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[Sluggo_63]

New to the forum and already loving it. It's kind of like expressing an opinon on the crew bus and then waiting to get blasted by the ever present "expert". Anyway, here goes. I'll wait for the road shows, etc to vote but leaning towards "no". Single issue, I don't thinkl so. How about retro pay calculation, taxing my deadhead bank, and no change in substitution for starters. "You may fire when ready, Gridley."

Not blasting, but the way I read it, it's only taxable if you're deviating to/from your base (i.e. Memphis). Not your deadhead bank.
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A pilot shall designate on his online expense report any claim for deviation travel expenses incurred while commuting to or from his base. The amount of such claim that is allowed/reimbursed shall be included in the pilot's income as taxable compensation and all applicable taxes will be withheld.

So, looking at it as a commuter, I'm usually never deviating to/from Memphis (my base). Only to/from my home.

That's my $.02. Does that make me the crew-bus expert? I hope not...

 

[Purpledog]

There are some goods. However, a 1% increase in B fund? YGTBSM! The 55 y.o. plus pilots made out like bandits, shocker. Since I don't ever plan on long haul international, retirement is a long way off, and I never fly more than I have to, I don't really see many improvements. I am curious about all those grids and blended duties etc... Possibly a good solution to circadium rythym ruining.

 

[Laughing_Jakal]

Sluggo, that's the way I read it too. Guys using their deadhead banks to get to reserve duty or recurrent will get boned a little.

For those voting "no"....let me ask you who is going to negotiate the contract you want instead of this one. Since the MEC and Negotiating committee completly endorsed this, then voting no is a no confidence vote...which means that the Negotiating Commmittee does not speak for you. Then it is back to square one. You going to go negotiate your own? Honestly...this is pretty much it. Take it or leave it. Unless you are willing to go on from here without an amendable contract, you better not vote no.

Being pissed because your retro pay isn't as "high as it should be" is immature and short sighted. Better than going without an ammended contract, or are you going to do singlehandedly what the negotiating committee couldn't do in 2.5 years... you're all piss and vinegar. Besides, show me a guy who bitches about the retro pay calculation, and I'll show you a guy who was whoring at the trough on drf and vlt so as to boost his hours he figured would be used to calculate his retro pay.

 

[WorldOnTime]

There are some goods. However, a 1% increase in B fund? YGTBSM! The 55 y.o. plus pilots made out like bandits, shocker. Since I don't ever plan on long haul international, retirement is a long way off, and I never fly more than I have to, I don't really see many improvements. I am curious about all those grids and blended duties etc... Possibly a good solution to circadium rythym ruining.

So you are NEVER going to retire? I bet it sneaks up on you faster than you expect.

 

[WorldOnTime]

Not blasting, but the way I read it, it's only taxable if you're deviating to/from your base (i.e. Memphis). Not your deadhead bank.
​

A pilot shall designate on his online expense report any claim for deviation travel expenses incurred while commuting to or from his base. The amount of such claim that is allowed/reimbursed shall be included in the pilot's income as taxable compensation and all applicable taxes will be withheld.

So, looking at it as a commuter, I'm usually never deviating to/from Memphis (my base). Only to/from my home.

That's my $.02. Does that make me the crew-bus expert? I hope not...

Sluggo, I prefer to think of you more as the "Crew Room Prophet". Or "The Creepy Guy In The Crashpad That Sneaks Into My Room".

 

[SNIZ]

Summary

Guys,

A couple of the council updates on the FDX ALPA Web Page have a few bulleted summaries of some of the key points. Something to look at until the hard copy gets delivered.

 

[bratacus]

A little bait and wham. You don't cast aspersions to others who who have opinions different than yours and I will not ask what number wife you are on or whatever it is that makes you so pissed off, deal? Tell me, if we do indeed vote this down, what next? Do we look at fixing major sticking points or as you say we go back to square one. Why is there a vote called for if it's all or nothing. What is so bad about taking a little longer? We've been negotiating for 2 1/2 years already. I don't think it's shortsighted to want an eqitable retro pay, either. I sure remember a lot of retro stickers on a lot of folks bags. What equation was used? Why is the wide body Capt offer to 30 k vice 17 k for a widebody FO. Capt's pay scales aren't twice as high as FO's so this doesn't make sense to me. Just a line guy wodering.

 

[Flapjack]

Why are captains getting 30K / FOs only 17.7K?

60% of 30K = 18K

FO's make approx. 60% of captain pay, FO signing bonus is about 60% of CA bonus

 

[Purpled]

Why are captains getting 30K / FOs only 17.7K?

60% of 30K = 18K

FO's make approx. 60% of captain pay, FO signing bonus is about 60% of CA bonus

That $17700 equates to a retro hourly rate of 111.5. Not exactly what an WB FO makes. Is that enough to make someone vote no? Hopefully not alone, but don't be dazzled by the numbers, go to a road show and have the whole thing explained and then we can decide.

Peace!

 

[Haywood]

Anyone else notice that the 73 and 75 are worked in as narrow body pay rates...or am I just misinformed?

 

[DornierPilot]

A-380 rates

I'm looking forward to the road show presentations. I'm sure that most of my questions will be answered such that I'll be able to make a much more informed decision than I would be able to at the moment.

I was suprised to see how little difference there was from wide body to A-380. I mean, the company will be generating double the revenue per leg of an MD-11 flight. I wasn't expecting double the pay rate, but you have to admit that the hourly crew costs (even with double augmentation) for the A-380 will amount to a grain of sand in a very large hourglass!

