Flex FYI!

[G4dude]

Wifeys

Every time MY wife reads a post by NJWife, her blood pressure goes up 30 points! We measured it, even! She especially enjoys the frequency of the word, "exploit" straight out of Das Kapital.

 

[HeyHomer]

WOW! nothing like a cat fight, shame we can't get some jello and bikinis. Flexo I totally understand what you are saying, Flex, DG, and handchuck don't have a clue. unfortunately neither do a lot of the rank and file. I left for several reasons but the fact that some just want to get an extra hunderd a day (which by the way after uncle sam and that fine new insurance program you have in place, takes a bite you get more through per diem) than QOL issues like days off to be with your family or enjoy hobbies, or just the simple fact of having some control over your life rather than letting the man (or Canadian) run it for you!! people (and I mean everyone, not just pilots and aviation people) wake up and take control of your destiny live life and quit your BITCHING!!! if you don't like it change it, be a part of A solution!! Flex Netjets United, NWA DAL FDX, UPS and anyone else you want to throw into the pot were not created to raise you, they are in the business to make MONEY!!! you CHOSE to go and work there, and if plans changed oh well, there is no reality only perception, so you can live in the clouds and wear rose colored glasses (pilotwife, sorry had to do it) or go out and grab what it is that you want!!
Have A Nice Day!!
I am
HH

 

[netjetwife]

Those who choose to exercise their right to organize and bargain ARE going after what they want! They are being resourceful and hard-working. What's not to admire about that? To the lady with the blood pressure problem I offer this advice--use the ignore feature. When people continue to complain about a problem, rather than solve it, you have to question their reasons. The same can be said of Flex pilots who haven't turned in their cards. This is your chance to play an active role in your career. If you squander it, I hope you'll have the good graces to keep your complaints to yourself in the future.

I'm not surprised that there are wives, whose husbands make professional wages, that feel no sympathy for those married to pilots that don't. That "got mine" attitude isn't held only by the pilots. I've had plenty of PMs from wives who see things as I do and know how difficult it is to watch your husband's skills being taken advantage of...better cover your eyes....exploited, in other words. I think that many of those who post here tend to forget that there are many more who just read the board. I know because I hear from them regularly and they don't share your opinions. Everyone knows...no matter what the fight is about...that it is easy to throw in the towel. Those who stand up and insist on a place at the table, where decisions are made that affect careers and families, are doing the right thing and deserve our respect and support. I will continue to let them know that they have mine. Those who aren't interested should put me on their ignore list.
NJW

 

[SCT]

NJW,

Serious, straight foward question for you: In a free market, capitalistic society, how are the skills of your husband being "exploited"?

As I understand it your husband has the option of working for or not working for any company.
On the other hand a company sets a wage they are willing to pay a worker to do a certian job based on the industry average wage and the companies own cost of providing a service or product. If a company can not attract quality people then the industry average wage goes higher. On the other hand, if there is a surplus of workers willing to do a certian job, then the wage stays low or stagnant.

Just because your husband is not happy with his current wage.....it does not mean he is being exploited.

 

[netjetwife]

My husband is currently happy with the contract that he helped bring about. Before that his skills were being exploited because of the misinformation he was given in his interview. The old broken promises routine that is all too familiar to frac pilots was a standard practice until new leadership among the pilot group stepped in to insist on pilots being given accurate information in the interviews. Arbitrarily changing company policies that affect wages after one has taken the job is another form of exploitation facing other frac pilots.

Pilots also have the option in our society of collectively bargaining with the company for the contract that meets their needs. They have the skills/product that the company/consumer wants and as such have a right to participate in setting the price. The frac industry average wage is now higher because the NJ pilots considered limiting the supply (by striking) of the product (their labor) they were producing. That was also their prerogative, an alternative most chose rather than the option of quitting and going to another company. It is not the one way street that you would have people believe. There are around 2,300 pilots and their families at NJ that have personal experience with the other direction things can go.

