One other factor that I forgot to point out is that the union hired two consultants. Thay BOTH said to accept this offer , but being the brilliant economists, historians, meteorologists, psychologist, and any and eveything you wanted to know about life our genius board of directors(PILOTS) said no, we dont like what you're giving us, so we will have a second motion to vote for a rejectance of the current proposal. We may have the best pilots in the industry, but for Gods sake please dont ever take financial advice from a pilot. Anyone, please reply to why you think that we as a pilot group should not accept this offer and please list your credentials(Masters in Finance,ie.) as well as the rest of the "IAP"sayers why anyone would reject this offer. Let me remind everyone the current contract is valid through 9/04. This is an extesion with a raise for two years, and if anyone can tell me what the economy will be in the next few years, you'll should be on Wallstreet.
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Current contract proposal SWA
- Thread starter falcon20
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tredding@swa
SWA F/O
- Joined
- Jul 1, 2002
- Posts
- 294
Falcon-
Be sure to cast your vote for the Koolie candidates in the upcoming union election...that is if you've been around long enough to be eligible to vote. That is the most you can do to ensure that the most profitable airline in the world will continue to pay less than ATA while providing laughably substandard retirement benefits, work rules, reserve system, etc. etc. to its "loyal employees". Of course, all of that could be fixed via a section 6 negotiation starting in 12 mos. Or did you fall for the "Super Mediation" sham? The language contained in the ICO is legally worthless. You did a fine job of supporting your own hypothesis. Some pilots don't know sh1t and should just shut the f**k up. There is no need for the man to keep us down. We keep doing it to ourselves.
Be sure to cast your vote for the Koolie candidates in the upcoming union election...that is if you've been around long enough to be eligible to vote. That is the most you can do to ensure that the most profitable airline in the world will continue to pay less than ATA while providing laughably substandard retirement benefits, work rules, reserve system, etc. etc. to its "loyal employees". Of course, all of that could be fixed via a section 6 negotiation starting in 12 mos. Or did you fall for the "Super Mediation" sham? The language contained in the ICO is legally worthless. You did a fine job of supporting your own hypothesis. Some pilots don't know sh1t and should just shut the f**k up. There is no need for the man to keep us down. We keep doing it to ourselves.
Now What...
So if indeed the SWAPA vote was in favor what does that mean ??? Will the much anticipated explosive growth of 02/03 start soon ??? Can we expect the glory days of 2 classes per month for the next 12-15 months ??? Those in the know please responds via your somewhat muddied crystal balls, so to speak...
Any and all rumors gladly accepted...
"Krunch"
So if indeed the SWAPA vote was in favor what does that mean ??? Will the much anticipated explosive growth of 02/03 start soon ??? Can we expect the glory days of 2 classes per month for the next 12-15 months ??? Those in the know please responds via your somewhat muddied crystal balls, so to speak...
Any and all rumors gladly accepted...
"Krunch"
luv2fly
SWA FO
- Joined
- Feb 12, 2002
- Posts
- 204
Great Attitude
XNAV,
Great Attitude!! I can't wait to fly with you for a month. The good news is that I will because the majority of pilots, at the best airline in the world, realized and spoke on what was best for the Airline and for them. Growth and expansion will continue. Not to say that it wouldn't without acceptance of the proposal, but IMO there are too many pilots with your attitude that are willing to drive a stake into the heart of the Golden Goose by expecting and demanding things with a completely self-serving view. SWA didn't get to where it is by its great pilots making emotional decisions with only themselves in mind. Don't get me wrong either, I want the highest pay and best work rules available as well, but I believe in the long term growth, expansion and overall company strength even more.
Fly safe!
XNAV,
Great Attitude!! I can't wait to fly with you for a month. The good news is that I will because the majority of pilots, at the best airline in the world, realized and spoke on what was best for the Airline and for them. Growth and expansion will continue. Not to say that it wouldn't without acceptance of the proposal, but IMO there are too many pilots with your attitude that are willing to drive a stake into the heart of the Golden Goose by expecting and demanding things with a completely self-serving view. SWA didn't get to where it is by its great pilots making emotional decisions with only themselves in mind. Don't get me wrong either, I want the highest pay and best work rules available as well, but I believe in the long term growth, expansion and overall company strength even more.
Fly safe!
luv2fly,
By voting yes for this offer the pilots at SWA proved they are nothing more than a spineless group of DOORMATS! Shut up with the Golden Goose crap, SWA wanted you and everyone else as cheap as they could get you, and over and over again you give it to them. If anyone has a self serving view it's SWA management, do you actually think they luv you, and care about your well being?(If they really felt that, they would want you to have better pay and benefits).
Remember:Herb only likes you when you are working for him!
By voting yes for this offer the pilots at SWA proved they are nothing more than a spineless group of DOORMATS! Shut up with the Golden Goose crap, SWA wanted you and everyone else as cheap as they could get you, and over and over again you give it to them. If anyone has a self serving view it's SWA management, do you actually think they luv you, and care about your well being?(If they really felt that, they would want you to have better pay and benefits).
