CRJ vs ERJ Type

[dojetdriver]

They can bitch all they want. It won't really matter in a year tho when they lose 69 of them and 600 guys are out on the street.

True, IF the planes leave, it won't matter. There will be more to bitch about than who thinks which plane is better.

Some people have made valid comments about the merits and downsides to both aircraft. Others, well, your award for resembling a bag of Summer's Eve finest is waiting for you.

If that happens, for some us it will be our SECOND furlough. Making a comment like you just made is one of the most a$$inine things anybody can say. Have you been furloughed/out on the street in your career yet? I don't wish it on anybody.

Fly safe.

 

[TNPILOT]

They can bitch all they want. It won't really matter in a year tho when they lose 69 of them and 600 guys are out on the street.

We'll see. It's not quite that simple. Are you somehow rooting for us to lose the flying? But I agree, who gives a #&% about the airplane they both pay next to nothing.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

There is absolutely no way the CRJ can compare to the 145XR for range and payload! Some examples:

EWR-OKC: FULL AND WITH 130 KNOT HEAD WIND.

YYT-EWR: THAT'S ST.JOHN'S NEWFOUNDLAND TO NEWARK. AGAIN A 130 KNOT HEADWIND AND BAD WEATHER IN EWR AND STILL ENOUGH FUEL TO LAND AT ALTERNATE WITH 4000 LBS.

YYZ-IAH: TORONTO TO HOUSTON.

That's just some that I have done. Some that I have not done but I heard are quite long,

HOUSTON TO BOISE,
HOUSTON TO FLORES, GUATAMALA
HOUSTON TO PALM SPRINGS
CLEVELAND TO DENVER
CLEVELAND TO AUSTIN
NASSAU TO HOUSTON
NEWARK TO HOBBY

Who wants to be on an RJ that long? We do DTW to AUS but I'm not bragging about it. Routes like that need to be done by nothing smaller than an airbus... I've heard these new 170's are pretty comfortable, though.

 

[007]

Why does this stuff always turn into a pissing contest??????

I have never flown the Crj, but a lot of my friends have .

The way I see it they are both just that, converted aircraft. Challenger to Crj and Brasilia to EMB145. That's the main reason it's so loud up front. Our side windows are actually interchangeable with the Brasilia, and the nosecone is also the same.

The Emb is a flying computer which had alot of bugs at first and the ER models were extremely underpowered. Even the LR's are not that great. But the XR performs more like the -700. But then you can say, who wants to sit in an RJ that long. I get antsy after 2 hrs and IAH to BOI is entirely to long.

Internally they are totally different, two different ways of thinking and I don't think you can compare them very well. I don't know that the CRJ had too many bugs when it came out.

Personally I still prefer the XR. but only in the absence of Boeing and Airbus.

 

[wmuflyguy]

whats the range/payload of a 170?

 

[LJDRVR]

Wow,

A little bit of airframe rivalry is to be expected, but to see this "my jet is better than your jet" stuff degenerate into a childish pissing match where respondants are gloating over their peers misfortune is simply unbelievable.

Neither of them is a real jet.

 

[Cloudroller]

I dont think this is a pissing contest. its just a couple of guys compairing airplanes. I have had fun in both airplanes

 

[Diesel]

The ERJ engines are the same Rolls Royce engines we use on the X.

When is the last time a CRJ engine make it up 510 without locking out.

The fadecs are funny but the engine is built like a brick house.

 

[ewrjet]

Neither of them is a real jet.

This is exactly what Alpa and pilots at the majors said when these planes first came on the scene. Just think how different the landscape might look today, if instead of this line of thinking, they had embraced the aircraft and told management, "a jet is a jet and these planes need to be flown by our pilots".

 

[LegacyDriver]

I compared notes with a buddy who flies CRJs. We went through the limitations and the dos and don'ts of both planes. The ERJ came out on top on just bout every item.


When do you need an APU above FL300? How about when both engines flame out and you need an airstart? Never heard of an EMB Doing that but it is nice to know you have it.

Gen failures? APU.

Pneumatics? APU.


The "P" engines were good. The "E" is fantastic.


All I know is I can hold at 200 knots at FL390 and I don't even see the top of the white arc yet. I know the CRJ doesn't have that luxury.