I happen to know (because of my front row seat) that there are numerous important areas of joint concern that 1108 and NJA are working on together for the good of all. Belonging to a union can be a very positive experience and working with one can, as well. It all depends on the people involved and the attitude they take. When both sides--labor and management--work to find common ground and solutions that are fair to all, everyone benefits.

Things have really turned around at NJ and I know that that is possible at the other fracs, too. I post to encourage other frac pilots/families to take an active role in improving their own situations and to support those that are in the process of doing so. Their companies fight them tooth and nail, instead of working for fair solutions. I view that as a form of exploitation. This is the definition that I use--The selfish or unfair using of someone or something for one's own advantage.

 

[SCT]

NutJetWife,

You could "spin" an anvil.

SCT

 

[ArtVandalay]

Pilots wife,

Like you said, I have no idea who your husband is; however, don't you find it interesting that I knew he was in the training center by his post?? It's because the people in the training center DO NOT live in reality and, can be spotted quicker than a virgin on prom night. They fly less than 100 hours a year and YES most are what I call "company bitches". They all hob-knob with the DO and chief pilots at lunch and eventually what you have is a company whore.

I don't know about anyone else on here but, if I found out my wife was a member of this board and posted on it often, I would be completely embarrased because she has nothing to do with aviation. It is so funny that you think posting on here "supports" your husband. All it proves is that outside of shopping, you have nothing else to do. To quote from a movie "you have all you can handle with your tea and your little spoon"...

 

[netjetwife]

SCT, I merely showed the readers the other side of the coin. I have no problem defending my position because I have "right" and "success" on my side. The NJ pilots exercised their right to negotiate and were successful in securing a fair contract.

Art, labor/management relationships wind up affecting the entire family. One doesn't have to be a pilot to have a position on the issues. It does help, however, to have a full understanding of the situation and know enough of the pilots to see things through their eyes. "Embarrassed" is never a word my husband has had to use when NJ pilots mention reading my posts.
Cordially,
NJW

 

[Necromonger]

Yes, I’m back. I know you missed me.

• We now airline with 4 and 5 hour layovers at airline hubs!!!
• We stay at (third rate) hotels that cost anywhere from 20 to 50% MORE that FBO rates!!!
• We get breakfast and lunch in paper bags that get wet from refrigeration!!!
• They doubled our insurance premium this year!!!

C U at the Top!

Hi, FlexO.

It’s good to see more of us out here bringing these issues to light. Keep it up.

Let’s take it one step further. We have a choice here. And, it doesn’t have to be the love it or leave it attitude that we have been hearing for years.

We have a choice to make. We can keep getting these half a$$ policies shoved down our throats OR we can have a say in all policy changes. That way, when management goes off half cocked with these hair brained schemes, we don’t have to bend over and enjoy the ride.

The way things are now (and how they’ve been) we have no choice. We must accept any and all policy change, and that’s it. Sure you, as an individual, can voice your opinion with this “Open Door” policy. But, that only brings on this speech: “Thank you for voicing your opinion. I’d be glad to write you a letter of recommendation, if you want to leave.” Yes, it happens. Just ask around.

There are many policies management has not thought through before just kicking it out there, and just seeing IF it works. Just remember the CLC days.

On top of the policies that are published, we are dealing with internal policies and philosophies that don’t make QOL any easier on the crews.
-Voice mails saying you must have a hard copy of APG.
-Then you just need a verbal from dispatch that the numbers work. (We know that they are trained in reading these things, but many times they are just too busy. So, we ask for the hard copy anyway.)
-The interoffice communication disseminating this info is for Sh!t. Either that or we have a few very lazy dispatchers.
-Direct flights out on day one maximizing duty and connections galore on the way home, saving $10 on an exhausted crewmember. (just callin’ ‘em like I see ‘em)
-Then, there’s the “Your mine till midnight” of your last day mentality being spewed by some schedulers. Yes, it is company policy, but she takes great pride in getting you home in that final hour.

Holy Crap! This turned into a rant.

We have a choice here. We can make this a better place.
The bar has been raised. Don’t be satisfied just buying more lube to take it up the A$$.
We need to have a say in the policy changes of the future.

Just send in your card.

