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Could this help a SLI? NW/DL

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LandGreen

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 24, 2005
Posts
195
i know this will prompt many debates...

during a few brainstorming sessions, i have heard the idea of bringing a UPS style pay structure (CA pay fleetwide; FO pay fleetwide) to a merged carrier in an effort to "mitigate" some of the sharp edges of a SLI that all of us debate each day. just imagine the calculus of integrating a single list without the variables of specific seat pay for each separate category.

as our career expectations are changing each day with mergers, oil prices, no FAE retirement plans, furloughs, liquidations, inflation, etc, maybe the day will come when some pilots will not have to "bid" for the buck, but bid for "lifestyle." many pilots already do this, but imagine an airline 3-4 years down the road after this type of pay structure has been implemented. there would be far less training events once everyone settled into the "type" of flying they wanted. yes, the companies would love it since they would not have to staff the airline with as many pilots...BUT, I am sure there are PWA negotiators who could come up with a $$ amount that the company would save...and include a healthy percentage into our PWA. SWA realizes this huge savings "virtually" by having only a 1 fleet pay structure. not many of them complaining these days!

the 747/777 pilots will definitely not like this type of arrangement since they will not seem to benefit once pay rates come up to their levels fleetwide; but since they are senior, they will have the most flexibility to bid off the aircraft and maximize their "lifestyle" bid. most senior CA's at British Airways fly narrowbody turns instead of the heavies across the pond.

anyway, many pros and cons to think about...but it may be an alternative that would help soften the blow of a forced, or arbitrated SLI between two companies. especially in our current airline industry environment where mergers are almost certain to happen with our without pilot blessings.
 
Remember that in this industry seniority isn't just one thing in the mix, it is EVERYTHING!

Mgmt can come in and change pay/work rules/etc. in one fell swoop ala BK or other shyster-like means. Yes, pay may be low at NWA as of today, but can be negotiated later.

At the end of the day the only certain thing in this industry is where your name is on the seniority list.

I belive that someone on our MEC was quoted as saying that "Seniority is not for sale here" I truely hope they are serious about that one. I'm all about looking long term and not selling out my future earning potential (directly correlated to seniority) for a few thousand extra bucks on next years W-2.

I may be in the minority but thats how I feel...
 
short term financial gain isnt worth a career loss in seniority. I firmly believe that there will be a meet in the middle stance once its all said and done but thats just my 2cents.
 
I think bases are more of a concern than pay, at least they are for my family. A slot on a NWA, or DAL, jet is not worth moving, or commuting, for.

What makes this difficult is management's apparent plan to shift a lot of flying and equipment.

Positive space commuting in the next contract would help, but management does not want to have to deal with the duty time issues that result.
 
I think bases are more of a concern than pay, at least they are for my family. A slot on a NWA, or DAL, jet is not worth moving, or commuting, for.

What makes this difficult is management's apparent plan to shift a lot of flying and equipment.

Positive space commuting in the next contract would help, but management does not want to have to deal with the duty time issues that result.


The biggest item is NOT selling out SCOPE!! If you guys let that go again you are doing nothing but farming out our dc9s and your md80s. WAKE UP DALALPA. NO MORE SCOPE RELIEF!!!!!!! You would think they would have learned the first time around after the first couple hundred regional jets showed up.
 
Someone showed me how this could be done and not give away the farm on scope. The scary part is, I think they are right.

DAL reduces DC9 flying triggering the min fleet provisions in NWA scope forcing RJ's to be parked. But instead of parking them, they just get transferred to Comair, helping Delta sell Comair for half a billion bucks.

Not that NWA did not already have that idea. Most thought Compass would be spun off.
 
No, it wasn't him. It was on the other side.

It rang true to me because it fits with the other known facts and NWA's scope would not be violated.

I think DALPA knows the NWA PWA better than they do.
 
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Ahh.
I see. I still think that the resistance to this would come from management with the movement of aircraft. it would have to define flying as routes and not airframes, and that my friend is an ugly world for you and I to live in. It takes a lot of the efficiencies away.
 
The biggest item is NOT selling out SCOPE!! If you guys let that go again you are doing nothing but farming out our dc9s and your md80s. WAKE UP DALALPA. NO MORE SCOPE RELIEF!!!!!!! You would think they would have learned the first time around after the first couple hundred regional jets showed up.


I have been saying this for years! Unfortunately, 61% of those on our list do not listen or seem to care about scope.
 

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