Someone mentioned telling the FADEC what to do for takeoff. That is because we have three thrust modes and the "computer" as you called it doesn't know which one to use any more than what flap setting to use. It is pilot selectable for a reason.

 

[WMUSIGPI]

The Avro does and always will beat the snot out of both of them in the comfort category. Unfortunately they are getting uncomfortably warm in Arizona. Passengers were always complementing how much nicer the Avro was compared to the CRJ they just had to connect from.

 

[LegacyDriver]

Also I should clarify.... The Legacy was tested to M 0.92 without Mach Tuck (it got tail flutter as you might expect on an unboosted elevator). The difference between stall and M 0.92 is well more than 130 knots at FL410. I am guessing stall and MMO/VMO (M 0.80) at 410 is 100 knots or so.

Just a guess but more than the CRJ.

I will look it up later.


The XR goes to 390 doesn't it?

 

[aewanabe]

First of all, I can vouch for LD knowing something about the LRs, even if he is a Legacy Driver now.

Before the last round of weight changes, I'd say the ERJ is a better Airliner hands down, vs. the 200. I've ridden up front several times on the 200 and 700 and have friends who fly both. The LR version of the 145 has great engines, good automation, and is a definite example of airliner for dummys. For those who say it's slow, well .78 isn't barn-burning but I rarely hear the big boys flying that fast as they're all trying to save fuel anyway. The 145 has a much less critical wing which gives us a lot more latitude in our climb speeds and rates vs. a CRJ-200, even hot and heavy.

HOWEVER.... with the latest round of weight changes even the LR version is barely a 50-seat airplane with bags. ZFW is an issue almost every leg during the winter, and I really gotta sweat if I'm trying to get a jumpseater on. According to the station personnel the 200s can take a good 3-400 pounds more bags with a full boat. SO, my workload is less once the door is closed but I find myself leaving people or bags behind a lot more than I used to; isn't that the mission of the airplane in the first place?

Bottom line they all have compromises and they all pay ********************!

 

[wmuflyguy]

Also I should clarify.... The Legacy was tested to M 0.92 without Mach Tuck (it got tail flutter as you might expect on an unboosted elevator). The difference between stall and M 0.92 is well more than 130 knots at FL410. I am guessing stall and MMO/VMO (M 0.80) at 410 is 100 knots or so.

Just a guess but more than the CRJ.

I will look it up later.


The XR goes to 390 doesn't it?

Man never seen some one get such a woody over an airplane.

 

[dojetdriver]

I compared notes with a buddy who flies CRJs. We went through the limitations and the dos and don'ts of both planes. The ERJ came out on top on just bout every item.


When do you need an APU above FL300? How about when both engines flame out and you need an airstart? Never heard of an EMB Doing that but it is nice to know you have it.

Gen failures? APU.

Pneumatics? APU.


The "P" engines were good. The "E" is fantastic.


All I know is I can hold at 200 knots at FL390 and I don't even see the top of the white arc yet. I know the CRJ doesn't have that luxury.


Someone mentioned telling the FADEC what to do for takeoff. That is because we have three thrust modes and the "computer" as you called it doesn't know which one to use any more than what flap setting to use. It is pilot selectable for a reason.

Um, I guess you didn't really read what I wrote previously. Is it just ExpressJet, or is the ERJ limited to Fl370? The Embraer website EVEN says it's 370. What are you doing at 390? Do you even fly the ERJ?

The FADEC "doesn't know which one to use", well, that's because the FADEC they went with is a little stupid. The J328 had FADEC's, didn't need to tell them anything. Didn't need to press buttons and tell it what to do on the ground, after take off, or a go around either. That plane wasn't even meant to compete with the ERJ/CRJ and it was more sophsticated than both of them. Just put the thrust lever in the detent or anywhere in between to get the desired effect.

If, and that's a big if, the LR model could get to 410 what would it indicate? Where do you think the white arc would be, if the plane could get that high?

 

[pianoman]

Um, I guess you didn't really read what I wrote previously. Is it just ExpressJet, or is the ERJ limited to Fl370? The Embraer website EVEN says it's 370. What are you doing at 390? Do you even fly the ERJ?