 

[netjetwife]

I didn't think that was a "rant". To me it sounded like a good summary of the situation. The bar has indeed been raised and many NJ families are much better off today because they stood up for themselves. The choice seems clear to me. I know that the NJ pilots/families don't regret any of the choices they made since StrongUnion stepped up to lead the contract battle. There certainly is a better way than being at the whim of someone's bright idea.
Best of Luck!
NJW

 

[TrumanSparks]

Art,
You need to reread Pilot's Wife's post. she didn't say that she is my wife, but that I know her husband.

No I did not work in the training center, and don't assume that everyone that works there is a "whore".

There are good and bad at the training center and over in Richardson, just like there is on the line.

Just wanted everyone to know that to most of the guys I know it's not as bad as some people paint it to be.

I enjoyed it while I was there, but I also got another gig that believed would be better for me. The company I work for now is great, but even its not for everyone.

 

[BombJet45]

Art,

Every Flexjet pilot I have worked with on the 45 in the training center was professional, courtesy, knowledgeable, and cared how we performed while there. You on the other hand are a bigoted arse with your off base, clump everyone in the same catergory, whore comments. Nice show of comradery and professionalism.

 

[netjetwife]

Art's anger and frustration is the result of underpaying pilots. This penny-wise/pound-foolish practice produces bad morale which leads to inefficiency and greater training costs due to the high turn over rate. I don't condone the language but I do agree with the essential message that there are unaddressed issues which need to be fixed . A fair contract with professional compensation would go far in solving the labor-management problems. Send in your cards and insist on being an active participant in the decision-making process. Best of Luck! NJW

 

[Necromonger]

DamnIT NJW beat me to the punch...again.

Yes, it seems Art is angry and frustrated, just like the many of us here.

If you were offended, go to the kiddy sight down the road. Recess is in 10 minutes. Or, just grow some thicker skin.

I may not agree with it, but he's not the only one spewin' out this Training Whore mentallity... I think he is miss informed or not in my fleet. The vast majority of the folks in the training center avoid the upper brass like the plague. We have a Super group out there. But, there are a few out there who do fit his profile.

As line pilots, we feel detached from everything in Dallas when we're on the road. On top of that, the office breeds this us against them mentality. (very powerful union busting tactic).

Let's take a step back, and take a deep breath. (Yes, I stoled that from the BB)

Let's get back on point.
PAY...DUTY...REST...CREW BASES....POLICY CHANGE WITHOUT PILOT INPUT...JOB PROTECTION...

Just send in the flippin' card.

 

[netjetwife]

NM, the more the merrier, I say! There are several examples of human nature in Art's post. It's easy to see how the "rotten apples" can spoil the whole bunch for some people. That, too, is tied to low morale. It's easier to keep from getting frustrated (w/the few jerks) when you're not run down physically and/or burned out emotionally. Both of those negative states are common among any labor force that is underpaid/overworked.

Those pilots currently satisfied with their job situation at Flex would be well advised to consider the future. There is nothing to stop the company, in the months ahead, from putting in place a policy that you do object to. At that point, it may be more difficult to rally the troops. Can you not do the right thing now and allow the pilots to vote on their future? Surely you don't find the low wages acceptable compensation for your professional fellow pilots?

 

[ArtVandalay]

Ok, maybe I was venting the other day but I do feel strongly about what I said. It's just frustrating to fly with 67 year old captains that could give a rats a$$ about union etc... I almost think thats why they hire ex airline retirees.

 

[netjetwife]

My thoughts run along those lines, too. I think they hire those guys because they can count on them having another source of income to supplement the pathetic FO wages. They figure they'll be less likely to complain than others who expect to be able to support a family on one job. A professional one , at that!


A few words to those who haven't yet turned in their cards---

http://www.bluemountain.com/view.pd?i=140595715&m=1932&rr=y&source=bma999

 

[gonefishin']

Truman, Was it you who FedEx'ed the mac-n-cheese to RH?

 

[twincessna]

Next FedEx box sent in will be the Roast Beef Sandwich!!!

 

[TrumanSparks]

No that wasn't me, but I know who did. That was a classic.