Do (can) any of use the old E6B wizwheel?

[CrimsonEclipse]

I found my old wizwheel and it all came back to me. I was just
kinda curious if anyone still uses it.

Do they still teach the new guys?

CE

 

[Photoflight]

I use it when I fly a plane with no dme/gs...still carry it in the bag.


They were pretty fond of it 4 or 5 years ago when I was training.

 

[aussiefly]

Yeah when i did my training the instructor I had hated the electronic ones and forced me to use the whiz wheel. It's kinda stuck and i've just always used it since. Mainly because i'm a cheap bastard and wouldnt shell out for a new one lol but seriously it does the job.

 

[falcon20driver]

Never used an e6b, military pilots use the Jeppeson CR computers, is the e6b something sportys sells?

 

[stearnst]

Never used an e6b, military pilots use the Jeppeson CR computers, is the e6b something sportys sells?

Yeah, but the CR is the only way to go. I'm going to paint a HUGE target on my back right here but...I was on the ERAU-Prescott flight team for four years and one of the NIFA events is computer accuracy where tests are taken with only a manual flight computer allowed. The CR-3 has a number of features above the E6B (finding crosswind component in knots on the back of the CR, mainly, there are bunches on the front side too). Sounds nerdy, I know, but for those that compete in the event they take it awfully seriously.

Everybody starting flight training these days still have to learn the manual flight computer operations, because to my knowledge, electronic flight computers aren't allowed in the private written exam.

 

[CA1900]

Everybody starting flight training these days still have to learn the manual flight computer operations, because to my knowledge, electronic flight computers aren't allowed in the private written exam.

Uhh... electronic flight computers have been allowed on the private written exam for at least the past decade.

 

[shamrock]

Uhh... electronic flight computers have been allowed on the private written exam for at least the past decade.

Considering the fact that you've been at Commutair for at least the past decade, how would you know?

 

[aucfi]

Used to use it all the time. I could do everything with it except the radius of action stuff. Anyone ever figure that out? More importantly, anyone ever use that haha?

 

[Cardinal]

I whip out my CR-2 for entertainment's sake once in a while, compute true air speed and ram rise and what not. No air data computer in our birds.

But what is truly priceless is the look on your FO's face...

 

[CA1900]

Considering the fact that you've been at Commutair for at least the past decade, how would you know?

imp: SMACK!

What can I say, I'm comfortable job-hunting from my own little corner of suck. :laugh:

 

[minitour]

Much prefer the E6B to the electronic computers. I can actually use them quicker/more accurately than the electric ones.

...and I always make sure my students know how to use them. You never know when their batteries are going to mysteriously die on a checkride, or in actual, or...

-mini

 

[A Squared]

Never used an e6b, military pilots use the Jeppeson CR computers, is the e6b something sportys sells?

Actually, the e6b at one time was a military issue item.

I can still use one, and occasionally I do. Our ops manual requires us to carry one, so I have one shoved in some corner of my flight bag.

 

[dseagrav]

I was told to get one because using a calculator is cheating. Punching numbers is more prone to error than having to use the manual computer because you get complacent with it faster, or something like that. I have one of the metal ones, it's pretty decently sized and heavy, so I bet I could incapacitate or kill someone with the slide if I had to. Aim for the eyes! Tell them sandpounder terrerists to just bring it, I can fight off any cockpit intrusion with my mighty E6B!

 

[siucavflight]

I find that it is quicker to use than the CR-2, but either way the FMS really does everything that the E6-B could.

 

[Gorilla]

Any FMC ever produced will tell you more than an e6b. I'm surprised so many guys still use them, at least in the jets, and that they are still required by some companies.

 

[Waldom]

I keep a CR-3 handy in the cockpit while working an FMS-equipped airplane although about the only thing I commonly use it for is converting U.S. gallons to liters for fuel requests overseas. A smaller CR-5 used to suffice until my aging eyes made a switch to the larger "Braile" version advisable. It is also there in case all the magic quits on an ocean crossing and we end up dead-reckoning, although the chances for that are infinitesimal on this equipment. [Yes, I still remember how to use the "wind" side of the computer.]

I use it as the sole means of navigation in my Cub because I specifically don't want a GPS aboard when I'm flying that airplane. I enjoy pilotage and dead-reckoning navigation and maintain proficiency in those skills.

I prefer the Jeppesen CR series of computer to the E-6B type due to their relative compactness and lighter weight.

On another note that might engender some dicussion, I believe all pilots should aquire competence in pilotage and dead-reckoning navigation during their initial training. I guess that knowledge is still required on the written and practical tests for a Private Pilot's licence, although that wouldn't be obvious after encountering some of the recently trained pilots I have lately. GPS and for that matter VOR and LF radio navigation are wonderful tools that also need to be mastered in training, but since all navigation methods are based on the fundamentals of dead-reckoning, a good grounding in it's basic principles is necessary.

 

[PacoPollo]

I have an E6B in my watch.

 

[pilotyip]

Understanding the E6B is the basis of understanding DR Navigation. I am still teaching how to use the E6B. It is like Celestial Navigation, it is becoming a lost art. BTW I used it as almost my primary Navigation computer crossing both the Atlantic and Pacific i nthe 60's and 70's. I am teaching my grandson cross country planning on my Military issued E6B from 1968.