I think he flies the Legacy Bizjet version, which can go to 410.

The FADEC "doesn't know which one to use", well, that's because the FADEC they went with is a little stupid. The J328 had FADEC's, didn't need to tell them anything. Didn't need to press buttons and tell it what to do on the ground, after take off, or a go around either. That plane wasn't even meant to compete with the ERJ/CRJ and it was more sophsticated than both of them. Just put the thrust lever in the detent or anywhere in between to get the desired effect.

Well I suppose it's because our engines are powerful enough that a reduced thrust takeoff saving engine life is possible much of the time. Whether you would tell it you want reduced in the FMS like a Boeing or in the T/O MFD page like ours doesn't seem to make much difference.

 

[dojetdriver]

I think he flies the Legacy Bizjet version, which can go to 410.

Well, if that's the case, why is comparing the ERJ to the CRJ if he's in the Legacy? Compare the Global Express to the Legacy, see what you get. Comparing the Legacy to the CRJ is apples to oranges.

Well I suppose it's because our engines are powerful enough that a reduced thrust takeoff saving engine life is possible much of the time. Whether you would tell it you want reduced in the FMS like a Boeing or in the T/O MFD page like ours doesn't seem to make much difference.

Well, ok, ya got me there. Like I said before, when is the last time you saw a 737/777/Airbus pilot have to push a buttom on the console telling the FADEC "OK, you are done with the take off, you can got to climb thrust now." I'm not getting into a pi$$ing contest with you, the ERJ just isn't the Buck Rogers super sophisticated machine that guys think it is. Especially if it's the only RJ they have flown.

 

[Cloudroller]

Hey Legacy – how do you think the Legacy compares to the Global? I thought the MMO restriction was because of the windshield. I am typed in both and I don’t recall ever seeing a 145LR even coming close to .80. But I have done .84 in the CRJ 900 with the thrust pulled back.

I prefer the ERJ 145LR over the CRJ 200. But I would take the 700 & 900 over the 145. Yeah I know the EMB 170 & 190. I don’t know anything about them, but I am sure their nice.

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

If for some reason I want to get in touch with LegacyDriver, I'll just look for the ******************************bag that's humping his airplane's landing gear out on the FBO ramp.


MINE GOES TO FL410, HOW ABOUT YOURS???? who cares...

 

[LegacyDriver]

I have flown all of them but the XR. The "P" LRs would go right through the redline with ease.

W
The only limitations on the Legacy that differ from the 135 are MMO, ceiling, and weight. I compared airliner to airliner.

The XR I believe has the same MMO but I may be wrong.

At any rate, the EMB had better numbers in virtually every area we compared. The CRJ is also artificially restricted now by some companies so its ceiling and speed advantages are negated.

 

[LegacyDriver]

Same wing on the XR as the Legacy thus I presume the 410 margun would be around 100 knots.

We don't push buttons for go around either. There is a detent.


The reduced thrust mode is not something the FADEC/FMS can really know to use without temp, rwy length, wind, obstacles, and weight.

I am sure the FMS can be programmed to know this stuff but it only takes five seconds to look it up and five seconds to set it. And doing the latter is cheaper.

 

[LegacyDriver]

Global beats us in every category except cost per mile.

But we don't consider our airplane in that league. That thing has ridiculous range.

I am told ther gear extension speed is 200 knots vs 250 for us though.

 

[dojetdriver]

I have flown all of them but the XR. The "P" LRs would go right through the redline with ease.

W
The only limitations on the Legacy that differ from the 135 are MMO, ceiling, and weight. I compared airliner to airliner.

The XR I believe has the same MMO but I may be wrong.

At any rate, the EMB had better numbers in virtually every area we compared. The CRJ is also artificially restricted now by some companies so its ceiling and speed advantages are negated.

Judging from ALL of you posts, you sound like you have NEVER flown the ERJ. You sound like a 12 year old kid getting all his information off of some website and posting your "research" as experience. The ERJ going to FL390, what the hell was that all about? Comparing the Legacy to a CRJ, WTF. Sorry, but comaring the Legacy to the small Global, or the even the newest Challenger is more of a comparison.

