DAL applies to DOT for Haneda service.

[General Lee]

The Japaneese like those 747's. Good luck DAL!

Is that why JAL will be dumping 37 of their 744s?


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Furloughed80]

This is only round 1 for slot HND applications. If certain airlines are not awarded slots this round they will certainly be in the later rounds.

 

[EWR_FO]

1st off, NWA had 5th Freedom rights, and not as many slots as you think at NRT. But compared to JAL and ANA, NWA was a distant third, with a few large pushes each day. But, we are talking about HND. A lot of airlines have slots at Gatwick in London, but as soon as LHR opened up, (originally TWA and Pan Am had exclusive rights at LHR--converting to AA and UAL later) BA had to give up some slots. HND is a domestic only airport with 95% of the slots going to JAL and ANA, and now it is open for INTL service. That means that they have to give up some slots to make it fair. DL now has the "rights" to fly from Tokyo, and they actually originated in HND long ago before NRT was even built. If you think DL should divest some NRT slots, maybe that would be fine as long as the were traded equally for HND slots. That was the original deal when NWA gained the rights anyway......And, if you really want to laugh, go look at yourself naked in the mirror.


Bye Bye---General Lee

You can't have fifth freedom rights without slots, if you have ever been to NRT you wouldn't be telling me they don't have as many as I think. I have been flying in there since 1994 and the ramp was ALWAYS full of NW airplanes-both pax and cargo. The Japanese government doesn't give a s**t what you or I think is "fair". Stick to flying airplanes, you have no future in comedy.

 

[Dumb Pilot]

That means that they have to give up some slots to make it fair. DL now has the "rights" to fly from Tokyo, and they actually originated in HND long ago before NRT was even built. If you think DL should divest some NRT slots, maybe that would be fine as long as the were traded equally for HND slots. That was the original deal when NWA gained the rights anyway......And, if you really want to laugh, go look at yourself naked in the mirror.

The only thing they have to do is stay Japanese, they will release more slots to an airport that service Tokyo's metropolitan area and that is Narita.

 

[General Lee]

You can't have fifth freedom rights without slots, if you have ever been to NRT you wouldn't be telling me they don't have as many as I think. I have been flying in there since 1994 and the ramp was ALWAYS full of NW airplanes-both pax and cargo. The Japanese government doesn't give a s**t what you or I think is "fair". Stick to flying airplanes, you have no future in comedy.

That's not what the packed house at the Laugh Barn in Marietta thinks each Thursday night! Sure we have a lot of slots, and if our own gov't gave a dam they would pressure the Japanese to give up more at HND, just like they did with BA at LHR. And, why are you still an FO if you started going to NRT in 94? I know 97 hires that are 737 Captains in EWR. You sound burned out. Go for it, it will change your life I am sure.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

The only thing they have to do is stay Japanese, they will release more slots to an airport that service Tokyo's metropolitan area and that is Narita.

What we need to do is get Ray "the hood" Lahood to pressure them a bit more, like telling them JAL and ANA will lose some American slots if more aren't opened up for US Carriers. Come on Lobbyists!


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Dumb Pilot]

What we need to do is get Ray "the hood" Lahood to pressure them a bit more, like telling them JAL and ANA will lose some American slots if more aren't opened up for US Carriers. Come on Lobbyists!


Bye Bye--General Lee

Excuse me? Political pressure to a government that holds and continue to acquire a big chunk of our debt? It must be nice to live in your own little world General or should I say, Alice

 

[General Lee]

Excuse me? Political pressure to a government that holds and continue to acquire a big chunk of our debt? It must be nice to live in your own little world General or should I say, Alice

Classic? I guess Obama meeting with the Dali Lama doesn't mean anything to you? Sure, that din't happen, and the Chinese gov't was happy about that. Yeah, our Gov't ALWAYS bows down to other governments...... You need to turn on CNN a bit more when you are on the road.

We have a process here in the States where we can put monetary pressure on the administration, and it is called using lobbyists. You have been out of the country too long, but maybe you should stay out longer, Alice.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[EWR_FO]

That's not what the packed house at the Laugh Barn in Marietta thinks each Thursday night! Sure we have a lot of slots, and if our own gov't gave a dam they would pressure the Japanese to give up more at HND, just like they did with BA at LHR. And, why are you still an FO if you started going to NRT in 94? I know 97 hires that are 737 Captains in EWR. You sound burned out. Go for it, it will change your life I am sure.


