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Flexjet Scamagement Redefines Lying

shanes123

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any other details of interest in the stick all your hands in the BS? I wasn't able to listen to the meeting I was busy taking a nap.
 

Imissmypilot

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However he did allude to the fact that they could end up with something similar. He did not say that the arbitrator would not change anything.

Well we'll have to wait for transcripts because that's exactly what he said; it is not the arbritrators job to dictate to him how to run his business.

Kenn has a hard-on for an SFO program and will get it one way or another. It is the entire premise of his book. So yes the book is utter BS in some ways but even when he lies in print (like salary disclosures) it tells you so much about what drives him. Kenn is a control freak and not even a federal judge let alone a puny arbitrator will reign him in - that was the message from that question.

Kenn only wants 10-20% as his sycophantic idol worshippers though. Why is in his book. And those spots are already filled with old Options. So if I were a Red Label guy/gal, I'd start to think long and hard about how Ricci will twist the SLI and whatever the arbritrator decides to right the ship back to his vision.
 

doh

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What is the definition of scumbag?
 

GlorifiedCabbie

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I heard most of it while I was taking a dump. He was glad Uber doesn't work in aviation... because they go after the low end, so no worries from them. He went on to talk about what the arbitrator can and cannot do. I didn't know he could tell the arbitrator what to do. And last but not least, the subject of salaries. He claims that will be dealt with under section 6, "and we are not there yet." The day of fair pay will never happen unless he is forced.
 

dime line

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If this MCBA isn't good, there will be no Section 6, he's not negotiating now, why would he all of a sudden negotiate Section 6
 

GlorifiedCabbie

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He will continue to lower the morale. What many of the Flex pilots haven't figured out yet is, he will suck out the goodwill and your love of flying. It doesn't have to be that way, but that's the way he wants it. We had LX tail #'s that became known as Lowered Expectations. Next he used FL tail #'s that became known as Further Lowered. How can he claim we are going after NetJets when he keeps aiming for his own feet?
 

dime line

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Yea that one still rattles my brain, the "Going after NetJets" concept. How does he really, or does he really think he can go after NJ. Were smaller than we were 18 years ago RTA/FLOPS , and were smaller than we were 2 years ago RTA/FLOPS/FLEX. I heard that we lost 100 pilots (FLEX/FLOPS) since the SLI list was published. I have also heard that we have a lot of over 60 pilots (FLEX/FLOPS), maybe 200 or so, so in the next 5 years how many will we loose? Also how about the 40-50 VSeperation guys.
 

V1 Rotate

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Yea that one still rattles my brain, the "Going after NetJets" concept. How does he really, or does he really think he can go after NJ. Were smaller than we were 18 years ago RTA/FLOPS , and were smaller than we were 2 years ago RTA/FLOPS/FLEX. I heard that we lost 100 pilots (FLEX/FLOPS) since the SLI list was published. I have also heard that we have a lot of over 60 pilots (FLEX/FLOPS), maybe 200 or so, so in the next 5 years how many will we loose? Also how about the 40-50 VSeperation guys.

Prior to the VSP date of 4/30, Flexjet alone had lost 10% of its pilots since the merger in December, 2013. I don't know the exact number of VSP takers but I think it's around 25, which is another 7-8%.
 

GlorifiedCabbie

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There has been 62 pilots leave. Some took the VSP and some just walked. Why would a PIC with 17 years in just walk out with less than 1 hour prior to a live leg? I think this place has a morale problem.
 

shanes123

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I think you will see more of that hopefully. Anyone leaving should do it that way. When it costs them money then and only then will they take notice.
 

Imissmypilot

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If this MCBA isn't good, there will be no Section 6, he's not negotiating now, why would he all of a sudden negotiate Section 6

Winner winner chicken dinner.

Yet another card played in his union busting playbook. He (through his management stooges) is attempting to force a mediocre outcome from arbitration with the argument everything can be shored up and improved during section 6; all the while knowing this union will be voted out/decertified with anything less than across the board broad improvements.

I certainly hope the union is able to help the arbitrator understand any attempts he thinks he is making toward "reason" and "stability" toward the "goal" of negotiating improvements during section 6 is a play right from Ricci's own union busting schema. I do not think it is an overstatement to say we need to get this arbritrator to understand he holds the power to either redefine aviation unions everywhere (by doing too little) or stabilize our sector of the industry for years to come by giving us the contract we deserve now. Right freaking now.

Otherwise, this whole thing is farce and a big flipping joke. And pilots will serve as both the punchline and the punch bag.
 

GlorifiedCabbie

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A mediocre contract is only going to demoralize the pilots further. Getting voted out/decertified is a longshot. The first time the Union got voted down, The pilots got treated worst than rodents. That was when the management team showed their true colors. Now we have pilots facing disciplinary action that are doing some very stupid things. When asked why you did something so stupid, the reply was " I just don't care anymore." They let major mistakes slide while they literally make a federal case out of something minor. I remember this place without representation, and I don't want to return to those dark days. All it takes is one or two people in CGF what are on some ego trip to try to make your life miserable.
 
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jetwash

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" I just don't care anymore." .

Almost every pilot I have recently flown with has the" I don't give a $hit" attitude now.
They are just going through the motions.

Not a good image for a company which tries to sell superior service.
 

doh

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Did I not predict this? And the yammer tools poo pooed it. I've been through this before...and it was scumbag management from Ohio then too. Is there something in the water up there that makes them such Sch!ttheads??
 

993_Pilot

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I hope that I am wrong, but my gut tells me that it is unlikely the arbitrator will make us the industry leading anything, so I wouldn't be expecting a great contract from the arbitrator, if I was a pilot at this company. What we will get, is everyone covered under the same contract, fences down, probably very little more than current Flexjet pay, and hopefully everything done via seniority bidding. My reasoning is that this MCBA is basically to get everyone under the same contract (pay, work rules, etc.), and will be immediately amendable. Once we get a MCBA, the Flexjet pilots who are reluctant to openly support the union, will no longer have anything to fear nor any cause to remain in the shadows. So, if we want an industry leading contract, we are going to need industry leading solidarity, and we will need to negotiate it with management ourselves. I'll say it again... Our real chance for an industry leading contract will be AFTER we get the MCBA, not during, and will be a direct reflection and result of the strength and solidarity of this union going forward. In my personal opinion, everyone should set their expectations accordingly, and don't blame the union when the arbitrator hands us less than you think we deserve.
 
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GlorifiedCabbie

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KR has always had the used car salesman mindset. Promise one thing, deliver on another. What every happened to "having the highest paid pilots in the industry"? Not some footnote referring only to his 10% FOK club.
 

doh

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Six months to get a private? Seems rather long.
 

Honorstudent

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I guess being a professional aviator is in the eye of the beholder. Hell some Pilots think flying broke airplanes or flying tired, sick and hungry is being a professional aviator.
 

doh

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I guess being a professional aviator is in the eye of the beholder. Hell some Pilots think flying broke airplanes or flying tired, sick and hungry is being a professional aviator.

No, they know it's not professional. They just think it will not end in an incident or accident. Management has spent a lot of time paying lip service to "normalization of deviation", but in practice they encourage this unprofessional behavior. And they reward it.
 
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