Food for thought

[moxiepilot]

Mkubwa-
I think that your idea excludes one major portion of pilots, general aviation. Your idea strictly targets the professional and while that might have been the intention the only thing it would effictively do is raise the cost of a certificate.

Allow me to explain. Theoretically, anyone with enough time and money can come across a commercial or ATP rating by sheer persistence. Therefore you are shrinking the pool of applicants but not the ability of the applicant to be any better than the average current pilot. Point if case, bad doctors. Any idiot can become a doctor. That is not to say the majority isn't the most highly skilled, but I hear stories all the time of specialists who really shouldn't practice.

Does that lead to higher salaries? Maybe, but those higher salaries might just be what it takes to pay off training debt. Having worked for a number of doctors and seen their financial plight, pilots are no better off.

As for not allowing someone who has not lived in the country for 15 years to not be employed as a pilot is xenophobic and is no different than stating that a black person can't be a captain unless they've hung out with white people for 15 years. That's a crock.

I think I understand what the essence of that part of your query is, but wholeheartedly disagree. Basically what you're stating is that the pilot has to fly as a private pilot for 15 years. Which means at a 10 year career would have had to moved here at 35 years old. I didn't have this career change until about then.

Overall, interesting suggestion

 

[svcta]

In order to once and for all end the "you don't like it, get another job" crap:

Why is there anything wrong with trying to improve certain aspects of a job that you would otherwise(or already do) enjoy?

Oh, that right. There isn't. So why don't we focus on the ideas rather than the intent.

---Posted by paulsalem:
"Or the increase in pilot demand will increase the costs where buisness will not be able to afford pilots. (or less money to maintain aircraft, resulting in poorer working conditions) Airline tickets will rise, resulting in even higher airfares, less pax for airliners, and therefore less demand for pilots."

Airline tickets need to be priced higher; airline travel is not a god-given right. If you can't afford it, do what they did before deregulation: take a car. It is expensive to operate an airplane. You should know that. The flying public these days is not the same, either. It's one of the things that disappoints me the most about going to the airport.

Also, the market will bear whatever the pilot base demands. Pilots alone probably accounted(in the good days, even) for about for about 5-10% of an airplane's operating cost. That's cheap staffing. It's poor management that ruins airlines, not pilot wages. Think of all the things that go aboard the average airliner: Mail, cargo, fresh fruit, seafood, flowers, donor organs(not so fresh). People will not do without these things, and they'll pay an extra few cents for a Peruvian plum if they have to and not even think about it. So, uh.....think about it.

 

[pilotyip]

No college required then

So do it like Europe, no college degree required, they take 18 year olds and turn them into airline pilots after a year in Arizona. It that what you talking about doing to raise the bar?

 

[Sunnfun]

So do it like Europe, no college degree required, they take 18 year olds and turn them into airline pilots after a year in Arizona. It that what you talking about doing to raise the bar?

Well, if you're talking about the Lufthansa Flightschool in Arizona, one of the entry requirements for them is the A-Level, german equivalent of a 3-year college degree... And as far as I know, the requirements for the KLM, British Airways and other cadet programs do include A-Levels as well.

Oh, and just for the record: I like the US-Way much better. The european training is way to focused on groundschool and especially on teaching crap that you'll never need anyways. Average cost for a frozen ATP with about 300 hrs of flight time is about $60,000, thankyouverymuch.

 

[Clutch_Cargo]

Hmmm... do European pilots have higher salaries, better working conditions, and realistic career opportunities over time? I don't think they do although the playing field gets closer to level everyday. But that isn't due to the number of pilots, it's due to the state of the industry. Whatever the case... bad idea. If EU training were so much better than US training then foreigners coming over here to train would have a hell of a time getting a job back home.

cc

 

[Sunnfun]

If EU training were so much better than US training ...

It is not. And that's the reason why JAA made it so difficult to convert anything to JAA save a Private Pilot Certificate. It is just very well protected. H.ell, just converting an IFR requires additional training and a checkride in some countries. Guess they haven't noticed all those US trained US Pilots flying big airliners into EU airspace on IFR flight plans every day...

 

[Clutch_Cargo]

It is not. And that's the reason why JAA made it so difficult to convert anything to JAA save a Private Pilot Certificate. It is just very well protected.

EXACTLY!

 

[anjinoo7]

Great idea with the protectionism aspect, truly a pro union belief. Incidentally, the EU is the centerpiece of unions and we can see by their 15% unemployment rate this has really worked out for them.
I seem to recall recently that Air Italia wanted the EU to slap British Airways because they were offering lower fares than Italia in and out of Italy.
It's called the free market, competition etc. We see it every day and that is what allows us to have so many choices, choose the best product at the lowest price, and demand the best performance. What's amazing is that the history of a market free in this country has made you a lucky person. You were fortunate enough to be born here and fall into the lap of the resulting economy our forefathers helped design. If we were anything like the EU, you would be talking about how to go to another country to train and work instead of talking about protecting your own gravy train.