Everyone Get Comfortable At Your Regional

[eaglefly]

I know this wouldn't be 100% but think about 5 years of no retirements.
5 Years of zero movement.
5 more years of reserve.
5 more years as an F/O.
5 more years at a regional
5 more years as a regional F/O
5 more years to wait to get on that widebody.

either way it's 5 more years of little or no movement no matter where you are.

I know..........it's tough.

If only ALPA had not done one thing (poll their membership for their desires and then act on THAT) and then do another (lobby the other way and congratulate that result).

ALPA's the flip side of the same coin as management and their primary focus is publishing.

They not only sell the most overpriced magazine in U.S. history, they make it so tens of thousands of pilots HAVE to buy it or ALPA has them fired.

I guess we can add extortion to corruption, but it's the American way now........and this business is loaded with gullible saps that fall for it hook, line and sinker every day.

 

[Flyprdu]

I know..........it's tough.

If only ALPA had not done one thing (poll their membership for their desires and then act on THAT) and then do another (lobby the other way and congratulate that result).

ALPA's the flip side of the same coin as management and their primary focus is publishing.

They not only sell the most overpriced magazine in U.S. history, they make it so tens of thousands of pilots HAVE to buy it or ALPA has them fired.

I guess we can add extortion to corruption, but it's the American way now........and this business is loaded with gullible saps that fall for it hook, line and sinker every day.

If this goes through, I'll cancel this magazine and order "Cruising World" in short order.

 

[eaglefly]

If this goes through, I'll cancel this magazine and order "Cruising World" in short order.

It will, in part because ALPA wants it to....it's BIG money for them and that's what matters.

You'll enjoy "Cruising World" much more.

 

[Superpilot92]

Yeah alpa gets 5 more years of Dues from the highest paid pilots. Thats probably exactly what this is all about!!

 

[Salty Dog]

My dad sat sideways in a 727 for 10 years before he upgraded to FO.

Can you imagine? Summer of '65 napalming commies in your F-105. Summer of '67 yer hired - go fly the panel. Then you don't touch the wheel until Jimmy Carter is President. Wow.

What's "bad" is always relative.

I agree 65 is not a career nuker. I foresee a larger percentage being out by then as well. We younger, healthier guys, however, will benefit the most.

 

[eaglefly]

My dad sat sideways in a 727 for 10 years before he upgraded to FO.

Can you imagine? Summer of '65 napalming commies in your F-105. Summer of '67 yer hired - go fly the panel. Then you don't touch the wheel until Jimmy Carter is President. Wow.

What's "bad" is always relative.

I agree 65 is not a career nuker. I foresee a larger percentage being out by then as well. We younger, healthier guys, however, will benefit the most.

That's the rationalization ALPA is using to line their pockets with.

 

[siucavflight]

No one has to baby sit me.

I dont know if anyone has ever heard this before:

"Once a man twice a baby"

Same goes if pilots fly to age 65. When they first started out they had to be baby sat by a more experienced pilot, now when they hit age 60-65 and they aren't very sharp anymore they are gonna have to be baby sat again.

But anyways eagle, hows that 7year upgrade going?

I love it, try an insult a man based on his time to upgrade.
I guess he could ask you.
But anyways pdub, how is working for JO and Mesa going?

 

[BusDriver12]

House poised to pass Age 65 bill

Charlie Lunan
12/11/2007​

The U.S. House of Representatives was poised late Tuesday to approve legislation raising the mandatory retirement age for airline pilots to 65 from 60.
On Tuesday, U.S. Rep. James Oberstar, (D-Minn) pulled the Age 65 bill out of a massive and stalled FAA Reauthorization bill and pushed it through the House Transportation and Infrastructure Committee he chairs. From there it will go before the full house with 16 other bills, where it must be passed by a two-thirds majority.
A companion bill will have to be passed unanimously by the Senate before it can go to President Bush's desk for signing. The bill would become effective the moment it is signed by the president.
The bill contained language backed by the Air Line Pilots Association. The nation's largest pilots union initially opposed raising the retirement age, but then worked to shape the bill after concluding the change was inevitable.
"We are very happy with it," ALPA Spokesman Pete Janhunen said late Tuesay of the language in the bill.
Here are some details on the legislation:

