DAL pilot

[Muskycat]

You're right, I forgot it was 737s Airtran started with. Then after Value Jet bought them out they had DC-9s. And I would agree that Airtran is doing very well these days.

 

[Bill Mostelar]

shame

So who pays in the long run? The young guys at Comair. A resolution was just passed at mainline Delta Alpa to give preferential hiring to ASA pilots when we start again. It will happen, just look at the history of the airlines. Fanman is right in the fact that we will not forget.

Good luck to all,

GII/GIII FO
former a DAL737FO [/B]

I agree 100%. It is a shame for the young guys at CMR. When DAL starts hiring again, they may miss out. DAL will hire again in 5 yrs or so, and at that time, many will be trying to distance themselves from the heat of this era.

Either pressure your reps to change their stance now......or.... well I guess I'll be looking forward to proudly sharing the cockpit with a former ASA newhire.

Thanks guys (ASA) for your reasonable and honorable stance. It will come back around.

 

[P38JLightning]

What is so funny about all this is the Delta pilots on this and other boards have probably made it impossible for Delta NOT to hire a boat load of Comair applicants when they resume hiring.
You ever heard of labor laws? Discrimination laws?

I can see Leo now. "Uh, o k ...., not hire Comair pilots because the pilots don't want me to, and then hundreds of unfair labor law suits to follow? I don't think so. I know a lot of pilots who already have talked to lawyers, and they are having them track these post for future reference.

You guys crack me up


__________________
Afellowaviator


Actually fellow, its highly unlikely the comair pilots who fully intend on *applying* to Delta someday would be NEARLY as interested in suing to get a Delta job, as compared to those who are currently suing for that same brass ring already.

Perhaps your assertion is that if those who intend on applying find themselves blackballed (which is probably one of the main reasons the Delta MEC's request was rejected in the first place...to lash out against the young punks who "unfairly" go to mainline "ahead of" more senior people for whatever reason) then they, too, would try to sue their way to the top, in the name of "fairness."

Not likely either. You see, there are plenty of Delta pre hires already at Comair. Lots of senior Delta captains send their sons and daughters to the Comair Academy. You can bet your bottom dollar THEY won't be affected by any blackball. Nor will any military "squardon buddies" or any other special interest group. So Delta will be able to say "look at all these Comair pilots we're still hiring...what do you mean discrimination??"

All thats been done with the denial of the Delta furlough/seniority request is to hose the average junior line pilot who might someday want to seek employment at Delta someday. While you have suceeded in making sure most of those junior to you at Comair will ever go to Delta someday, "ahead of" you, odds are anyone in the future who would aspire to get hired by Delta would likely also be interested in United, Northwest, Jet Blue, Southwest, Continental, Air Tran, Alaska, FedEx, UPS, DHL, the next low fare start up d'jour airline or whoever else.

So you've done nothing to control future attrition, nor enlighten the clueless junior pilots with a "career airline" epiphany. You know, if they intend on staying they will fight harder for what's right. Which, by the way, if you even believe in the first place, then you owe the junior pilots who went on strike a HUGE appology, because they were a massive part of the pilot unity of that time. A time if you remember, when most airlines were still hiring. If all they cared about was getting their time and getting out, how do you explain the high level of unity and Comair patriotisim?

So sit back and enjoy the fact that no Comair pilot without an inside track will ever work for Delta some day, "ahead of" you. Other than that one little thing, which won't affect your life one bit, not much has changed. What a grand victory.

 

[Otto]

Question for DAL guys

Simple question for anyone at DAL. If it's the senior guys at Comair (the RJ career types) causing all the trouble, why are you punishing the young guys ie. the wrong people?

 

[AFELLOWAVIATOR]

MUSKYCAT, Your so ill informed it is laughable. The Delta pilots contract is the reason Comair can never FLY ANY THING LARGER THAN 70 SEATS. i WILL LET IT GO AT THAT, GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT BEFORE YOU GET ON THIS BOARD AND MAKE AN IDIOT OF YOUR SELF AGAIN.

 

[Muskycat]

Afellowaviator





Yes I'm fully aware of the fact of the Delta scope limits Comair to 70 seats which is also tied to main line growth. That's why I said the following:

"Has anyone taken the time to figure why Comair management doesn't buy a certificate and operated Dc-9s, 737, or Airbuses as a separate entity."

Do you know what it means to operate as a separate entity???
Yes that's right, a company with a name other than Comair that's not a DIC carrier. The Delta Scope only pertains to DIC.

 

[Bill Mostelar]

Re: Question for DAL guys

Simple question for anyone at DAL. If it's the senior guys at Comair (the RJ career types) causing all the trouble, why are you punishing the young guys ie. the wrong people?

Why punish the Iraqi people, when it's leadership that's to blame?

