Feeling sorry for the ComAir guys?

[Cpt Oveur]

Junior captain will be a 1990 hire, most junior pilot 1999. Approximately 500 pilots to be furloughed from the roster of 1100-1200 currently active...

Not official numbers

 

[imacdog]

You are appealing to emotions that I don't have. This is the airline game. If you don't know much about it, let me tell you that furloughs are a reality. The 50 seater has been dying for quite some time now. All the RJ drivers thought that the 50 seat RJ was the savior of the industry, and so wildly profitable. I've been saying forever that it was only profitable on long, thin routes, when businessmen had money to burn in order to pay for frequency, or when they were subsidized--that's right--subsidized by bloated fee-for-departure agreements which heavily benefitted contract carriers. These only when gas was below $50--which it ain't.

Those days have ended, as predicted by many--including me. All of those glory days in the RJ world came at the expense of one group, junior mainline pilots--which I was NOT a member of. However, my loyalty lies with them--a few of which were even <gasp> Comair pilots.

My answer was a simple "no", except that you have to have at least 4 characters. We can delve into the RJDC game all you wish, for that is a whole different line of questioning. I can wipe you out in that debate as well. Nobody cried for Delta pilots out on the street, Comair gladly accepted the massive influx of flying, and lived the high life for a decade. It is over. That's what contract flying is. You can set up all the threads you want to cry in your soup, or you can suck it up and move on. I've flown with many furloughed pilots, and heard some of the greatest opportunistic success stories ever in their moment of despair.

It would be nice if you could furlough the senior, but you can't. Succeed despite.

Apparently you have some emotion about it to write such a lengthy reply. Where did I bring up the RJDC? I don't even work for Comair. So please, settle down, and think again about how you don't feel sorry for guys about to lose their income in a very tough economy. Kinda sad when you think about it.

 

[crj567]

No, it's the one that certifies that your mom and dad were brother and sister resulting in the aftermath we call crj567.

You need more practice with insults... Try harder-like the way you try to please all your boyfriends down at LBB.

-Assmunch

 

[weasel_lips]

Yes, too bad for the COMAIR guys and gals. Good news for the majors though. About time the career destroying RJ is put out to pasture.

 

[Scope out RJ's]

You need more practice with insults... Try harder-like the way you try to please all your boyfriends down at LBB.

-Assmunch

How about I think like the way I try to please your mom down in tuna town!

 

[PuffDriver]

Apparently you have some emotion about it to write such a lengthy reply. Where did I bring up the RJDC? I don't even work for Comair. So please, settle down, and think again about how you don't feel sorry for guys about to lose their income in a very tough economy. Kinda sad when you think about it.

No, I don't. Here is your quote:

You are about the only Delta pilot that understands this simple fact. Losers like PuffDriver seem to be representative of the rest of the tards on this website.

The response was to your use of the word "losers" and "tards". You seem to feel that someone unemotional about the downsizing of Comair is such a person. Instead of responding in kind like you wanted, aka flaming, I told you that you are appealing to emotions that I do not possess. There is no "settling down" to be done.

I do not feel sorry for Comair or its pilots. They had a great run, and they did it under a false guise that their airline was great. In fact, it was not. It was subsidized. I predicted long ago that the regionals would lose their lucrative agreements with the majors, and the bubble would burst while they were chiding everyone about how "profitable" they were. T'wernt true.

I little dose of humility just might do the regional industry some good. it's a losing enterprise which will be marginal at best. That is why you are seeing Republic and Skywest feverishly trying to grow.

i know that you think you've got everything pegged, but you don't.

 

[BRA]

I feel sorry for them. What a horrible thing to have to go through.

Every airline in the US is hated by some pilots for some reason.

You know a bunch would be happy if SWA was having a huge furlough. (pay for type? screw them)
Same goes for Jetblue. (media darling, screw them)
Same goes for UAL. (let all those under qualified women eat it)
Same goes for CAL. (scabs on the list, low pay. Screw them)

Lots of hate out there.

Most of that comair list are just a bunch of honest pilots like you and me trying to make a living. I wish them the best.

 

[Tweaker]

ok. Time to be a jerk.

I feel bad for the comair people. Do i feel bad for comair?

Nope.

The bitches at delta should have kept their flying in-house to begin with and this would have never happened.

Gup

that!

 

[Tweaker]

Yes, too bad for the COMAIR guys and gals. Good news for the majors though. About time the career destroying RJ is put out to pasture.

Quite roight! And to that I shall drink heartily!

 

[waveflyer]

I'm not into pity. Or chest thumping on either side. Outsourcing has been awful for ALL pilots and it's a very good thing overall for any of the sjp's to downsize - at least as long as they aren't replaced by another carrier. An airline should employ pilots to fly it's own planes- that ought to be obvious to all regardless of individual situations.

If you're a pilot anywhere and aren't a good saver- -> bad news. We have to save more than the average citizen bc of the difficulty we have in replacing our income - there are always opportunities to come out ahead.