• U.S. certified pilots could continue flying for Part 121 passenger airlines until age 65.
• There would be no so-called under/over rule for domestic flights. Such a rule would have required there be at least one pilot under 60 on any crew with a pilot over 65 years of age. The 60/65 rule was adopted last year by the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO) to govern international flights.
• Flights departing the United States would be subject to the ICAO under/over rule.
• The bill will not be retroactive, which means that any pilot turning 60 before president Bush signs it, will have no rights to their seniority number. They could, however, continue flying by coming in at the bottom of the seniority list for their existing or another airline.
• Pilots would not be allowed to sue their unions for their seniority numbers.
• Airlines would not be allowed to use the law to make unilateral changes to pilot contracts, which will still have to be negotiated through the Railway Labor Act.

 

[utahrpm]

Not to be a downer, but i grew up on a street full of pilots back in the 80s.

1 Eastern
2 Pan Am
1 Braniff

2 of the Pan Am guys lost their battles to cancer at 48 and 62.

The Braniff guy died from cancer at 52.

The Eastern guy quit the industry and is in great health.

Point is none of them came close to 65. 3/4 were dead before 65.

Have you guys ever seen the FAA study (I think it may have been released as an Advisory Circular) regarding cosmic radiations affect on pregnant Flight Crew members? It concluded that the short exposure time (9 months max) did not pose a threat to the fetus. BUT, if you look at the data (broken down to below 24,000' cruise, above 24,000', Polar vs. Equatorial routes, 15,25 & 35 year careers) you'll find the death rate from cancer to be alarming. 35 years, above 24,000 your chance of cancer was way higher than an officer worker in Oklahoma City (their comparison). Much of my career was spent at low turbo-prop altitudes and short duration flights, and in retrospect I'm glad for that. So another five years at a Regional may prolong your life a bit! Seriously, I lost my copy of the study but I bet it is still available. Good thing for you young guys to read.

 

[Poahi]

We younger, healthier guys, however, will benefit the most.

Here's the reality:

1. The generation who pushed for the increase in the retirement age already benefited by it being lower for most of their career. Oh yeah, and they've also made more than you ever will.

2. The folks who negotiated the over the top concessionary contracts are the same folks who are slowing the earnings pipeline.

3. The amount you will make during your last five years will not offset the cost of waiting, even if you make it to 65.

4. Your life expectancy will decrease and if you work past 60 and your retirement period will decrease as well. If your retirement contributions are affected by life expectancy, your contributions will be reduced.

5. Your elected leadership is lobbying against the majority.

6. Safety had no place in these decisions.

7. There is more evidence the economy may enter a recession next year. Oil prices are up and airlines are under pressure to drop low yield markets and inefficient aircraft. Hiring isn't going to skyrocket anytime soon.

I'm not trying to be doom and gloom or encourage a generational feud, but for gosh sakes, please cut down on the Koolaid.

 

[rtmcfi]

We younger, healthier guys, however, will benefit the most.

Compound interest.......Look it up.

 

[pdub20s]

I love it, try an insult a man based on his time to upgrade.
I guess he could ask you.
But anyways pdub, how is working for JO and Mesa going?

Its going fine. Slavery never felt so good

Bizzum: Good comeback

 

[bizzum]

Bizzum: Good comeback

I'll be here all night!imp:

 

[rtmcfi]

House Approves Change to the Upper Age Limit

Language reflects ALPA Executive Board Resolution.

December 11, 2007​

The U.S. House of Representatives passed legislation this evening that would raise the pilot mandatory retirement age to 65 by a unanimous vote of 390-0. The measure, introduced by House Transportation & Infrastructure Committee Chairman James Oberstar (D-Minn.), is identical to the language already included in the House and Senate Transportation Appropriations conference report, which is now ensnared in the larger, unrelated fight over completing this year’s spending bills. “I salute Chairman Oberstar and his colleagues for this bold step,” said Capt. John Prater, ALPA’s president. “The legislation passed by the House of Representatives is consistent with ALPA’s Executive Board resolution that is designed to protect the interests of airline pilots and this Association.”
Instrumental in achieving passage of the legislation were House Aviation Subcommittee Chairman Jerry Costello (D-Ill.) and committee members Rep. Robin Hayes (R-N.C.) and Rep. John Mica (R-Fla.).
The Fair Treatment for Experienced Pilots Act, H.R.4343, was introduced this morning and placed on the House suspension calendar, which is a special procedure used to speed up action by setting aside the regular rules of order and requiring a two-thirds majority vote for passage of legislation.
In addition to allowing Part 121 airline pilots to fly up to age 65, H.R.4343 will clarify non-retroactivity, provide sufficient liability protection for unions, prohibit unilateral changes to labor agreements and benefit plans, eliminate the over/under split for domestic operations, and make the rule change effective as of the date the legislation is enacted.
The Senate will now have to decide whether to bring the measure up under their own procedural motion, known as unanimous consent, in which a legislative matter is considered agreed to if no Senator on the floor objects. The Senate has already once before unanimously approved the language of H.R.4343 in the form of the Stevens amendment during debate of the Transportation Appropriations bill on September 11.