Re: my vote. My Negotiating Committee speaks for my and if there is a unanimous vote from the committee and the MEC, that is a really strong indication for a yes vote. (After the road show presentation, I'll be able to determine if it is really just a huge conspiracy by the NC/MEC to trick us into accepting a subpar agreement!)

IMHO, the reason we have crewmember ratification is so that if a TA was presented that did not have unanimous support of the NC and/or the MEC, the crewmembers would have the final say so.

I think it will be pretty hard to justify not supporting a 100% buy-in from the members closest involved for the last 2-1/2 years.

Of course, I could be drowning in ALPA koolaide - time will tell.

A side note: I did think it significant that the UPS agreement passed by 56%. I have to think that UPS management toasted that result - only missing their target of 51% by 5% would have to be considered a success in most peoples' minds. Let's hope the UPS pilots are not split from this vote and that their agreement is much better than the final vote of support indicated!!!

 

[jdec141]

Re: my vote. My Negotiating Committee speaks for my and if there is a unanimous vote from the committee and the MEC, that is a really strong indication for a yes vote. (After the road show presentation, I'll be able to determine if it is really just a huge conspiracy by the NC/MEC to trick us into accepting a subpar agreement!)

Well Said!

 

[FlyBoeingJets]

Since I don't ever plan on long haul international, retirement is a long way off, and I never fly more than I have to, I don't really see many improvements.

Not planning on long haul international? While the domestic side is good, it shrank year over year. More is being shipped by truck, like UPS. International will continue to fund growth as the domestic side is now fully mature.

 

[Sluggo_63]

Sluggo, I prefer to think of you more as the "Crew Room Prophet". Or "The Creepy Guy In The Crashpad That Sneaks Into My Room".

"Creepy?" You're the one prancing around in a sundress, pumps and a bonnet.

Don't ever stop... by the way... your mattress is lumpy.

 

[PurpleInMEM]

Not planning on long haul international? While the domestic side is good, it shrank year over year. More is being shipped by truck, like UPS. International will continue to fund growth as the domestic side is now fully mature.

Agreed. But it still requires a lot of air effort to get the job done. You're not going to truck a package from MIA to SEA overnight. Due to better yield management and price increases the domestic side still recorded growth despite modestly declining volume.

I'm not planning on international either. Just the thought makes my skin crawl. Best part about this place is that I don't have to if I don't want to.

Choice is a beautiful thing.

Concerning the TA. So far my review hasn't revealed anything that would be so adverse to the narrowbody arena that would cause me to say nay, but I'll reserve my 'final answer' until after the road show.

 

[JerkyHerky]

I'd like to heap more derision on the guy who complained about no improvements to the vacation system....Listen sport, the committee gave up lots of radical improvement to other facets of the contract in order to preserve the vacation system. Management was gunning for a new and more "productive" system and pilots placed a lot of emphasis on keeping the one we have now, even at the expense of some other improvemets. No other company has a system that allows the same flexibility, etc.

 

[Purpledog]

So you are NEVER going to retire? I bet it sneaks up on you faster than you expect.

You and I agree on that for sure. That's why I think it is silly changing the A plan instead of going for great improvements to our B. How about 13% like UPS. The "A" is a dinosaur and I'll be surprised if it's around in another 15+ years. I'd rather have a bird in hand instead of an IOU from Fred.

 

[sandman2122]

You guys keep saying the A Fund "won't be around in 15 years", next thing you know MANAGEMENT will pick up on this and make it happen.

 

[DallasGatr]

Was in Mem last night listening to one of the MEC reps talking TA. Was very impressed at how satisfied the MEC was with the contract. Little or no decension, which surprised me. WE BASICALLY GOT OUR OCT OFFER. That is huge. You can gripe about the smallish bonus or this or that, but when you get what you ask for......

 

[Babylon]

Just read thru the thing on an 8 hr ocean crossing. Overall, yes it does seem like we got most of what the negotiating committee wanted. Some notes:

- have to hear more on the "grid" but initially it doesn't sound so great - allows a 14 hour layover on an intl leg - just got done with a 1.5 hour cab ride which is not uncommon - 14 hrs is not sufficient
- Rig change not until 2008 - that is ridiculous!
- some improvements to health care - except for the $35/copay for name brand prescription drugs
- deviation bank tax thing - like to hear that better explained
- Trip Trade website - it's been in the current contract since signing but does this mean the company will actually put some effort into it?
- Agency Shop - forces everyone to pay except for those people not allowed into ALPA for one reason or another - or face being fired - welcome Fox Hunter
- Improvements on viewing open time and reserve predictions- if "system allows" will be able to see all open time and not just 40+ hrs into future - reserve predictions via the computer seem pretty good showing much more data than current
- pay rates - sure our table position was 8%DOS + 4% but that was 2 years ago - certainly there should be a better improvement as our pay as continued to deflate - the pay raise in the TA is worse than the guaranteed COLA folks on FICA get
- block override - company's proposal to capture seemed better to me - we now only capture everything over 8 - will make those RFO pairings nice but I would think that capturing all over 6 for 2 man crew and 9 for 3 man crew would have worked out better in our favor (Company's proposal)
- intl override increase - better but still way below the standard that most carriers get for flying intl
- per diem increase - what a joke - 5cents/yr for 2 years - why did they even waste the time discussing that chapter - it's not like stuff hasn't gotten real expensive in Asia or anything
- scope improvements? other than that letter of intentions is there anything?

Basically what I see is that UPS got huge improvements and we got very minor ones to match theirs. Does that mean that UPS company was willing to give up more $$ or that their union negotiated better?