess its all about the money for me me me!
Sad!
 
It seems that IFF feels that anything he does to help out his fellow pilots is illegal, and could subject him to termination. Well, that may be true. We had several pilots terminated before our strike, and we asked for your help and were refused for this reason. Sometimes you have to do things that are "illegal" to get what you want or need. We did it for you, but it seems that many people are not willing to do it for someone else.
 
Doesn't make sense IFF...

You mean you can't say... "OOOPS... sorry I JUST had a beer" and especially on your day off without getting canned? Naaaaaaaaw!!!!

Not to mention if it's for days ahead... you can't call in sick?!
 
Sig:
FlyingSig said:
You sure about that illegal job action and RLA bit? I'm gonna take a stab without the facts to back me up, but my understanding is that the RLA doesn't govern a contract once it is signed, it is simply the "rules" of creating/amending a contract. Once a contract is signed, if it is perceived to be violated, either side can grieve the dispute in a predetermined manner (generally a system board with a neutral arbitrator...not employed by the NMB).

The RLA differs from the NLRA in that an "organized service interruption" (self help) is illegal except under certain conditions. It was designed during the railroad days to prevent labor disputes from interrupting service. It governs before, during, and after contracts are signed. The only conditions self help it legal is the endgame of negotiations when both parties are released to a cooling off period which expires without an agreement.

In short, calling in sick and refusing trips to support furloughed pilots would be illegal self help. It would subject you to being fired and your union to being fined. This is supported in both the Comair and Delta negotiations when a judge ruled both parties had engaged in illegal self help by refusing overtime and calling in sick. An injunction was issued prohibiting such action.

SDD:
I'm not sure where you're going with this one. I suggested it would be illegal to refuse a jr. man or extension, but nothing is stopping pilots from not picking up "greed trips". How did we get to a lack of support for Comair?
BTW, for the last time, if you want to carry out an illegal job action and expose yourself and your MEC to that risk, that's fine. Just don't ask another group to take that risk for you. Also don't be bitter that we wouldn't risk our jobs to "show support" for you.

Freight Dog, Skypine:
Let me be clear. If you're home, then DUH, don't answer the phone.
I'm talking about when you call in range and you get the "call crew scheduling" message. Not much you can do about that one.
 
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