Bye Bye--General Lee

I have no desire to ever fly a domestic flight again but thanks for the concern. The only reason BA was pressured to give up slots at LHR was because there were a disproportionate number of NYC-LHR flights dominated by one carrier, but you knew that right? It will take more than nine days a month to burn me out but, again, thanks for the concern.

 

[General Lee]

I have no desire to ever fly a domestic flight again but thanks for the concern. The only reason BA was pressured to give up slots at LHR was because there were a disproportionate number of NYC-LHR flights dominated by one carrier, but you knew that right? It will take more than nine days a month to burn me out but, again, thanks for the concern.

Thanks PFO. Anyway, did BA have to give them up for some reason? Were they going for an alliance with AA at the time? Sure they were, and it didn't work at the time, meaning why did they give up the slots? Could it have been Openskies with the EU, and not just one route like you suggested? You are way off. It was the EU pressuring them, and the USA made sure more than just two airlines got rights to LHR. Good try! Here is a portion from the EU-USA Openskies Agreement guide Q&A section:


Do airlines take advantage the new commercial opportunities?
Yes. Already from the first day of the application of the Agreement numerous new flights between the EU and the US will take off to new destinations. It is reported that the total number of flights between the EU and the US in April-June 2008 will be 8% higher than in 2007.
Transatlantic services will increase particularly in those Member States where there had been restrictions so far. In London-Heathrow alone, flights to the US are increased by18 daily flights, an increase of more than 20%.The number of direct flights between Spain and the US will significantly increase.
Airlines make use of the opportunity to operate transatlantic flights from outside their home country. Air France operates now direct flights from London to Los Angeles. British Airways with its subsidiary Open Skies has announced operations from Paris to New York."





And, you really do need to mellow out and try EWR to PBI flights. Really, you appear stressed out!


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[EWR_FO]

Thanks PFO. Anyway, did BA have to give them up for some reason? Were they going for an alliance with AA at the time? Sure they were, and it didn't work at the time, meaning why did they give up the slots? Could it have been Openskies with the EU, and not just one route like you suggested? You are way off. It was the EU pressuring them, and the USA made sure more than just two airlines got rights to LHR. Good try! Here is a portion from the EU-USA Openskies Agreement guide Q&A section:


Do airlines take advantage the new commercial opportunities?
Yes. Already from the first day of the application of the Agreement numerous new flights between the EU and the US will take off to new destinations. It is reported that the total number of flights between the EU and the US in April-June 2008 will be 8% higher than in 2007.
Transatlantic services will increase particularly in those Member States where there had been restrictions so far. In London-Heathrow alone, flights to the US are increased by18 daily flights, an increase of more than 20%.The number of direct flights between Spain and the US will significantly increase.
Airlines make use of the opportunity to operate transatlantic flights from outside their home country. Air France operates now direct flights from London to Los Angeles. British Airways with its subsidiary Open Skies has announced operations from Paris to New York."





And, you really do need to mellow out and try EWR to PBI flights. Really, you appear stressed out!


Bye Bye--General Lee

Thanks for the lecture but you do realize that route authority and landing slots are two different things, right?

If you could carry on a discussion without your childish remarks, maybe most of the people on this board wouldn't think you are such an a**hole.

 

[Frank Lorenzo]

This thread is priceless.

 

[Dumb Pilot]

If you could carry on a discussion without your childish remarks, maybe most of the people on this board wouldn't think you are such an a**hole.

Forgive him, it is a byproduct of living in wonderland

 

[General Lee]

Thanks for the lecture but you do realize that route authority and landing slots are two different things, right?

If you could carry on a discussion without your childish remarks, maybe most of the people on this board wouldn't think you are such an a**hole.

Thanks dad for your critique..... Route Authority means nothing without slots. The British Govt had to give more Route Authority to other US airlines into LHR (other than just AA and UA), and BA had to give up some slots. That is wonderful. Same goes on in Tokyo, where we have the Route Authority (5th freedom rights), and we want the slots, since others will have an advantage due to alliances. It is simple, make it fair, and then compete. If you can't make it fair, then get Ray "the hood" Lahood to pressure someone to give some up----just like the EU did to BA to give up slots at LHR. Got it? And, most of the people on this board appreciate my humor. You really need to get out and laugh more, you are SO SERIOUS........Really, an MCI or OMA layover would do you good, maybe calm you down.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Forgive him, it is a byproduct of living in wonderland

If you call a certain legacy airline a wonderland, then yes, I am a byproduct of it. I enjoy my job and I enjoy this board for the humor and banter. Don't get wrapped up in hate, just go with the flow, Alice.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[EWR_FO]

