Frontier/SWA

[Megalops]

Glad to take it,overjoyed if it worked that way.

 

[texman]

Sounds like the consensus will be a Morris like integration. Pay protected but stapled to the bottom.

That should make most people happy. SWA F/Os don't get screwed and the Frontier Capts. get pay. Best you can get when getting bought out. Otherwise I think SWA will dump'em like the ATA crew.

Yes I can agree to that. It would be sad to see the F9 pilots on the street but I would perfer just like every JR SWA pilot or all would want, staple.

 

[Poahi]

Why does SWA need to buy Frontier to compete in DEN?

They can't find 737's?
They need RJ's?
They don't know how to market seats?
Gate space?
They afraid of RAH?

It's not making much sense to me...

 

[fflyerworld]

With SWAPA rejecting a 5 year agreement in early June this opens up any potential integration with Frontier pilots. Wouldn't it be something if Frontier insists that their pilots be integrated in a 1 for 2 or 1 for 3 slotting as part of any agreement to accept SWA proposal. Not sure if this is good or bad and for whom?

 

[Fly-diver]

Why does SWA need to buy Frontier to compete in DEN?

They can't find 737's?
They need RJ's?
They don't know how to market seats?
Gate space?
They afraid of RAH?

It's not making much sense to me...

Here's why it makes sense.

1. Buying the competition is cheaper and much quicker than a protracted battle.
2. F9 flies international, SWA doesn't (but wants to).
3. F9 flies to ATL, SWA doesn't (but wants to).
4. F9 comes with Lynx, SWA wants a feeder system to takeover some of their smaller markets.

 

[shootr]

Don't get me wrong, I do want a fair integration. However, I think the WN pilots have a bit more leverage than the F9 pilots. Southwest does not want a union versus union war and has publicly stated that there will be no deal if the unions can not come to a negotiated agreement. There will be no arbitration and a forced A/M merger because with no integration agreement there will be no purchase. What happens to F9 pilots if SWA does not purchase them? Republic?! The choice seems easy to me and F9 guys I've talked to seem to agree.

Good luck to all involved. If it goes through, I hope it can be worked out to a point that we can all be fairly satisfied.

shootr

PS For shearedshaft, if your beloved TA1 had passed, we would have had no choice but to abide by A/M in a purchase/merger. Now it is in the company's best interest to get us onboard with this. Interesting that they have already stated this is how they want to handle it.

 

[TWA Dude]

My perception of the reason the TWA guys got screwed was they agreed to not fight it in court.

Not accurate, there was no such agreement. (Indeed, a DFR suit is still winding its way through the courts.) What sunk the TWA pilots was the bankruptcy judge forcing us to give up the successorship clause in our contract. Without any contractual protection or leverage the APA was free to have their way with us.

I certainly wish the best for the Frontier pilots but unless the Bond-McKaskill law applies the SW pilots are going to protect their own (that's a euphemism for stapling).

 

[bravodude]

Yea, I remember something along those lines when SWA injected 50some million into ATA.... That was awsome. I think it lasted about 2 years? Not quite... life after SWA


Great business plan for SWA bad for everyone else.

thats right we injected 50 mill we didnt buy them. get your facts straight, The F9 guys are welcome here as far as I'm concerned.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Will the F9 pilots be required to buy a type rating in the 737?


had to go there...

 

[shearedshaft]

PS For shearedshaft, if your beloved TA1 had passed, we would have had no choice but to abide by A/M in a purchase/merger. Now it is in the company's best interest to get us onboard with this. Interesting that they have already stated this is how they want to handle it.

That's a good point. I read it to protect SWAPA pilots if we ever were purchased, but perhaps the reverse would be true as well.

 

[Flying the Line]

That's a good point. I read it to protect SWAPA pilots if we ever were purchased, but perhaps the reverse would be true as well.

Shasta pilots could have also staked a claim for integration as well.

 

[thruthemurk]

Dont bet on it. I wish the F9 pilots the best of luck. If F9 plays there cards right they will be very happy. JMO

Did the ATA pilots play their cards poorly?? Wow- tough crowd.

 

[stlflyguy]

Not accurate, there was no such agreement. (Indeed, a DFR suit is still winding its way through the courts.) What sunk the TWA pilots was the bankruptcy judge forcing us to give up the successorship clause in our contract. Without any contractual protection or leverage the APA was free to have their way with us.

I certainly wish the best for the Frontier pilots but unless the Bond-McKaskill law applies the SW pilots are going to protect their own (that's a euphemism for stapling).

...firing that torpedo was ALPA National's own advisors stating "you HAVE to give up scope...."

 

[starchkr]

Why does SWA need to buy Frontier to compete in DEN?

They can't find 737's?
They need RJ's?
They don't know how to market seats?
Gate space?
They afraid of RAH?

It's not making much sense to me...

The biggest reason i can think of is the fact that they are fighting a losing battle against us right now. SWA thought for sure that F9 would have been gone a long time ago after they came into the market, but we fought back and are still around, at least for the most part. It will be easier for them to buy us and do something with us than keep losing money fighting us, especially if we get a large backing of cash to keep puting up the fight. Plus i know they would kill, no pun intended, for those A gates...no more having to get pax to the C gates on that darn train, and they could get their birds visible to EVERYONE who drives into the airport.

 

[Vne]

firing that torpedo was ALPA National's own advisors stating "you HAVE to give up scope...."

Oh you mean our current FAA Administrator! and former ALPA President???

Their time is comming......$$$$$$$