Delta merger? Only if Lee Moak says so...

[michael707767]

What is Moak's scope position?

Well, prior to LOA 51 he was very vocal about saying we will hold the line at 70 seats. Then, when the TA came out he was saying how 76 seats works, its good for the Delta pilots and its only six seats. Yadda, yadda, yadda. I think the union screwed the pooch on scope. 76 seaters were not needed and I don't think the company would have shot down the TA over six seats.

However BS I thought the TA was with regards to scope, the pilots voted it in. So, I don't lose sleep over it anymore. I only care what happens going forward.

That said, I do think Lee is trying to do his best to represent the Delta pilots. I think his efforts are misguided sometimes, but I believe he does things because he thinks they are best.

On the issue of mergers, I support him 100%. I think he is right to say without pilot support, any merger becomes impossible. Good for you Lee.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Well, prior to LOA 51 he was very vocal about saying we will hold the line at 70 seats. Then, when the TA came out he was saying how 76 seats works, its good for the Delta pilots and its only six seats. Yadda, yadda, yadda. I think the union screwed the pooch on scope. 76 seaters were not needed and I don't think the company would have shot down the TA over six seats.

However BS I thought the TA was with regards to scope, the pilots voted it in. So, I don't lose sleep over it anymore. I only care what happens going forward.

That said, I do think Lee is trying to do his best to represent the Delta pilots. I think his efforts are misguided sometimes, but I believe he does things because he thinks they are best.

On the issue of mergers, I support him 100%. I think he is right to say without pilot support, any merger becomes impossible. Good for you Lee.

Mark my words, DALPA will go along with the merger, scope will be conceded to 90 seats, and you'll get a windfall in stock in the new merged company.

 

[General Lee]

Mark my words, DALPA will go along with the merger, scope will be conceded to 90 seats, and you'll get a windfall in stock in the new merged company.

The way ASA is looking these days, looks like you very well could be an FO for life there after the downgrades and shrinking occurs. Man alive, it is amazing what has happened to ASA. You used to be the big commuter at ATL, and now you barely hold on to the "largest" regional title there. You were large in DFW and even had a SLC and LAX base. Where did it all go?

I think you need to start worrying about your own situation. Dalpa and Moak have a good hold on our current situation, as the article suggests. He also knows about our scope limit, and without a judge looking over him, it is highly doubtful he would give that away. But, if you know otherwise, well then there you have it. Thanks for your wise words.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Max Powers]

Like the little league part.... "Not letting the weaker players play"

Hello Mcfly.....there kids for christ sake just trying to learn....get some perspective - typical Jar head.

 

[General Lee]

*THUMP* *THUMP* *THUMP*

More inane chest thumping from DALPA. Just like they did right before they promised no scope concessions, then conceded.

If Anderson and the BOD want a merger, it will happen regardless of what Moak and DALPA think. What will they do strike? Riiiight. DALPA have already proven that they are too big of pussies to do anything about it. They're nothing but a bunch of big mouthed pussies, just like their ring leader General Lee.

HAH HA HA. Really? How is your ASA scope working? You have NONE. Your precious ATRs are going away (and you back to school to hopefully pass), and that flying will probably be replaced by someone else. We have limits on regional planes, whereas you have NONE. You are the ones losing your jobs and planes. You fail to realize that our backs were against the wall in BK, with a judge watching. You keep forgetting that point. Now we don't have that, and if you remember we did quite well during the last contract negotiations prior to 9-11. Scope is a big thing to us now, since everyone can see that RJs are not good financially anymore. (were they ever?) Even Anderson concedes that. It is very doubtful that our guys will be blinded into giving away 90 or more seats. I think Moak knows that, and having the payrates for E190s and up should mean something. (even CR9s with 86 seats have Delta payrates) Anything over 76 seats will have our pilots flying it----unless MARS ATTACKS! and we have another BK. You might be wishing for that John, but I would be worrying about other things now if I were you, like CR2 limitations.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Max Powers]

HAH HA HA. Really? How is your ASA scope working? You have NONE. Your precious ATRs are going away (and you back to school to hopefully pass), and that flying will probably be replaced by someone else. We have limits on regional planes, whereas you have NONE. You are the ones losing your jobs and planes. You fail to realize that our backs were against the wall in BK, with a judge watching. You keep forgetting that point. Now we don't have that, and if you remember we did quite well during the last contract negotiations prior to 9-11. Scope is a big thing to us now, since everyone can see that RJs are not good financially anymore. (were they ever?) Even Anderson concedes that. It is very doubtful that our guys will be blinded into giving away 90 or more seats. I think Moak knows that, and having the payrates for E190s and up should mean something. (even CR9s with 86 seats have Delta payrates) Anything over 76 seats will have our pilots flying it----unless MARS ATTACKS! and we have another BK. You might be wishing for that John, but I would be worrying about other things now if I were you, like CR2 limitations.


Bye Bye--General Lee

I think his point is: in any merger you don't have much say so.......unless you all just quit, that might work.


What will happen is each company's union will sell out its junior members while the company sheds all the excess capacity. Say hello to 15 to 20 year upgrades especially with age 65 coming.

 

[General Lee]

I think his point is: in any merger you don't have much say so.......unless you all just quit, that might work.


What will happen is each company's union will sell out its junior members while the company sheds all the excess capacity. Say hello to 15 to 20 year upgrades especially with age 65 coming.

No, our union has a provision in our contract that gives us the right to turn down mergers. That is the key. And, we have already parked the planes we plan to park (737-200s, 737-300s, MD11s etc). The MD88s have all been released at great lease rates (down from $280,000 a month to $80,000 a month each), so they will probably not be parked. We are getting 9 MD90s next year (all additional planes), and there are 50-70 more on the market waiting for us. We are getting 7 737-700s next year, with up to 20-25 probably coming our way according to Anderson (in a town hall meeting). He also said we are getting 8 777LRs over the next 2 years (08 and 09) with a possible 20-25 total 777LRs in the next 3 to 5 years. I call that growth. We retired everyone prior to BK, so we knew the age 65 rule would eventually come around. It is not hurting our current hiring at all, which is all based on INTL growth and some domestic growth.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[PCL_128]

Mark my words, DALPA will go along with the merger, scope will be conceded to 90 seats, and you'll get a windfall in stock in the new merged company.

Have you ever met Lee Moak? Don't underestimate him. In my opinion, the best MEC Chairman in ALPA currently. He did a superb job in handling the BK contract (even though I wish the 76-seat concession hadn't taken place). I wouldn't bet against Captain Moak.

 

[IronCityBlue]

Have you ever met Lee Moak? Don't underestimate him. In my opinion, the best MEC Chairman in ALPA currently. He did a superb job in handling the BK contract (even though I wish the 76-seat concession hadn't taken place). I wouldn't bet against Captain Moak.

I hope he can not only hold the line, but make progress moving it the other direction. CAL is holding fast at 50 seats (for now) and AA is pushing for 100% scope. Although I doubt they will get that, if they can bring the 70 in house that will be huge progess.

While there shouldn't be any outsourcing, there is no way for everyone to bring everything in house tomorrow. Re-establishing the limit at 50 seats would be amazing progress.

 

[PCL_128]

It simply isn't possible to make progress in the other direction. Once scope is gone, it's gone for good unless you have some way of creating a one-list with your regional feeders. DAL now has 10 DCI feeders, so a one-list is no longer an option for DAL. If DALPA attempted to "take back" scope, then Dan Ford would file lawsuits about DALPA "stealing" his flying. Another RJDC mess would ensue. Holding onto current scope is about as good as anyone can hope for.