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Delta screws over Mesaba Pilots compared to Compass

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PeanuckleCRJ said:
PM sent. I'd appreciate it if you would retract your statement about "DL dad's sperm" upon receipt considering what you previously asserted.
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I would appreciate putting a bullet through the head of your little green dancing avatar!
 
crj567 said:
I would appreciate putting a bullet through the head of your little green dancing avatar!
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I've tried. But the constant bricks through the windows and threats to my family require me to keep him up.
 
Oakum_Boy said:
They had to draw the line somewhere. And congrats on your safety record. Mesa can claim that too.
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I don't know how long you've been around flyin' shiny jets, but Mesaba is NOT Mesa. Mesaba (R.I.P.) has the best pilot group I've ever flown with. That includes NetJets and an European Airline. Top notch aviators, with few exceptions, and a training department that rivaled major carriers.

Mesaba got the raw end of the stick here, indeed. It sucks, but they all need to deal with it and move on. But to say Mesaba has substandard quality control shows a severe lack of professionalism. In fact, when Delta started a codeshare with NWA, they audited Mesaba. That audit included jump seat observations and training department assessments. Mesaba passed with very high marks.

To imply Compass Pilots are superior to Mesaba because of a screening process is complete BS, and anyone with that in mind is suffering from severe hubris. Consequently, I applied to Compass during my impending furlough at NetJets. I have over 8,000 in mostly turbine 121 airplanes, loads of jet PIC time (including flying in the EU), 121 Instructor time, and a perfect aviation record (Though I did have a kidney stone once...my one blemish). I was never even called for an interview.
 
xjgearbtch said:
Less than 100 mesaba pilots will be able to flow compared to Compass's entire list. Thanks Delta for showing your true colors.
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They don't owe you anything! If you want to work for them, APPLY! It might be faster than a flowthrough.
 
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kinda true, it was not set up to protect mainline jobs....those CPS seats WERE mainline NWA jobs stolen during BK and given to CPS. The flow was a concession negotiated by the NWA MEC to provide further furlough protection for those left on property. Let there be no misunderstanding....ALL the CPS seats were original NWA seats. ALL CPS newhires took the job with full knowledge that they could be furloughed at anytime for a flowdown. They are now being rewarded, and rightly so imho, with the promised flow-up. Kudo's to all coming to DAL next year, I look forward to flying with you. We now have so many bases to choose from., don't chase equipment and commute...bid close to home on anything you can hold and sit reserve from home if you can!
 
bri5150 said:
Isn't this true for ALL regional airlines? They were all mainline seats at some point.
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True.

But all regional flying was given away by the mainline pilots, due to many factors-ranging from arrogance to payscale protection. Once the cat was out of the bag, it was further leveraged during bankruptcy by management.

And now we have all this "take it back" talk which is once again falling victim to the same shortsighted vision, which will result in brand flying once again divided into mainline and regional, defined by aircraft type or size. A really pitiful repeat of past mistakes.

This flying giveaway has also resulted in considerable less hiring and even furloughs at the mainlines, which has resulted in many pilots choosing to hang their hats at the regional level, due to career and family timing.

blah

blah

blah

Yes, the regional pilots are definitely the ones who have stolen flying and ruined this industry.
 
xjgearbtch said:
Less than 100 mesaba pilots will be able to flow compared to Compass's entire list. Thanks Delta for showing your true colors.
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who gives a ********************. that cushy northwest flowthrough that became delta flowthrough was the biggest gift in the last decade in an industry that doesnt give gifts out.

Comair's shrinking and you're whining about your silver spoon flowthrough. go f--- yourself.
 
Speedtape said:
They don't owe you anything! If you want to work for them, APPLY! It might be faster than a flowthrough.
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Apply you say? Okay so I have no idea who else they hired but the one mesaba guy they did take could not even be professional when he was working at mesaba. The guy had less experience that most of the captains at mesaba. You ask why I say he was not professional? Well treating fellow employees in a rude manner, not showing up to work, and breaking call in honest rules for commuting is not professional. The word I got from one of our departments was that he was the 2nd most hated pilot in ops. He was also given a break when he was busted breaking rules and was lucky it was not put in his file-so Delta did not find out about it. The word is the guy knew some senior guys, maybe even management types and that is what got him the job. Of all the highly qualified captains I know at mesaba who applied, not one got even a call. So much for pref hiring-so much for standards.

I will keep applying at Delta, but I am sure I will end up somewhere else far after I would have been able to flow at Delta. Heck they are the only one hiring, oh unless Continental, United, and American burn through their furloughs when they need to hire. Yes we got screwed. You do not give someone career expectations and then take them away like that. Delta gave no indication that they were going to dump Mesaba, .....whatever. this is just typical management crap from NWA/Delta.
 
HMMMMMM look at the 100 to go(#233)....find any union leadership guys on that list...funny how those that were in on talks are flowing?
 
