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First Mesaba then Pinnacle

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FlyingToIST

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 19, 2002
Posts
417
Pinnacle Air says did not receive Northwest payment
Fri Sep 16, 2005 09:33 AM ET
CHICAGO, Sept 16 (Reuters) - Pinnacle Airlines Corp. (PNCL.O: Quote, Profile, Research) , a regional partner of bankrupt Northwest Airlines (NWAC.O: Quote, Profile, Research) , on Friday said it did not receive a net $22 million payment due on Thursday from the No. 4 U.S. carrier. Pinnacle said in a government filing that it does not expect to receive immediate payments of any amounts due on Sept. 15.
 
Dave Benjamin said:
I'd be more concerned about future concessions than I would hiring.
BINGO!

With NWA in Chapt 11 look for renegotiation of the ASA's (Air Service Agreements) with each carrier, paying LESS than they were, then MSA and PCL mgmt coming and saying "We had to take cuts on our ASA so YOU have to take cuts".

Just when I thought it couldn't get much worse. *sigh*
 
Dave Benjamin said:
I'd be more concerned about future concessions than I would hiring.

Ha, thats gonna be interesting. Pinnacle is the lowest paid RJ pilots. We cant afford to get paid less. Everyone b$#%es about SKywest being non-union and 1 pay scale for flying the 200 and the 700. How about ALPA represented pilots being well under-paid thanthat non-union carrier.
 
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Lear70 said:
BINGO!

With NWA in Chapt 11 look for renegotiation of the ASA's (Air Service Agreements) with each carrier, paying LESS than they were, then MSA and PCL mgmt coming and saying "We had to take cuts on our ASA so YOU have to take cuts".

Just when I thought it couldn't get much worse. *sigh*

Renegotiating the ASA is almost a given at this point. Our current ASA guarantees us about a 10% profit margin. Expect that to be trimmed to somewhere in the 4-6% range in the not-too-distant future. Not sure what Mesaba's margins are, but I'm sure they'll be trimmed if at all possible also.

As for concessions from the pilot group, don't hold your breath. That won't even be entertained by the Association. Besides, that would be a complete 180 degree turn from the way negotiations have been going up until now. Our margins will be cut, but not eliminated, so I doubt management will make such a large change in their negotiating practices. They want to secure opportunities for any future 70-90 seat flying, and they can only get that with a completed pilot CBA.
 
PCL_128 said:
As for concessions from the pilot group, don't hold your breath. That won't even be entertained by the Association. Besides, that would be a complete 180 degree turn from the way negotiations have been going up until now.

How have your negotiations been going up until now? I remember having a lot of sections TA'd early on in our negotiations. However, 'Hostage of War Benefits' hardly needed change. Have you guys TA'd anything substantial? Recognition and Scope, Scheduling, Retirement (watch some guys tell you this one isn't as important because they're going to a major :) ), Compensation, Duration, Training and Testing, or Hours of Service? It's these sections that will bring out the true colors of your management.

PCL_128 said:
Our margins will be cut, but not eliminated, so I doubt management will make such a large change in their negotiating practices.

I hate to say it, but a bankruptcy at NWA was probably a wet dream for your management. "How can you possibly ask for a leading contract when NWA is in bankruptcy?", they'll say.

PCL_128 said:
They want to secure opportunities for any future 70-90 seat flying, and they can only get that with a completed pilot CBA.

This last part made me laugh. Only because it is almost word for word as to what our CEO told us in negotiations. Your last quote I posted here will be used AGAINST you. Think about it. Your management team knows EXACTLY what a 70-90 seat jet will cost them in terms of pilot compensation. Do you really think they don't have a maximum dollar figure in their head that they are willing to sign your contract for? They know. BUT, they will tell you to hurry up and agree to their crap contract proposal because if you continue to waste time negotiating, those jets will go to another regional.

In reality, NWA knows exactly when and where all future aircraft are going. Your contract has little to do with it.
 
kmox29 said it pretty well. One thing to add to the others that didn't know. Mesaba signed the ASA last week when both parties were full aware of the BK filing. That doesn't mean I think it can't change, but it was already taken into consideration by our co. and NWA.
 
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Our management tried this shortly after 9/11, saying 'well, everyone else is taking concessions, we probably need to as well". The only thing concessions would have done then would have put more money in their pocket. They have been taking in millions every quarter off this service agreement. Labor sure hasn't seen any of it. I say it's finally time for management to manage. Not just be in the right place at the right time, because that's whats been going on for the past 5 years. Time to wake up and smell the coffee.

I think a re-negiotation of the service agreement should mean that the management bonuses will be less. Nothing else. Are we expecting a industry leading contract? No. Never have. We need better work rules, and the committee knows exactly what we expect. We have already been one of the lowest paying for a while. We will not accept a Mesa contract. Period. Bankruptcy or not.
 

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