expectations for SLI, Pinnacle, Mesaba, Colgan

[Kaman]

If the combined PNCL fleet ends up to be just Q-400's and -900's and mainline "takes the flying back" I don't see this as a bad thing. Why? The pilots who choose NOT to go to a major (for whatever valid reasons) will still be flying. The recaptured flying will be done at mainline; requiring more staffing at the majors, higher career earnings, and plenty of movement from the regionals to the majors. Can it happen overnight? No. Can it happen over time in a fashion that would not be a disruption to career progression? Yes. The big players in this arena will be the new scope language of the UAL/CO JCBA, the next contract cycle for DL, next cycle for AA, and Usair/AW (if they ever get their train on the right tracks). We all get to watch this unfold going forward.

Thinking only negative will not allow any positives to occur.

Well said, and I agree with you. Unfortunately, there is always some kind of human "fallout" during one of these rounds of mergers, consolidations, optimizations, rationalizations...whatever management tries to spin it as doesn't matter. I think that what is going on is necessary, and I have never understood why the airlines are always so slow to react to the market forces in the industry. Granted, caution must be used in making changes too quickly, but fuel costs aren't going to go anywhere, except up. Personnel costs are still secondary to fuel...Makes complete sense to have less airframes flying with more seats burning less fuel. Not good for the wallets of the flying public and reduces opportunities for pilots to advance and enter flying as a profession.

 

[flyn96]

Windfall for Peaknuckle. Mesaba and Colgan....not so much

Last I checked Mesaba and Colgan combined have more votes than Pinnacle so you will NOT see a "Windfall" and not to mention Mesaba guys are pulling the reigns in negotiations. Good luck with that.

 

[DoinTime]

Last I checked Mesaba and Colgan combined have more votes than Pinnacle so you will NOT see a "Windfall"

Nobody gets to vote on seniority integration.

Not to mention Mesaba guys are pulling the reigns in negotiations. Good luck with that.

If the end result of joint negotiations looks like Mesaba's contract the deal is already failed. Mesaba contract will not pass at PCL. To many concessions.

 

[higney85]

Last I checked Mesaba and Colgan combined have more votes than Pinnacle so you will NOT see a "Windfall" and not to mention Mesaba guys are pulling the reigns in negotiations. Good luck with that.

Nope. You obviously are not absorbing the facts as they are presented. In terms of the sli, that's not an issue anyone votes on so it doesn't allow for any group to control the outcome to their advantage. If the 3 respective merger committees cannot come up with a method an arbitrator gets the reigns in the sli arena. In terms of negotiations for a JCBA there is a Joint negotiating committee comprised of all groups. Once a TA is reached all 3 MEC's must separately pass the TA for the pilot group to be given a choice by vote. A single (any) MEC can vote the TA down and halt the process for all, but in either a JCBA or Sli it is impossible for any of the groups to individually or even 2 on 1 the overall group. It's all or nothing for all involved. If you understand or heard it otherwise you need to check your source. Nobody holds the "reigns" in any way, shape, or form beyond the JMEC as a whole.

 

[higney85]

If the end result of joint negotiations looks like Mesaba's contract the deal is already failed. Mesaba contract will not pass at PCL. To many concessions.

I would (personally) agree with that statement and sentiment.

 

[GRAAB HIRBOUBI]

Originally Posted by DoinTime
If the end result of joint negotiations looks like Mesaba's contract the deal is already failed. Mesaba contract will not pass at PCL. To many concessions.


I think it's great that PCL wouldn't have passed our Concessionary contract. Course we did have a bankruptcy court gun to our head, but we are a pilot group that just rolls over and takes it....

I hope your contract is better than ours, I'd vote for it. But right now a PCL Captain at my seniority is about 5 to 6 bucks less than me. Personally I don't think Uncle Phil will raise you guys to our level but I honestly hope you pass it.

But watch the "concessionary" language. We were in bankruptcy. If the PCL group gets a contract for less than ours then what are we going to call you?

Good Luck to all of us.

 

[Simon Says]

Nope. You obviously are not absorbing the facts as they are presented. In terms of the sli, that's not an issue anyone votes on so it doesn't allow for any group to control the outcome to their advantage. If the 3 respective merger committees cannot come up with a method an arbitrator gets the reigns in the sli arena. In terms of negotiations for a JCBA there is a Joint negotiating committee comprised of all groups. Once a TA is reached all 3 MEC's must separately pass the TA for the pilot group to be given a choice by vote. A single (any) MEC can vote the TA down and halt the process for all, but in either a JCBA or Sli it is impossible for any of the groups to individually or even 2 on 1 the overall group. It's all or nothing for all involved. If you understand or heard it otherwise you need to check your source. Nobody holds the "reigns" in any way, shape, or form beyond the JMEC as a whole.

This is all true.

 

[Simon Says]

Nobody gets to vote on seniority integration.




If the end result of joint negotiations looks like Mesaba's contract the deal is already failed. Mesaba contract will not pass at PCL. To many concessions.

True on the seniority intergration.

As for the contract I first want to say I hope you are correct about PCL not passing Mesaba's contract. If we had our contract and your health care for a term of 4-5 years I would probably vote for it. I have worked under this contract and bid middle of the pack at Mesaba. It is not that bad, except for FO pay. But the work rules, retirement, and the scheduling is not bad at all.

In the end we have all got to be on the same team. Lets not have our mis-understandings now be a divider later.

 

[Mr Wu]

Last I checked Mesaba and Colgan combined have more votes than Pinnacle so you will NOT see a "Windfall" and not to mention Mesaba guys are pulling the reigns in negotiations. Good luck with that.

It's reins, you dumb bastard.

 

[Kaman]

It's reins, you dumb bastard.

You get into ROA lately?