So who should I feel sorry for? Those that didn't pursue other opportunities? Those who didn't save for the rainy day? Those not driven or talented enough to successfully move on?

The cart has been leading the horse for way too long.

The only empathy I have is how convoluted the career decision has been in the last decade- how many moved on who didn't get furloughed? But still- not taking a risk is usually pretty risky itself

 

[JoeMerchant]

This is proof that we aren't a real "union" and we don't really care about anyone other than ourselves.....

The major airlines "sold" this flying for pay and workrules. They could have paid to keep it for themselves, but they "sold it" plain and simple.

Then when that didn't work out, they cry and complained about it.....Now they applaud our fellow CMR pilots losing their jobs....Jobs that the mainline didn't want.....

The hell with this "brotherhood" crap...It is clear that this doesn't exist....

 

[imacdog]

The response was to your use of the word "losers" and "tards". You seem to feel that someone unemotional about the downsizing of Comair is such a person. Instead of responding in kind like you wanted, aka flaming, I told you that you are appealing to emotions that I do not possess. There is no "settling down" to be done.

You do not possess any feeling toward people losing their livelihood? That really does make you a loser. Sorry pal.

 

[JoeMerchant]

You do not possess any feeling toward people losing their livelihood? That really does make you a loser. Sorry pal.

That makes him the typical ALPA member....This isn't a union...

 

[waveflyer]

Welcome Joey-
how about you? Are you saving? Updating logbooks?

 

[climbhappy]

anyone that rejoices in another man's misery is no gentleman..

 

[Scope out RJ's]

That makes him the typical ALPA member....This isn't a union...

Or he could be some scum sucking rjdc supporter who tries to sue to get onto someone's seniority list when he couldn't do it through the interview.
Hope you're updating your logbook and apps joe, you could be next!

 

[waveflyer]

anyone that rejoices in another man's misery is no gentleman..

Depends on what creates the misery. What were the expectations of pilots at comair?

 

[twobits]

These are people losing their jobs. A little more compassion should be in order. Delta pilots; if you thought it was wrong that Comair required Delta furloughed pilots to resign their seniority number to joing Comair's list, then it is also wrong for Delta pilots to do that to anyone else (otherwise you are a hypocrite). Fact is, that Comair's policy stated that they required any furloughed pilot to resign their seniority number to join Comair. This was not a pilot thing, but a company requirment (i.e., so Comair didn't train somone just to have them f..off.) This was not a problem for many TWA pilots who go shafted and needed temporary work at Comair.

Now, Delta pilots should encourage Delta to at least offer the same deal to Comair pilots. That is, if you resign your seniority number at Comair, you can join the Delta list. This could be done by preferential interviews, or other avenues. Remember, Comair is owned by Delta, and what happens at Comair could very quickly happen at Delta. Comair and Delta both are represented by ALPA, and the brotherhood of pilots should prevail; not management rhetoric. To revel in someone's misfortune and to give excuses why they as a group are bad is evil.

Good luck to all Comair pilots that may shortly be out of work. Keep your spirits up, and don't accept any concessionary contract if that is what DL mgt. is up to (that's what it smells like). Fact is, Delta likely will use this to bring rates on the 70 and 90 down to what the 50 seat rates were and change the work rules to their liking. They need to replace the DC-9, and if pilots at Delta and each regional do not work together proactively - DC9 flying today will shortly become connection flying and mainline jobs WILL be lost.


... or we could all do nothing and play the blame game while management bends everyone over.

 

[Scope out RJ's]

Now, Delta pilots should encourage Delta to at least offer the same deal to Comair pilots. That is, if you resign your seniority number at Comair, you can join the Delta list. This could be done by preferential interviews, or other avenues. Remember, Comair is owned by Delta, and what happens at Comair could very quickly happen at Delta.

:laugh::laugh::laugh:

 

[waveflyer]

Twobits- I hope you're really not that clueless about the difference.

 

[PuffDriver]

You do not possess any feeling toward people losing their livelihood? That really does make you a loser. Sorry pal.

Not at all. When Delta pilots were on furlough, I felt awful. I did everything and anything I could for them. While doing this, I saw the likes of Comair, ASA, Skywest hiring at full steam and not looking back.

Like I said, you calling me a "loser" appeals to an emotion that I don't possess. I'll leave it at that as you can't seem to grasp what my posts are saying. It's the airline industry. Things happen.

Waveflyer summed it up nicely:

I'm not into pity. Or chest thumping on either side. Outsourcing has been awful for ALL pilots and it's a very good thing overall for any of the sjp's to downsize - at least as long as they aren't replaced by another carrier. An airline should employ pilots to fly it's own planes- that ought to be obvious to all regardless of individual situations.

If you're a pilot anywhere and aren't a good saver- -> bad news. We have to save more than the average citizen bc of the difficulty we have in replacing our income - there are always opportunities to come out ahead.

So who should I feel sorry for? Those that didn't pursue other opportunities? Those who didn't save for the rainy day? Those not driven or talented enough to successfully move on?

