Comair pilots also didn't know their flight number or what city they were in

[TheGuat]

http://www.wave3.com/global/story.asp?s=5382483&ClientType=Printable

Families: NTSB Said Pilot Called Out Wrong City To Control Tower

var wn_last_ed_date = getLEDate("Sept8,2006,11:38 AM EST"); document.write(wn_last_ed_date);
(LEXINGTON, Ky.) -- A published report says two people related to passengers who died aboard Comair Flight 5191 said investigators told them one of the pilots called out the wrong flight number and city before the plane crashed.
The Lexington Herald-Leader reports that National Transportation Safety Board officials told families that in talking to the control tower when the pilots were about to take off, one of the pilots gave the wrong flight number and said "Toledo."
The commuter jet was bound for Atlanta when it crashed August 27th as it tried to take off from the wrong runway at Lexington's Blue Grass Airport. The pilots also initially boarded the wrong plane.
Kyra Frederick's husband, Bart Frederick of Danville, was one of the passengers who died. She says there were a series of mistakes that were the beginning of a bad flight.
The crash killed 49 of the 50 people aboard.
Frederick and Charlie Scales attended NTSB briefings last week in Lexington and said they learned of the apparent "Toledo" mistake then. Scales' brother-in-law, Gregory Threet of Lexington, also died aboard Flight 5191.
(Copyright 2006 by The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.)

 

[Amish RakeFight]

Let me get this straight, so far we have:

Wrong plane.
Wrong flight number.
Wrong city.
Wrong runway.

 

[AirBadger]

It all makes sense now. The last piece of the puzzle has been found.

 

[Amish RakeFight]

As these mistakes can and do occur regularly without incident, this will surely help point fingers at that crew.

 

[30West]

Must be a slow news day in KY!

 

[blzr]

My neighbor, a preacher, asked if it was common practice to let an inexperienced crew member actually fly the plane... referencing the co-pilot flying.

People are totally ignorant about our industry, yet the will get onboard ANY airplane with two warm bodies up front.

 

[XJohXJ]

Let's see: wrong flight number and wrong city. That probably only happens about every other flight or so! Talk about irrelevant.

 

[FlyBunny]

Interesting...

Hhhhmm....so the pilots didn't know where they were. I guess we didn't know where we were either when last year I called 'Chicago Center' on the initial call out to which was supposed to be 'South Bend Approach'. They replied: " - - - - 1234, South Bend Approach, South Bend altimeter, 2996."

Oooopppsss...the loss of Situational Awareness was astonishing. We should have been grounded upon landing and sent for retraining.

Unbelievable…it’s already becoming clear that the pilots made the ‘gravest’ mistake of them all and took off on wrong runway, but this sort of discussion should have no place/bearing. I can’t even count the number of times I hear long-winded, and sometimes, incorrect ‘read-backs’, even from major airlines crews – and I have been the culprit myself more than once - does that mean they all should now be grounded.

For instance, it’s being reported that the pilot went to the wrong airplane first…well, how many time is has happened to folks on this board that you show up a the gate and your plane is parked at a different gate? What’s interesting is that no one mentions how come those pilots figured out the ‘right’ plane. Isn’t that the procedure where you check to make sure the N number matches the paper work?

I once called Cedar Rapids Ground Chicago Ground as our flight had originated from ORD…wow…was I lost or what.

Bunny

 

[FlyBunny]

My neighbor, a preacher, asked if it was common practice to let an inexperienced crew member actually fly the plane... referencing the co-pilot flying.

People are totally ignorant about our industry, yet the will get onboard ANY airplane with two warm bodies up front.

Right on!

I am also getting lots of questions from neighbors/friends/relatives, etc., about this. But again, look at the media...they always refer that '....pilot did this, pilot did that' and always talk in a 'singular' tense and never mention that all airline flying in the US requires two pilots and most plane can't be flown with one pilot and that two pilots are equally contributing to flight duties and both are just as well qualified to land and take off and perform other duties.

Happened to my colleague at ORD, once guy came in to cockpit to visit after flight and commended the captain on making a smooth landing. Upon being told that the F/O made the landing, he said: "...do you let him do that?"

I rest my case.

Bunny

 

[zawillif]

My neighbor, a preacher, asked if it was common practice to let an inexperienced crew member actually fly the plane... referencing the co-pilot flying.

People are totally ignorant about our industry, yet the will get onboard ANY airplane with two warm bodies up front.

It's so true. I recently had 2 different people ask me if the captain ever "lets me fly the plane". I just have to shake my head and say, "only every other leg."