 

[LegacyDriver]

Does your CRJ have a forward crew closet or do you have to walk all the way to the back and shove the bags in?

At least when we "410 it dude" we can do it for hours at time at fairly hefty weights with very wide speed margins unlike the CRJ. The XR has the same wing and engines and would perform very similarly there.

I don't know all the XR's numbers but I assumed it was a FL 390 airplane. If not, oh well. As stated some CRJ operators are restricting themselves to 370 like the 145LR.

 

[dojetdriver]

Does your CRJ have a forward crew closet or do you have to walk all the way to the back and shove the bags in?

At least when we "410 it dude" we can do it for hours at time at fairly hefty weights with very wide speed margins unlike the CRJ. The XR has the same wing and engines and would perform very similarly there.

I don't know all the XR's numbers but I assumed it was a FL 390 airplane. If not, oh well. As stated some CRJ operators are restricting themselves to 370 like the 145LR.

Don't know, never flew it. I never claimed to be an expert and I don't spout off facts about a plane I've never flown. You claim to have flow the ERJ but your posts don't recflect so. None of the ERJ's can "410 it dude".Just like your Legacy can "410 it dude", so can the Challenger and the Global.

 

[MECH]

The XR is limited to FL370 and M.80. The MATOW was increased to 53131lbs.. MLW was increased to 44092LBS. The fuel load was a lso increased to a little over 13000 lbs.

The thrust on the A1E engines was also increased to a little over 9000 lbs(I forget the actual number).

At max weights you have to be carefully climbing above FL350, because of the increased buffet margins.

It is what all EMB -145 should have been like. It is very stable aircraft, very easy to get a good landing.

 

[sweptback]

Does your CRJ have a forward crew closet or do you have to walk all the way to the back and shove the bags in?

We have a forward closet. It's not as big as yours though. It'll fit two bags, plus maybe a laptop or two, but you have to put them in carefully.

At least when we "410 it dude" we can do it for hours at time at fairly hefty weights with very wide speed margins unlike the CRJ. The XR has the same wing and engines and would perform very similarly there.

I don't know all the XR's numbers but I assumed it was a FL 390 airplane. If not, oh well. As stated some CRJ operators are restricting themselves to 370 like the 145LR.

Why would FL410 matter on a stage length of 300-400nm? I bet probably 70% of our flights are this range or less.

I don't see what the hard-on is about going to your max altitude either. You don't see the Boeings going over the North Atlantic heading up that high initially. Does that make them a bad airplane? Maybe in your world.

 

[LegacyDriver]

Does your CRJ have a forward crew closet or do you have to walk all the way to the back and shove the bags in?

At least when we "410 it dude" we can do it for hours at time at fairly hefty weights with very wide speed margins unlike the CRJ. The XR has the same wing and engines and would perform very similarly there.

I don't know all the XR's numbers but I assumed it was a FL 390 airplane. If not, oh well. As stated some CRJ operators are restricting themselves to 370 like the 145LR.

 

[dojetdriver]

Does your CRJ have a forward crew closet or do you have to walk all the way to the back and shove the bags in?

At least when we "410 it dude" we can do it for hours at time at fairly hefty weights with very wide speed margins unlike the CRJ. The XR has the same wing and engines and would perform very similarly there.

I don't know all the XR's numbers but I assumed it was a FL 390 airplane. If not, oh well. As stated some CRJ operators are restricting themselves to 370 like the 145LR.

Um, dude, put the beer down. This bit of drivel already flowed out of your mouth. Word for word to be exact. See post #52 if you don't believe me.

 

[LegacyDriver]

Sorry double post. Not sure why that keeps hapening.


We can take the Legacy at 49604 direct to 390 no problem. I am surprised the XR would have any issues in that regard.


As previously stated, I compared apples to apples with the CRJ and the ERJ LR.


The ERJ was much more flexible with wider margins (assuming what I was told was accurate).


I spent many hours in CRJ jumpseats in my airline days. I was not particularly impressed one way ot the other, but the CRJ upset brought a lot of things to light that make me like the ERJ far more.


It's not a hardon just observation. The ERJ is more advanced in many areas. They both do the same job for very nearly identical costs. It is probably a wash operationally but from a pilot's standpoint the ERJ is less workload for my money.