Remember:Herb only likes you when you are working for him!
luv2bone-
It may take awhile for the Kool-Aid to wear off (maybe longer for you) but it will and you'll realize your wife and kids may love you but the company most certainly does not. ATA has 59 jets and has never made much money. SWA is the most profitable airline in the world. ATA 73 pilots make more than we do. Does that seem fair to you? If asking for industry AVERAGE compensation is self-serving and attempting to kill the goose, then I admit it, I am a greedy goose-killing SOB.
It may take awhile for the Kool-Aid to wear off (maybe longer for you) but it will and you'll realize your wife and kids may love you but the company most certainly does not. ATA has 59 jets and has never made much money. SWA is the most profitable airline in the world. ATA 73 pilots make more than we do. Does that seem fair to you? If asking for industry AVERAGE compensation is self-serving and attempting to kill the goose, then I admit it, I am a greedy goose-killing SOB.
xnav, jetspeed
I am a little confused? Jetspeed, are you currently with an airline right now? It is obvious that you have SWA envy. I bet you are probably furloughed by one of your money hungry unions right now. It especially does not surprise me that you are a fighter jock. You guys never have been able to see the big picture. Like I said in a previous reply. You take the money now and then renegotiate in 2 years (when and IF) the economy is better. Why on earth would you just settle for the current contract for 2 more years???? Only a smart person would except that. Guess that leave you out!
XNAV, it does appear that you are with SWA--so what gives?
All the other airlines are falling apart and you complain about a new contract? Guess you are not a finance major
When the other airlines folds up shop...please don't call SWA jetspeed!
I am a little confused? Jetspeed, are you currently with an airline right now? It is obvious that you have SWA envy. I bet you are probably furloughed by one of your money hungry unions right now. It especially does not surprise me that you are a fighter jock. You guys never have been able to see the big picture. Like I said in a previous reply. You take the money now and then renegotiate in 2 years (when and IF) the economy is better. Why on earth would you just settle for the current contract for 2 more years???? Only a smart person would except that. Guess that leave you out!
XNAV, it does appear that you are with SWA--so what gives?
All the other airlines are falling apart and you complain about a new contract? Guess you are not a finance major
When the other airlines folds up shop...please don't call SWA jetspeed!
NYRANGERS
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jun 13, 2002
- Posts
- 592
Re: xnav, jetspeed
[Soupbone said
. You take the money now and then renegotiate in 2 years (when and IF) the economy is better. Why on earth would you just settle for the current contract for 2 more years???? Only a smart person would except that. Guess that leave you out!
XNAV, it does appear that you are with SWA--so what gives?
All the other airlines are falling apart and you complain about a new contract? Guess you are not a finance major
When the other airlines folds up shop...please don't call SWA jetspeed! [/B][/QUOTE]
2 years? I think you just extended your contract for 2 years. Meaning expires in 2006 insted of 2004.
[Soupbone said
. You take the money now and then renegotiate in 2 years (when and IF) the economy is better. Why on earth would you just settle for the current contract for 2 more years???? Only a smart person would except that. Guess that leave you out!
XNAV, it does appear that you are with SWA--so what gives?
All the other airlines are falling apart and you complain about a new contract? Guess you are not a finance major
When the other airlines folds up shop...please don't call SWA jetspeed! [/B][/QUOTE]
2 years? I think you just extended your contract for 2 years. Meaning expires in 2006 insted of 2004.
fighter pilots
Please forgive my remark. I meant nothing personal towards fighter pilots in general. I personally know many of them and they are exceptional people.
It is just this menatallity that I have been seeing on this web sight over the past couple of weeks>> Pilots mad at SWA pilots, pilots of all airlines yelling back and forth. Amazing. We all do the very thing we love yet with totally different perspectives. Like I have read in the AA threads>>please don't ask pilots for financial advice. Yes NYRANGERS, it is a 2 year extension, but you renegotiate just like SWA pilots are doing now...2 years early. Therefore, if the trouble is all behind us and the economy does some miracle turnaround...the pilot union seeks a new contract in 2 years! So in other words...take the money and run and in 2 years you are already working from a higher advantage point!
Please forgive my remark. I meant nothing personal towards fighter pilots in general. I personally know many of them and they are exceptional people.
It is just this menatallity that I have been seeing on this web sight over the past couple of weeks>> Pilots mad at SWA pilots, pilots of all airlines yelling back and forth. Amazing. We all do the very thing we love yet with totally different perspectives. Like I have read in the AA threads>>please don't ask pilots for financial advice. Yes NYRANGERS, it is a 2 year extension, but you renegotiate just like SWA pilots are doing now...2 years early. Therefore, if the trouble is all behind us and the economy does some miracle turnaround...the pilot union seeks a new contract in 2 years! So in other words...take the money and run and in 2 years you are already working from a higher advantage point!
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