The cart has been leading the horse for way too long.

The only empathy I have is how convoluted the career decision has been in the last decade- how many moved on who didn't get furloughed? But still- not taking a risk is usually pretty risky itself

 

[PuffDriver]

This is proof that we aren't a real "union" and we don't really care about anyone other than ourselves.....

The major airlines "sold" this flying for pay and workrules. They could have paid to keep it for themselves, but they "sold it" plain and simple.

Then when that didn't work out, they cry and complained about it.....Now they applaud our fellow CMR pilots losing their jobs....Jobs that the mainline didn't want.....

The hell with this "brotherhood" crap...It is clear that this doesn't exist....

From the president of MEville.

Nothing was sold--hence the quotes in your post. You know it as well as I do. You just can't admit it. The flying was contracted--always ripe to be called back in. Here we are. I've heard that Delta is looking pretty hard at the 195--common type to the 175. Could it be that 70+ flying is coming back to mainline?

 

[jonjuan]

This is proof that we aren't a real "union" and we don't really care about anyone other than ourselves.....

The major airlines "sold" this flying for pay and workrules. They could have paid to keep it for themselves, but they "sold it" plain and simple.

Then when that didn't work out, they cry and complained about it.....Now they applaud our fellow CMR pilots losing their jobs....Jobs that the mainline didn't want.....

The hell with this "brotherhood" crap...It is clear that this doesn't exist....

Welcome to Dumpsville. Population....You.

 

[ozpilot]

I've heard that Delta is looking pretty hard at the 195--common type to the 175. Could it be that 70+ flying is coming back to mainline?

Since Delta already uses Compass to fly the EMB-170, wouldn't it make sense for Compass to fly the EMB-190 too?

 

[P38JLightning]

If they were allowed, but they are not allowed, so no.

 

[waveflyer]

Since Delta already uses Compass to fly the EMB-170, wouldn't it make sense for Compass to fly the EMB-190 too?

Compass ought to be rolled into delta and it's pilots stapled or given basic interviews.

Here's something funny: USAir uses republic to fly E170/175's - and republic captains top out at $126/hr

USAIR mainline flies the E190 -same type as 170/175- and their captains top out at $95/hr

think about that

 

[Fly-By-Cable]

Compass ought to be rolled into delta and it's pilots stapled or given basic interviews.

Here's something funny: USAir uses republic to fly E170/175's - and republic captains top out at $126/hr

USAIR mainline flies the E190 -same type as 170/175- and their captains top out at $95/hr

think about that

You think that's funny? How about their Airbus rates. Tops out at $125 on 319/320/321. Supposable there will be a ruling on the snapbacks by the end of Sept.

 

[taters]

Glad I didn't buy into all that BS from Vern Atrim at Delta Connection Academy when I was in college. anybody could have..but to those who did...sorry/good luck/always be prepared for this..

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

These are people losing their jobs. A little more compassion should be in order. Delta pilots; if you thought it was wrong that Comair required Delta furloughed pilots to resign their seniority number to joing Comair's list, then it is also wrong for Delta pilots to do that to anyone else (otherwise you are a hypocrite). Fact is, that Comair's policy stated that they required any furloughed pilot to resign their seniority number to join Comair. This was not a pilot thing, but a company requirment (i.e., so Comair didn't train somone just to have them f..off.) This was not a problem for many TWA pilots who go shafted and needed temporary work at Comair.

Now, Delta pilots should encourage Delta to at least offer the same deal to Comair pilots. That is, if you resign your seniority number at Comair, you can join the Delta list. This could be done by preferential interviews, or other avenues. Remember, Comair is owned by Delta, and what happens at Comair could very quickly happen at Delta. Comair and Delta both are represented by ALPA, and the brotherhood of pilots should prevail; not management rhetoric. To revel in someone's misfortune and to give excuses why they as a group are bad is evil.

Good luck to all Comair pilots that may shortly be out of work. Keep your spirits up, and don't accept any concessionary contract if that is what DL mgt. is up to (that's what it smells like). Fact is, Delta likely will use this to bring rates on the 70 and 90 down to what the 50 seat rates were and change the work rules to their liking. They need to replace the DC-9, and if pilots at Delta and each regional do not work together proactively - DC9 flying today will shortly become connection flying and mainline jobs WILL be lost.


... or we could all do nothing and play the blame game while management bends everyone over.

Who's clueless?

twobits <---------------THAT guy!!!

Please don't comment on something you have no clue about.....such as defending JC and his merry bunch of lifers actions. You are no better than being in bed with them so time for you to STFU...

 

[flyboyike]

Thanks but before you hail me a hero.....When a CMR guy comes to me looking for a jumpseat I see his date of hire before the date of that memo and I just give him a briefing and show him the seat......end of the conversation.....the minimum is all he gets. If he's hired after that memo, I'll give him my crew meal and carry his bags.......

I appreciate that (12/14/2006 hire).