Thanks dad for your critique..... Route Authority means nothing without slots. The British Govt had to give more Route Authority to other US airlines into LHR (other than just AA and UA), and BA had to give up some slots. That is wonderful. Same goes on in Tokyo, where we have the Route Authority (5th freedom rights), and we want the slots, since others will have an advantage due to alliances. It is simple, make it fair, and then compete. If you can't make it fair, then get Ray "the hood" Lahood to pressure someone to give some up----just like the EU did to BA to give up slots at LHR. Got it? And, most of the people on this board appreciate my humor. You really need to get out and laugh more, you are SO SERIOUS........Really, an MCI or OMA layover would do you good, maybe calm you down.


Bye Bye---General Lee

They didn't "give" anything up and if you think the situation in Tokyo is anything close to the one in London you are not even close. I doubt I am much older than you, I just don't act like a dick.

 

[General Lee]

They didn't "give" anything up and if you think the situation in Tokyo is anything close to the one in London you are not even close. I doubt I am much older than you, I just don't act like a dick.

Well, you sound like you are in your early 50s. Am I close? I am in my early to mid 40s, a 96 hire. Anyway, I think I see where you are going with this. DL and other airlines got slots from other airlines there at LHR, AF and KL gave DL and NWA slots. But, the treaties were broken, meaning more than 2 US airlines could go to LHR. HND has very limited service for everyone other than JAL and ANA, with Korean and a few others owning limited slots to other regional capitals in the area. HND also has time restrictions, like giving 4 slots at crazy times (after midnight or very early morning departures to any possible US cities---like 7am). I doubt KE airlines has flights to Inchon at those times, but maybe they could sell or give some to DL, their SkyTeam buddy, just like AF did at LHR? If not, then that is what is unfair, allowing ANA or JAL and their alliances to fly during normal afternoon hours, while giving other US airlines ridiculous times. That will need to be looked at for sure.

And, OMA and MCI are not to be feared. Sure, there are no ETOPS checks prior to your flights there, but it may relax you a bit. You need it.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Metro752]

US Airways is going to DOMINATE Haneda.

Believe it or don't!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_km9IFzzHo

 

[EWR_FO]

Well, you sound like you are in your early 50s. Am I close? I am in my early to mid 40s, a 96 hire. Anyway, I think I see where you are going with this. DL and other airlines got slots from other airlines there at LHR, AF and KL gave DL and NWA slots. But, the treaties were broken, meaning more than 2 US airlines could go to LHR. HND has very limited service for everyone other than JAL and ANA, with Korean and a few others owning limited slots to other regional capitals in the area. HND also has time restrictions, like giving 4 slots at crazy times (after midnight or very early morning departures to any possible US cities---like 7am). I doubt KE airlines has flights to Inchon at those times, but maybe they could sell or give some to DL, their SkyTeam buddy, just like AF did at LHR? If not, then that is what is unfair, allowing ANA or JAL and their alliances to fly during normal afternoon hours, while giving other US airlines ridiculous times. That will need to be looked at for sure.

And, OMA and MCI are not to be feared. Sure, there are no ETOPS checks prior to your flights there, but it may relax you a bit. You need it.


Bye Bye---General Lee

You're not close, I'm 45. There was one treaty, not multiple ones, and Tokyo is not covered by any treaties. They also do not belong to any kind of multi-country union so the situation is completely different than London. Since route authority and landing slots are two different things, one without the other doesn't do much good and that is exactly what happened in LHR.

The Japanese government has NEVER been a big fan of international pressure, Kodak spent millions trying to get them to make Fuji to stop dumping film for below cost and got nowhere.

 

[Dumb Pilot]

allowing ANA or JAL and their alliances to fly during normal afternoon hours, while giving other US airlines ridiculous times. That will need to be looked at for sure.

Still tumbling down the rabbit hole I see!

The Japanese meet all the requirements for international treaties with access to an international airport that service Tokyo's metropolitan area and that is Narita. Just like I pointed out when you where talking about how ALPA should protect your flying when you (as if it was you who invested jack) invested a billion, you where practically bidding for trips and at the end there wasn't even an agreement. I get to say "I told you so" now with the HND slots I will tell you that you won't get ANY slots, not during the day, not at midnight, NADA, ZIP. They don't have to look at anything since they are in compliance and you will have better luck with Hugo Chavez caring for your lobbyists

bye bye General Alice