Delta screws over Mesaba Pilots compared to Compass

[WMUSIGPI]

As one who will not get to flow, I am disapointed though not surprised. I found the option to be a nice bonus for putting up with all the crap under NWA. As far as I am concerned it is done. My crosshairs are squarely on one target; Pinnacle Inc. and the joint contract. Anyone know where I can get one of those F.U.P.M. bracelets?

 

[Mel Sharples]

It makes perfect sense. If the Compass flow went away now, DAL would have to curtail the number of 76 seat jets in the DCI fleet. This is by agreement between DAL and DAL ALPA. By grandfathering in Compass's whole list, it gives DAL management years to figure out a way out of those provisions and/or grow their fleet to accommodate more 76 seaters. DAL could have turned the switch off at Mesaba any time with any repercussion to their operation. It all came down to the fact that DAL didn't have to honor the Mesaba flow, so they didn't.

And the scope issue is not an issue at all. Whether the flow stayed or not had nothing to do with Delta's ability to keep the 76-seat flying so that is not even part of this.

Doin Time - I think I misunderstood your post when I wrote the above part. I meant to the flow at Mesaba only has nothing to do with scope. Not sure about Compass and I should have read your post more carefully first. Had I read it to the end, I wouldn't have posted what I did.

My apologies...

 

[FDJ2]

My issue isn't with the DAPLPA, they didn't have final controlling authority of retaining mesaba's flow thru. Delta management is who I have a beef with. Hence my thread title.

Actually, final controlling authority came from 4 parties. All four have to agree to the terms to continue the flow through. Not letting DAL management off the hook, but you might consider that it might be Mesaba management who will ultimately be the more limiting factor here. Just a thought.

 

[FDJ2]

With this wonderful relationship that the DAL MEC Chairman always claims to have with Richard Anderson and the rest of Delta management, one would think that he could have secured a better deal for the Mesaba pilots. Or maybe he just didn't want to secure a better deal for them. Either way, I hope the Mesaba reps keep this in mind when it comes time to cast their vote for ALPA President in two months.

PCL, you just might want to consider that these were 4 party negotiations, and that perhaps, just perhaps someone other than DAL, DALPA, or the Mesaba MEC might have a say.

Don't you have bigger fish to fry on your own property right now? Maybe you should mind your own store instead of tossing stones across the hall.

 

[JoeMerchant]

Actually, final controlling authority came from 4 parties. All four have to agree to the terms to continue the flow through. Not letting DAL management off the hook, but you might consider that it might be Mesaba management who will ultimately be the more limiting factor here. Just a thought.

Why would the regional management oppose skimming higher paid senior pilots off the top...I suspect the opposition came from DAL mgmt. and DALPA who like to control who they annoint a "Delta pilot".

Let this be yet another lesson that "flowthrough" schemes don't work...This is like watching someone try to win 3 card monty over and over again.....

 

[JoeMerchant]

With this wonderful relationship that the DAL MEC Chairman always claims to have with Richard Anderson and the rest of Delta management, one would think that he could have secured a better deal for the Mesaba pilots. Or maybe he just didn't want to secure a better deal for them. Either way, I hope the Mesaba reps keep this in mind when it comes time to cast their vote for ALPA President in two months.

This doesn't surprise some of us PCL128....Yet another failed example of a "flowthrough"....

 

[PCL_128]

Joe, I actually agree, for the most part. This is a major blow to the credibility of flow-through agreements, which I think is a real shame. Flow-throughs were probably the best hope of starting to move towards brand scope, but this will scare regional pilots away. If we can't get real commitments from mainline MECs to secure iron-clad language, then regional pilots will never accept a flow-through as a viable option, and we just end up with more division. We have to start moving towards a real system of career progression that will provide job security for all pilots. I could be wrong, but I just don't see this result as a sincere effort to make this work.

BTW, no reason to get mad, FDJ. We're usually on the same side. We shouldn't let one difference of opinion on union politics cause division.

 

[bri5150]

Why would the regional management oppose skimming higher paid senior pilots off the top...I suspect the opposition came from DAL mgmt. and DALPA who like to control who they annoint a "Delta pilot".

