Do Allegiant Air Pilot get to J/S

[ualdriver]

I guess MORE Captains realize what a big crock of cow droppings ALPA has become, and could give a rats ass about Section 115 of the admin manual.

Take your ALPA admin manual and choke on it.

That's nice. Can you tell us all what the Allegiant pilot group is doing in their attempts to improve the profession? What are the Allegiant pilots doing on Capitol Hill, for example, to influence legislation that is important to pilots? When can we expect Allegiant pilots to lead by example and put ALPA pilot contracts to shame with pay rates that are industry leading or even have a contract that has a retirement plan?

That's great that you can bash ALPA, but unfortunately I'm not seeing anything better coming from the Allegiant pilot group.

 

[chperplt]

That's nice. Can you tell us all what the Allegiant pilot group is doing in their attempts to improve the profession? What are the Allegiant pilots doing on Capitol Hill, for example, to influence legislation that is important to pilots? When can we expect Allegiant pilots to lead by example and put ALPA pilot contracts to shame with pay rates that are industry leading or even have a contract that has a retirement plan?

That's great that you can bash ALPA, but unfortunately I'm not seeing anything better coming from the Allegiant pilot group.

As I sit here on the throne taking my morning dump, I can't help but feel this is the perfect place to be when I read one of the great ualdrivers drivel filled responses.

 

[ualdriver]

As I sit here on the throne taking my morning dump, I can't help but feel this is the perfect place to be when I read one of the great ualdrivers drivel filled responses.

Drivel? I just asked you simple questions. You referred to my union in a derogatory manner. I did a quick scan of some key aspects of your contract over at airlinepilotcentral.com, and then responded with a few simple questions and a statement.

Feel free to answer any of those questions and make sure you wash your hands when you're done.

 

[chperplt]

Drivel? I just asked you simple questions. You referred to my union in a derogatory manner. I did a quick scan of some key aspects of your contract over at airlinepilotcentral.com, and then responded with a few simple questions and a statement.

Feel free to answer any of those questions and make sure you wash your hands when you're done.

All your questions have been answered time and time again. Not questions posed by different people, but questions posed by you. All answered.....

You're a funny dude... Your house is about to fall down on top of you, yet all your focus is on a small little non union airline with 40+ airplanes that continues to strive. Time for you to worry about your own issues...

Let's see... September LF

UAL= 79.7% down from 80.2% in Sep 07
AAY= 87.6% up from 76.5% in Sep 07

Stock price as of yesterday

UAL= $8.11
AAY= $30.57

So... Worry about what your union is doing for you, while we worry about what our non union group is doing for us.... which is quite a lot.

Time to take another ualdriver.. Got to love the coffee!

 

[ualdriver]

So... Worry about what your union is doing for you, while we worry about what our non union group is doing for us.... which is quite a lot.

Your non union group is doing quite a lot? OK.....Your narrowbody payrates are some of the lowest in the industry despite a recent attempt to improve them. You have little to no retirement. You have talented, experienced Captains at your airline working for wages less than VA's, but your guys have been around much longer. You remind me of how poorly my airline is doing and make a derogatory comment about my Union, but your non union group that is "doing quite a lot" for you can't even match the hourly rates of a bankrupt, legacy carrier with declining load factors and a YOY decrease in stock price (your analysis, not mine). Your non union group continues to do NOTHING on the very important legislative issues that will be coming up very soon and may affect ALL of us someday. From this backdrop of a seemingly mostly ineffective pilot group, you have the ordacity to talk trash?

Let me ask you, chperplt, if one took the above paragraph to heart which illustrates the many obvious failings of your "non union group" and then referred to your group as "cow droppings," what would you say?

ualdriver

 

[Fubijaakr]

ualdriver,

He reminds me of the old saying:

"Never try to teach a pig to sing. Its a waste of your time and it irritates the pig."

But, good luck in your attempt...

 

[ualdriver]

deleted

Sorry Fubijaakr I misread what you posted.

 

[chperplt]

Your non union group is doing quite a lot? OK.....Your narrowbody payrates are some of the lowest in the industry despite a recent attempt to improve them. You have little to no retirement. You have talented, experienced Captains at your airline working for wages less than VA's, but your guys have been around much longer. You remind me of how poorly my airline is doing and make a derogatory comment about my Union, but your non union group that is "doing quite a lot" for you can't even match the hourly rates of a bankrupt, legacy carrier with declining load factors and a YOY decrease in stock price (your analysis, not mine). Your non union group continues to do NOTHING on the very important legislative issues that will be coming up very soon and may affect ALL of us someday. From this backdrop of a seemingly mostly ineffective pilot group, you have the ordacity to talk trash?