At some point there is some accountability that has to take place. If the average CMR pilot disagrees with leadership, then it's time for reform. Sitting idly will not cut it in today’s competitive world.

Unfortunately for JC, Cory, BB and the boys, they don't hold the same cards as they did during their strike. That was cutthroat, black and white; where each side was expected to fight till death, and then get along later. This is much different and similar to a public low blow of a family member. You don't do that.

We were on course to begin to fix this thing, and those guys are (once again) looking for more controversy, more hype, and really taking things too far.

If their own constituents and subordinates are willing to do nothing, then they are aligning themselves with leadership who is going to sell them at the meat market. I don't feel sorry for the junior CMR pilots who are not willing to control their own destiny and at least speak up.

As I said, I look forward to returning favors to the ASA pilot group. If nothing else, (it's not just where they were hired) they choose to elect and give ongoing support to progressive leadership.

Those who sit on their hands are part of the problem. Don't align yourselves with the "new lunatic fringe". Stand up for yourselves. Use the brain God gave you to stick with the (historically) financially rewarded (not company, but group of aviators who have the strongest inherent bargaining leverage).
....rather than some ex-salesman, televangelist type and his henchmen.


Good luck.

 

[Cliff]

This still doesn't mean you are not an ALPA scab. Are you?

Man that took some thought, Hey????? Nope not a scab just someone with an opinion...

 

[Cliff]

DS: The Delta furloughs would not kick RJ guys out on the street, they would go to the bottom of the list?

Cliff: Why the bottom??? They have been flying the RJ's longer than you!! You go to the bottom of the list, heck your not even on their seniority list!!! What gives you the right to kick an ASA pilot out of his or her seat AND have a higher seniority number??? Let me guess,,, your a big bad mainline guy at Delta.. Big deal...

DS: Who would that hurt, especially if they are hiring 40-50 a month?

Cliff: Your fellow ALPA Bro that who... I'm sorry I forgot your an ALPA guy too... Who's a scab????

DS: They were offered something like preferential hiring to allow our guys to go to the BOTTOM?

Cliff: What????????

DS: So, you want them to "suck it up" and march to the unemployment line?

Cliff: Yes, like a man.. Not a whining anti-RJ (the sky is falling, the sky is falling) Delta Dip... Grow up the smaller RJ's are in your crads... The days of flying 767's on 300 mile hops are over... Face it.. Adapt and overcome or die...


DS: Well, they might do that for a while, but eventually they will pass your a$$ in their new Porsche.

Cliff: OK just drop the pipe and it will be just fine....

DS: And, you want our guys to change some work rules. Hmmm. Sounds like Delta is in such dire straits----they still have enough money to buy $1.1 billion worth of new RJ's this year alone, and have $2.6 billion in cash, with another $2 Billion in equity to mortgage if they have too.

Cliff: Yep, the work rules that allow a reserve guy to turn down a trip and then call in on a day off to work and get paid time and a half... You guys are killing your own company... Better start working 70 hours for 70 hours pay!!!! Like the rest of the world...


DS: What work rules do you want us to change? Fly more? Nope, not with guys out. Pay cut? How about management also, and Comair and ASA guys--just to keep it fair.


Cliff: This is classic... Won't fly more because of guys being on furlough... Meaning, you won't fly the 80 you are paid for??? Well thats a catch 22... Lets not work and F**k the company because our buds are on the street because of a slowdown and therefore profits drop and guess what??? More furloughs...

Profit = Expense's - cost - selling price

Profit ratio% = ( profit / selling price )100

Think about an action before there is an reaction.... Not working hurts a fellow Union member.. It doesn't help them......

The way the work rules are now its a paradigm... Its time to reset them..

ALPA cannot serve both the Majors and Regionals within the same company... Its clearly a conflict of interest... For pilots to fight the RJ's- demanding limits- and the next demanding a seat clearly shows cowardice and lack of integrity...

Being a Delta pilot does not allow you to force yourself into a seat..

 

[AFELLOWAVIATOR]

Bill ,

You sound like an idiot. Our MEC was doing there job. They entered that meeting with one thing in mind. COMAIR PILOTS. It IS WHAT THEY WERE ELECTED TO DO. They are not AIR. INC.

I can't believe some of the post I am reading on the subject. We are suppose to be mad because our MEC was doing what they were elected to do? I hate to break the news to you, but our MEC was not elected to get us jobs at Delta, and they were not elected to get Delta pilots jobs at Comair. They were elected to represent the COMAIR PILOTS needs at every opportunity that arises. Your MEC had issues and our MEC had issues. Ours listened and yours did not. In fact, your people resorted to empty, shameless threats when our MEC would not cave to there demands. I would be embarrased if I was a Delta Pilot, the way your rep. acted.