 

[Magic1872]

I flew to KLEX yesterday and you should hear everything that is out of service. Almost every light on the taxiway and runway ways are out of service. I can see now how someone could mistakenly depart on the wrong runway. But then again its a simple check to see what your mag compass says. If it says 260 ish...and your taking 22.....something is wrong.

 

[goahead]

Some people need to get a life.....

 

[CrownandCoke]

It's so true. I recently had 2 different people ask me if the captain ever "lets me fly the plane". I just have to shake my head and say, "only every other leg."

I get that all the time, people go "so, do you just handle the radios and navigation equipment?" I want to then sound like Helen Keller, but I figure that might turn a few heads.

 

[jetexas]

If for some crazy reason (fatigue, whatever), they 'did' momentarily think they were in Toledo it could slightly explain a few things. The shorter runway in Toledo is around 5600 ft or so..still short but likely doable. Who knows.

 

[flyboyike]

There was this one time I wasn't sure what my name was, but that's another story....

 

[172driver]

This is why I call everybody by their generic name -- clearance, ground, tower, center, etc.

 

[check6]

I got up in my hotel room the other day and forgot where I was. I was in the shower when I realized that it didn't matter, and I would just get in the hotel van and figure it out later in the morning.

 

[B190Captain]

I got up in my hotel room the other day and forgot where I was. I was in the shower when I realized that it didn't matter, and I would just get in the hotel van and figure it out later in the morning.

Been there done that!

 

[suupah]

a friend once asked me "you can land all by yourself?" I responded.."Don't talk about my pee pee like that"

 

[BFE]

The NTSB has issued a statement shooting down this "wrong city" rumor.
You guys really need to quit reacting to the first media report you see. The media loves to be the first to report, and some of the FI no lifers have to be the first to post a thread.

 

[Global33]

Re: Toledo

It may be interesting to note that TOL has a runway 25 which is 10,600' long. On a sleepy morning, perhaps being used to flying out of TOL a lot, seeing a 250 heading for takeoff might have seemed like a normal thing to the crew.

 

[SLUF4]

http://www.kentucky.com/mld/kentucky/15477403.htm
they've retracted that story now...just another example of the media spreading misinformation.

 

[mac36]

So?

Stupid Headline anyway. I doubt that they didn't know what city they were in.

I once inadvertently called my wife by my ex wife's name (she was being annoying so it was a conditioned response).

I knew where I was.

I knew who she was.

Still used the wrong name.

It didn't make the paper though.

 

[skyslug]

If for some crazy reason (fatigue, whatever), they 'did' momentarily think they were in Toledo it could slightly explain a few things. The shorter runway in Toledo is around 5600 ft or so..still short but likely doable. Who knows.

I think I need to correct you on this statement. They didn't "think" they were in Toledo, they simply mispoke (if indeed this is a true story). Just because one says something doesn't mean they actually "think" or believe it to be true (politicians????).

 

[makersmarc]

[
I once inadvertently called my wife by my ex wife's name (she was being annoying so it was a conditioned response).

I knew where I was.

I knew who she was.

Still used the wrong name.

It didn't make the paper though.[/quote]


...and that's a good thing!

 

[Flying-Corporal]

I got up in my hotel room the other day and forgot where I was. I was in the shower when I realized that it didn't matter, and I would just get in the hotel van and figure it out later in the morning.

That's funny!!! So true.

 

[172driver]

I once inadvertently called my wife by my ex wife's name (she was being annoying so it was a conditioned response).

I knew where I was.

I knew who she was.

Still used the wrong name.

It didn't make the paper though.

That sounds waaay more dangerous than not knowing what city you're in.

 

[acaTerry]

My neighbor, a preacher, asked if it was common practice to let an inexperienced crew member actually fly the plane... referencing the co-pilot flying.

People are totally ignorant about our industry, yet the will get onboard ANY airplane with two warm bodies up front.

I just have to ask...What does him being a preacher have to do with anything?

 

[fried chickens]

I got up in my hotel room the other day and forgot where I was. I was in the shower when I realized that it didn't matter, and I would just get in the hotel van and figure it out later in the morning.

Good thing they have phone books in the rooms

 

[AZ Typed]

My neighbor, a preacher, asked if it was common practice to let an inexperienced crew member actually fly the plane... referencing the co-pilot flying.

People are totally ignorant about our industry, yet the will get onboard ANY airplane with two warm bodies up front.

That's the truth. It's especially evident in the 135 world. You don't have to be smart to be rich...anyone with any sense wouldn't get on an old beat up Lear or brand new GV and go into ASE, RIL, etc. with two pilots they know nothing about. But, like you said, they willingly get on an airplane without question, 121, 135, 91...

People have been stupid since the beginnning of time...and a new one is born every minute.