 

[stearnst]

Used to use it all the time. I could do everything with it except the radius of action stuff. Anyone ever figure that out? More importantly, anyone ever use that haha?

For a radius of action problem on a CR, you take groundspeed out + groundspeed back, and that goes on top of your total minutes available in fuel. Then look underneath your groundspeed back, and it will give you the time in minutes to your point of no return. Take that time, apply it to your groundspeed out, and you've got your radius of action. There are a couple ways of simplifying the equation a little bit (effective TAS, mainly), but for the sake of explaining it, that's all you gotta do.

Yeah yeah...I'm a nerd. The good thing is I've never had any practical use for the equation.

 

[wrxpilot]

Yeah when i did my training the instructor I had hated the electronic ones and forced me to use the whiz wheel. It's kinda stuck and i've just always used it since. Mainly because i'm a cheap bastard and wouldnt shell out for a new one lol but seriously it does the job.

I hate the electric flight computers. All those buttons to push when it's bumpy, batteries that could die, etc. The manual wheel works much better IMO.

 

[infiniti757]

So what is the difference between E6B and CR?

OK I still use my E6B, mostly because I get bored on long legs. What are the differences between the E6B and the CR flight computers? I always thought they had the same functionality except one was round.

 

[cezzna]

Knowing the E6-B or the CR series may be impressive but it will die, as did celestial navigation. It's sad, I would like to have seen the celestial navaigation era but I missed that boat. There is going to be and already is a batch of pilots who can't fly steam guages, has no idea what an NDB approach is and could care less, and can download ARINC data to his cell phone faster than you can say E6-what?

Can you say sliderule?

 

[falcon20driver]

Heard some of these new pilots that haven't ever seen a clock that wasn't digital are having problems finding traffic when ATC calls it out.

 

[LarryinTN]

One more vote for the CR-? computeres. I still keep the smallest, the CR-5, in my flight bag. Don't use it very often but I occasionally pull it out to figure something out. Often TAS or ram rise. No FMS in these old DC9s...

When I was teaching in the late 1980s I used the CR with my primary students. Most went for the largest model, CR-2? I liked the way it could be used easier with one hand than the E6B since there were no autopilots in the trainers. Now I like the smaller size of the CR-5 so that it takes up less room in the flight bag.

I've never used an electronic flight computer. I keep a $5 calculator in the flight bag but that's it. You certainly don't need 8 decimal point percision when figuring out your time to the next fix...

 

[mtrv]

There is going to be and already is a batch of pilots who can't fly steam guages, has no idea what an NDB approach is and could care less

True, but they'll probably won't be flying into rising terrain, like so many pilots of the past have done! Todays electronic gagets have big advantages in situational awareness!

 

[agpilot34]

True, but they'll probably won't be flying into rising terrain, like so many pilots of the past have done! Todays electronic gagets have big advantages in situational awareness!

Yeah whatever... you just keep on thinking that as long as it helps you sleep well at night. I'm counting as we speak how many bizjets I can remember in recent history that have busted their @$$es on an approach, even WITH all the "high-zoot boogie" technology up front. Face it... glass cockpits and computers are cool, but they ARE NOT FOOL PROOF!! At least not yet, anyway.

As far as the whiz wheel goes, I've known how to use one since 7th grade. I dated a girl who's dad was a pilot, and he gave me his Sanderson SC-3B when he lost his medical and couldnt fly anymore. Geez that was over 30 years ago, so no telling how old this thing is, but I've used it ever since I started flying in 89'. He taught me the basics on it way back when, and I taught myself a bunch of functions on it using the manual, so I already had a pretty good working knowledge of the thing by the time I got out of high school and into flight school. I still use it from time to time. Incidentally, I've got a brand new CX-2 pathfinder electronic that my wife bought me last year. It's pretty cool, but when it comes to using one in the air, I grab the wheel EVERY time.

 

[mtrv]

I'm counting as we speak how many bizjets I can remember in recent history that have busted their @$$es on an approach, even WITH all the "high-zoot boogie" technology up front. Face it... glass cockpits and computers are cool, but they ARE NOT FOOL PROOF!! At least not yet, anyway.

Okay, begin going through every bizjet approach accident you can think of, and find out exactly what electronic navigation equipment was on board. Then compare these to something such as an Avidyne, Garmin 1000, or Chelton systems, where the moving map GPS provides a much larger scope of the whole picture.

I've read the why's and wherefor's of every major aircraft accident in the NTSB data-bases for years. Give me real statistics regarding flight into terrain & loss of situational awarness. You can include military & commercial accidents too.

For starters, we'll use the AA757 in South America, the C-130 at Jackson Hole, Wyoming, and the Ron Brown 737. In all cases, the pilots did not have the complete picture that's even available on today's hand-held GPS's. They became disorented, and not sure of the exact location, which could have easily been overcome with todays technology. And while you're at it, throw in a few bizjet approach's to some well known ski resorts in Colorado. Same thing!

 

[Waldom]

EGPWS and moving map displays are wonderful tools, but if you are relying on them for situational awareness, you are in the wrong profession.