What's Wychor doing? Is he going to flow?
 
correct me if im wrong but wasnt it written into the the flow language that any sale of mesaba would effectively kill the flow? If that was the case, (what ive been told) then no one should be surprised that this is how it turned out.
 
Ridgeback said:
HMMMMMM look at the 100 to go(#233)....find any union leadership guys on that list...funny how those that were in on talks are flowing?
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Only 2 of 12 MEC officers made the flow. The negotiating chairman, who was in on the negotiations for the end of the flow, did not make it either. I really don't think there was an MEC conspiracy.

The flow has already passed TW by so he will not be flowing.

Don't shoot the MEC. They got 100 flow spots when there probably should have been none, since the Delta pilots got nothing out of this.

It's understandable that people are upset about not being able to flow but direct your anger at Delta management if you want to be mad at someone.
 
JoeMerchant said:
Why not? Isn't a Delta job better than a regional job?
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Not necessarily. It is for a guy who's 30, but maybe not for a guy who is 50 and very senior at his regional and will never recover the lost seniority.
 
Ridgeback said:
HMMMMMM look at the 100 to go(#233)....find any union leadership guys on that list...funny how those that were in on talks are flowing?
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As is should be! So, since they were "in on the talks," they should not flow? MAYBE, YOU SHOULD HAVE BEEN "in on the talks!" Would you be on FI compaining about flowing? :D
 
PCL_128 said:
Not necessarily. It is for a guy who's 30, but maybe not for a guy who is 50 and very senior at his regional and will never recover the lost seniority.
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I'm surprised you took the bait....But since you did...

Many of the "flowthrough ALPA cheerleaders" have sold us on the fact that flowing up is best for us. In addition, we have been sold the line that is best for us if this flying goes back to the mainline.

You have now agreed with us that for many of us it doesn't make sense...How does ALPA now deal with this conflict of interest? I belong to the group you speak of above as do many of us at the regionals. We will never recover the lost seniority...Are we honestly expected to support a union that takes our flying away? How do we support a union that tries to do this?

I'm actually impressed by your statement above as it acknowledges the issue we face...I'm surprised you took the bait....
 
JoeMerchant said:
I'm surprised you took the bait...
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It keeps me entertained. ;)

Many of the "flowthrough ALPA cheerleaders" have sold us on the fact that flowing up is best for us. In addition, we have been sold the line that is best for us if this flying goes back to the mainline.
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I would agree with both statements, although there are exceptions to every rule. Very few regional pilots fit into the category of being better off staying at a regional. Most regional pilot are looking to move up, and most regional pilots would rather be flying a small jet at mainline than at a regional carrier.

You have now agreed with us that for many of us it doesn't make sense...How does ALPA now deal with this conflict of interest? I belong to the group you speak of above as do many of us at the regionals. We will never recover the lost seniority...Are we honestly expected to support a union that takes our flying away? How do we support a union that tries to do this?
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First, I don't think you fit into this category. I've never met you, but I'm told that you're relatively young. Staying at ASA is probably not in your best interests long-term.

But even for those that do fit into this category, there isn't any conflict of interest, because I don't see anyone trying to "take your flying." Merely holding on to scope is a tough enough battle for DAL pilots, let alone recapturing lost flying. So, who is trying to "take your flying?"
 
PCL_128 said:
Not necessarily. It is for a guy who's 30, but maybe not for a guy who is 50 and very senior at his regional and will never recover the lost seniority.
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maybe if they go to airtran but not delta. Just hired many in thier 40 and 50's.

i have recovered in pay, have more days off, three times the 401k benefit in year three at delta than after 10 plus years at mesaba. not to mention ten times the better treatment.
 
Why don't you all stop the b/s...put in your application and go through the interview process and get hired.....if you pass.

I would rather earn the job than flow into it.

Nothing says that you cannot apply for the position...DO IT.
 
xjhawk said:
Apply you say? Okay so I have no idea who else they hired but the one mesaba guy they did take could not even be professional when he was working at mesaba. The guy had less experience that most of the captains at mesaba. You ask why I say he was not professional? Well treating fellow employees in a rude manner, not showing up to work, and breaking call in honest rules for commuting is not professional. The word I got from one of our departments was that he was the 2nd most hated pilot in ops. He was also given a break when he was busted breaking rules and was lucky it was not put in his file-so Delta did not find out about it. The word is the guy knew some senior guys, maybe even management types and that is what got him the job. Of all the highly qualified captains I know at mesaba who applied, not one got even a call. So much for pref hiring-so much for standards.

I will keep applying at Delta, but I am sure I will end up somewhere else far after I would have been able to flow at Delta. Heck they are the only one hiring, oh unless Continental, United, and American burn through their furloughs when they need to hire. Yes we got screwed. You do not give someone career expectations and then take them away like that. Delta gave no indication that they were going to dump Mesaba, .....whatever. this is just typical management crap from NWA/Delta.
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United and CAL furloughs?....they can get called back.....REAL quick after the contract is settled. Stay tuned.
 

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