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FAA settles on CO Denver crash victims

BEfly

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By Russ Niles, Editor-in-Chief




The FAA has paid millions of dollars worth of settlements to 65 people who were on a Continental Airlines Boeing 737 that was blown off a runway at Denver International Airport on Dec. 21, 2008. KMGH-TV reported that the agency was facing a lawsuit for its role in the accident, in which several people were severely injured but no one was killed. The NTSB report said controllers failed to warn the pilots of 40-knot crosswind gusts before they took off. The aircraft captain was among those who accepted a settlement from the FAA.

The NTSB report also blamed the captain for not using rudder to counteract the crosswind. Many of those who sued the FAA had already received a settlement from the airline. The aircraft ended up on fire in a ravine next to the runway. The NTSB credited the work of the flight attendants in evacuating the aircraft for the fact that everyone survived. The board was also critical of the crosswind training received by pilots, noting the simulator-based training couldn't properly duplicate actual crosswind conditions.

http://www.avweb.com/avwebbiz/news/FAA_Settles_Crash_208307-1.html?CMP=OTC-RSS
 

BEfly

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If I run my jet off the runway because the controller didn't tell me what the wind direction and speed was, I could blame the FAA?
 

CesnaCaptn

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If I run my jet off the runway because the controller didn't tell me what the wind direction and speed was, I could blame the FAA?

If you had evidence that the FAA inadequately failed to train a controller they certified and that controller gave you wrong or incomplete information--then yes.
 

GogglesPisano

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D-ATIS w Auto-update.
 

tico

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If you had evidence that the FAA inadequately failed to train a controller they certified and that controller gave you wrong or incomplete information--then yes.
Weak..since we fly to ktn,wrg,psg,sit,yak,cdv,brw,scc,otz,ome,bet,dlg and adk in the same 737 and no tower to tell us how to do a crosswind takeoff, who are we supposed to file a suit against..
 

CesnaCaptn

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Weak..since we fly to ktn,wrg,psg,sit,yak,cdv,brw,scc,otz,ome,bet,dlg and adk in the same 737 and no tower to tell us how to do a crosswind takeoff, who are we supposed to file a suit against..

If the ASOS or the weather observer gives the pilot bad info, the liability lies beyond the pilot. Sue the ASOS manufacturer or whomever is responsible for maintaining it. This settlement was about more than just bad pilot technique, which is why the FAA settled.

And liability in this case was found with the pilot, which is why Continental had to settle too.
 

say again

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How far down the t/o roll did he lose directional control, what speed? Was he drifting and thought he can save it without aborting? Serious questions. No finger pointing.
 

j41driver

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How far down the t/o roll did he lose directional control, what speed? Was he drifting and thought he can save it without aborting? Serious questions. No finger pointing.

Skid marks started approx 2000' from approach end of 34R. Departed the runway at approx 2600' and 110 kts. Didnt reduce power until 3 sec after departed runway surface. Reached top speed of 120 kts. Wind out of the west with xwind components from 29-45 kts.

From the NTSB Report: FDR showed... the airplane’s right rudder deflection, which had been oscillating between its near-neutral and near-maximum positions, transitioned back to a near-neutral position. Additionally, at this time, the control wheel transitioned from about 20° of left-wing-down input to a right-wing-down control wheel input of more than 80°. During postaccident interviews, the captain told investigators that he added right-wing-down aileron inputs because he was concerned about keeping the airplane upright on the uneven terrain off the left side of the runway.

No idea what he was trying to do. There but for the grace of God go I.
 

densoo

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There was some talk that on the short -500 a high crosswind over the winglets can blank out the rudder making rudder inputs intermittently ineffective. Something not tested by Boeing for the winget installation. Since I haven't seen a change to FM procedure it must not be true, unless they're in the legal admit-nothing mode, like they did on the hardover rudder valve problem.
 
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scoreboardII

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There was some talk that on the short -500 a high crosswind over the winglets can blank out the rudder making rudder inputs intermittently ineffective. Something not tested by Boeing for the winget installation. Since I haven't seen a change to FM procedure it must not be true, unless they're in the legal admit-nothing mode, like they did on the hardover rudder valve problem.

I'm not thinking they will be testing for 45 knots of crosswind when the limit is 35... And, the plane with winglets works just fine at 35kts cross, tested almost every day in LBB.
 

huronip

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I'm not thinking they will be testing for 45 knots of crosswind when the limit is 35... And, the plane with winglets works just fine at 35kts cross, tested almost every day in LBB.


I've never seen a -500 in LBB with wingelts. With 8/26 and 17R/35L why would you land with a 35kt xwind?
 

scoreboardII

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I've never seen a 500 in LBB either, but a 700 yes.

Why land with the crosswind? Quicker. That's like asking why land Cat III.
 

waveflyer

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If I run my jet off the runway because the controller didn't tell me what the wind direction and speed was, I could blame the FAA?

I'm with you on this- the CAPTAIN got a settlement???
Are you the f^cking captain or aren't you?

This career will always be about me taking complete responsibility for everything aviation related that happens on any airplane I'm crewing- no scapegoats-

100% of all pilots should share in my sentiments
The controller?? Really?
Passengers, alright- but the capt got a settlement? RUfKM? Offends every ounce of my professionalism
Who the hell is this guy again??
 
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