Let this be yet another lesson that "flowthrough" schemes don't work...This is like watching someone try to win 3 card monty over and over again.....

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. THIS ONE DID WORK!!! Over 100 pilots flowed up to Delta/NWA and none flowed down. How did that not work? It just wasn't in place for a particularly long time. Not only that, but everyone that was hired at Compass under the assumption they would flow, WILL.

 

[Speedtape]

With the recent reports on the economy, I wouldn't want to be on the bottom of anybody's seniority list? I'm afraid the worst is to come.

 

[Scope out RJ's]

This doesn't surprise some of us PCL128....Yet another failed example of a "flowthrough"....

How's that? Didn't over 100 pilots flow up? How many flowed back?
Sorry you didn't make the cut in your interviews, and are stuck at ASA. Looks like this is one case where the interview process worked!
But hey, you can look at those newhires at ASA, and proudly tell them, "I bought my job here at ASA so you didn't have to.":laugh::laugh:

 

[titans10]

But hey, you can look at those newhires at ASA, and proudly tell them, "I bought my job here at ASA so you didn't have to.":laugh::laugh:


Very true statement. Everyone hired atleast in the mid to late 90's were PFT.

 

[regionalcap]

This doesn't surprise some of us PCL128....Yet another failed example of a "flowthrough"....

This statement pisses me off. How the hell did it fail? 100 Mesaba guys and the Compass guys get to go to Delta!! How many Delta guys flowed back?!? Of course, some of those hired in recent years (myself included) didn't have a flowthrough and had to do it the old fashioned way. I am glad to have new hires below me but your statement just comes across as dumb.

 

[xjhawk]

Also compass pilots were hired by nwa captains where as mesaba guys were hired by joe mesaba. It sucks mesaba guys sorry

The ironic thing is that very junior mesaba guys who were those 300 hour wonder hires who were furloughed and then picked up at compass will upgrade and flow to Delta now. Thats great of Delta leaving so many highly qualified Mesaba pilots at Pinnacle. We all had career expectations. I am sick of broken promises.

I understand our flow agreement did not have balls behind it like compass's did but come on! heck I do not think I was as close as a 3-4 year flow but at least it was a great backup plan. Now we are sitting here wondering how many years it will be before Amercian-United (continental)-Southwest will be hiring. I should think that those very jr compass guys will be at compass for quite some time before those airlines burn through their current furlough list.

This blows. Someone please call 1800 ask gary to see if a class action lawsuit would hold water for lost career expectations

 

[RiddleRat]

Its the luck of the draw, I mean heck look @ Eagle, a few of them are flowing to AA as the rest of the eagle drivers are stuck and having to wait to do a standard interview. It is a result of the discussions between your MEC. Going to court I don't think would at all help the case other than put Mesaba at the same level of respect (or lack their of) as Comair... The flowthrough wasn't something I dont think a lot of people planned on but only hoped worked out. To get spun up cause Compass got a better deal, lets see how "better of a deal" it would of been if Delta/NWA furloughed and only 100 guys were able to flow back to Mesaba, as opposed to the entire Compass list being flushed.

Get over it move on and welcome to the regionals, BOHICA

 

[callowayhd]

The ironic thing is that very junior mesaba guys who were those 300 hour wonder hires who were furloughed and then picked up at compass will upgrade and flow to Delta now. Thats great of Delta leaving so many highly qualified Mesaba pilots at Pinnacle. We all had career expectations. I am sick of broken promises.

I understand our flow agreement did not have balls behind it like compass's did but come on! heck I do not think I was as close as a 3-4 year flow but at least it was a great backup plan. Now we are sitting here wondering how many years it will be before Amercian-United (continental)-Southwest will be hiring. I should think that those very jr compass guys will be at compass for quite some time before those airlines burn through their current furlough list.

This blows. Someone please call 1800 ask gary to see if a class action lawsuit would hold water for lost career expectations

I was one of them, now someday i hope you will be my gear bitch!