This will undoubtably create a nice slow down of major airlines' hiring plans. So sit back, relax, and enjoy your stay at whatever regional you currently call home.

It has not passed the senate (yet) Write your senators. They all have webpages you can google.

 

[PCL_128]

It would be a real shame if FOs started writing up these elderly Captains for every little mistake they make. A real shame....

 

[BoilerUP]

Everybody repeat after me: "Here's a Double Quarter Pounder with Cheese meal for you Captain, my treat. They were out of diet so I got you a regular Coke instead. There's also plenty of salt on those fries."

 

[JumpersAway]

I am no more happy about the age 65 deal than anybody- completely screws anyone that isn't a widebody captain now. This may actually worsten the pilot shortage in the long run though- many may see this as a deterrent to getting into aviation. It's simply putting a chewing gum patch in the proverbial crack of the dam.

Regarding the dieting deal and not caring if anyone medicals out or not- Sometimes it doesn't matter what you do to take care of your body. What can you eat to keep your eyes from slipping up as you age? Also, you can get cancer from breathing fresh, clean air.......Diabetes is heredetary.....Need I say more? It isn't like our lifestyle is tollerant to any semblance of normalcy, or good health. I barely have time to eat, let alone eat well while on a trip.

I am guessing no REAL slow down in hiring, but it may not speed up either. I am thinking the bulk of the shockwave induced by this will be over in two years.

 

[prtyprtyprncss]

With them upping the age to 65yrs old, a lot of the "younger" FOs are gonna have to baby sit the age 60-65 captain. A lot can happen to the body and mind in that 5 year time frame. I am totally against flying past age 60. A lot of the guys I talk to that are getting close to age 60 dont want to fly past it. Hey, if you need to fly past age 60.. thats what the fractionals are for.

Careful with using that word "babysit"...if the company figures they can pay you babysitter wages you'll be making about $2.50/hr...good thing FO's don't "babysit" Captains...if an FO is fortunate enough to sit to the right of a Captain with 40 years of airline experience he or she should view it as a learning experience and not waste it trying to "one-up" the "old" guy or girl...and for the record, by the time I hit 60, I'll want out for sure!

 

[prtyprtyprncss]

No one has to baby sit me.

I dont know if anyone has ever heard this before:

"Once a man twice a baby"

Same goes if pilots fly to age 65. When they first started out they had to be baby sat by a more experienced pilot, now when they hit age 60-65 and they aren't very sharp anymore they are gonna have to be baby sat again.

But anyways eagle, hows that 7year upgrade going?

Man, aren't you hot under all those "blanket" statements? Ask the folks on UAL 232 how competent they thought Al Haynes was when he saved all of their lives...word has it that EVERY crew the instructors put thru that sim scenario afterwards lost the aircraft...younger crews, I might add...age 65 should be on a case-by-case basis although we all know that it won't be because the companies won't give up the $$ involved to have it that way...

 

[JumpersAway]

Man, aren't you hot under all those "blanket" statements? Ask the folks on UAL 232 how competent they thought Al Haynes was when he saved all of their lives...word has it that EVERY crew the instructors put thru that sim scenario afterwards lost the aircraft...younger crews, I might add...age 65 should be on a case-by-case basis although we all know that it won't be because the companies won't give up the $$ involved to have it that way...

It was a check airman from the back of the airplane that ultimately landed the thing- and figured out how to fly it with the throttles only. He wasn't seated because he was leaning over the pedestal flying and died in the crash. Al haines said "I've got it", moved the yolk full to one side, and figured out it really wasn't working- just like the FO that was flying said.