Let me ask you, chperplt, if one took the above paragraph to heart which illustrates the many obvious failings of your "non union group" and then referred to your group as "cow droppings," what would you say?

ualdriver

Sure, we have a long way to go. We've been around a few years now and we're making money. As of the 2nd quarter, we've had 22 consecutive profitable quarters. Are we underpaid... Absolutely. Have we come a long way in the past few years and will we continue to increase our pay and benefits... absolutely.

The big difference between my non union group and your union group is that we're actually able to make change, and unlike your union, our change doesn't take years with a loss of jobs as the result.

While you sit there and talk smack about us because we get paid less than you and we haven't embraced the god that is ALPA, we continue to see yearly pay increases, premium pay for anything flown over 81 hours, some profit sharing, and oh... a profit.

I can't argue the retirement point... Our retirement sucks. We're working on that right now. Will it get better.... who knows.

Facts are facts... You're going to defend your dying union until the end and nothing we accomplish will meet your approval because we're just a bunch of non union industry killing w *************************.

I think you need to focus your energy on keeping your job first, then worry about my pay and retirement. If you haven't noticed, there's only 1 profitable major airline right now and you're not sitting around their paint job.

 

[citabriapilot]

So I can't back it up with facts, but I heard there was at least one resume in the pool that came from a UAL pilot wanting to go ahead and bail out and was looking at Allegiant for a future job.

FWIW...

P.S. How long did it take that little airline from Dallas that everyone hated to become "industry leading"? Hmmm, they aren't ALPA either...

 

[ualdriver]

The big difference between my non union group and your union group is that we're actually able to make change, and unlike your union, our change doesn't take years with a loss of jobs as the result.

Got it. In your world, pilots should accept substandard wages in order to subsidize the company's bottom line and then be happy when their airline is profitable and they have a job.

While you sit there and talk smack about us because we get paid less than you and we haven't embraced the god that is ALPA, we continue to see yearly pay increases, premium pay for anything flown over 81 hours, some profit sharing, and oh... a profit.

Excuse me, talk smack? Who referred to whose union as "cow droppngs?" And then who called out whom when said statement was made?

Further, when you agree to rates that are significantly less than everyone elses', you don't get to brag about "pay increases." If UAL pilots, for example, agreed to YOUR low pay rates, would we then get to brag about raises? Would a Skybus Captain making 60K/yr. get to brag to you about a 10% raise? See my point? Would a 60K/yr. Skybus A320 Captain get to brag about a profitable airline? Boasts about "pay raises" and a "profitable airline" kind of ring hollow coming from an Allegiant guy.

Facts are facts... You're going to defend your dying union until the end and nothing we accomplish will meet your approval because we're just a bunch of non union industry killing w *************************.

You guys will meet my approval when you stop making it harder for the rest of us to maintain our already too low wages. And for the record, it's not the fact that you're non union that bothers me. It's your compensation package that concerns me. I would love it if a non-union carrier came along and "showed up" any ALPA/union carrier with narrowbody equipment. I'll clue you in, though.....it won't be Allegiant. You guys are too passive and compliant.

I think you need to focus your energy on keeping your job first, then worry about my pay and retirement. If you haven't noticed, there's only 1 profitable major airline right now and you're not sitting around their paint job.

My focus is on my profession. It's not worth having a job if the best I can expect for my entire career are VA, Skybus, or Allegiant wages. It concerns me GREATLY when non union entities actively try to compete against me not by providing a superior product or service, but by playing the "who can agree to the lower payscale" game. I've already played that game in the early 00's. No one wins.

In conclusion in my last post to you as I need to heed Fuji's wise advice, it's amazing to me that you guys at low paying non union airlines continue to defend the ridiculous rates you fly for and then chastise those of us who are actually trying to raise the bar, including ALPA. The Skybus guys were the same exact way and I just don't get it. If you're satisfied with under $100/hr. MD-88 Captains with no retirement, that's fine I guess. Just don't come out on these forums critizing an entity that is actually trying to raise the bar and DEFEND the profession while you yourself are actively trying to pull it down. When you do BETTER, then you get to criticize. When that day comes, I'll listen.