Colgan vs Mesa

[Cloudroller]

Why dont you see who hires you first

 

[30West]

they're both sub par why not go to the one that pays the most?

And this is based on your years of experience at CJC or just from what you have read here?

 

[30West]

I'd wait

For what? A call from Fedex, Southwest?

 

[DRIVIN402S]

you wanna sit on reserve forever or hold a line right outta training??

i got a friends thats been sitting or reserve at mesa since feb 06 just cause he wanted to fly a jet

BS you wont even sit reserve unless you bid CLT or PHX

 

[DRIVIN402S]

Here's a little of what you can expect at Mesa:


1st Year:

• 6 days on/2 days off reserve. You WILL fly (a little) every day, so no side employment, and you won't be commuting either
• Like Airports? Good, because while you're waiting to fly, you'll be waiting in uniform at the airport for a minimum of 8 hours a day, but 10 hour "ready reserve" shifts give crew trackers maximum flexibility (you get maximum misery)
• Like Airplanes? Great! Because you're not only going to fly them, there's a good chance you'll be sleeping the back of them as well. Bring earplugs, blankets (summertime)/sleeping bags (winter for busted APU's), and cold medicine, because our planes are CRAWLING with bacteria.
• Oh, you're reserve, so you'll fly daytime one day, night time the next. Forget about a regular sleep schedule for at least the next 2 years.
• Annual pay $17,180 (B1900 or Dash), $19,383 (CRJ2/7/9)
• "Training agreement" . . . you're on the hook for up to $10,000 if you bail the first year for greener pastures.
• Contract games . . . anyone's guess, but it won't be pretty, and it won't be short. I suspect the company is going to squeeze very, very hard in every way they can . . . and remember, you're probationary the first year, so you better play along.
• Bases: IAD or ORD, most likely for the CRJ. Performance is a problem at ORD (company offering a bonus to make pilots try harder) and IAD is expensive as hell.
• 401 (k). Do it. Company matches 3.0% for the first 10% you plunk in. Adds up over time.

2nd Year:

• You might be able to hold a "hard line" . . . so at least you get 10 days off every 28 (mostly groups of 2 days off).
• But you don't really know what your schedule is, because guess what? The company can change it at will! Repeatedly! And no, you're not pay protected if your awarded 85 hour line gets slashed down to the minimum pay guarantee of 70 hours. Cancellations due to weather, most maintenance, equipment downgrades, etc . . . you're screwed.
• Upgrades? At 2 years? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAH. You wish.
• Contract fight is still on. At least you're union now. Your contract will be ignored and twisted on a daily basis, but you can "fly now, grieve later". Good luck with that.
• Oh, but you'll be giving almost 2% of your paycheck to ALPA. Hope it's worth it, cus the B.S. coming from one side in the debate is going to be very, very thick.
• Enjoy your 1 week of vacation. But our vacation bidding is a joke (not going to go into it). Suffice it to say I hope you like taking vacations at non-desirable times.
• Pay on jet: $26,000 Pay on D8/B1900 $19,300
• Your domicile will have been changed on you at least twice by now. Company doesn't care "You chose to become a pilot" . . . oh, you don't get "move days" . .. .you do that on your own personal time. If you're in the B1900, it's more like 6 times by now.
• (If you're like most current Mesa fo's, here's where you BAIL for Skywest and RJet . . . but they'll be filling up by then)

3rd Year

• Upgrade right around the corner. Maybe. Problem is, if you take it, you'll be right back on reserve with 6 on/2 off in a domicile you probably don't want to have anything to do with. Commuting once again nigh impossible. (This assumes we haven't lost a code share by then)
• Contract fight getting nasty. Lots of picketing on your day off, but no end in sight. Lots of rhetoric from both sides, lots of yak, yak complaining about contract on the line. Oy! This is like working on flightinfo.

4th year

• Upgrade now! Assuming the planes are still here. A lot can happen in 4 years, we could have lost a code share or two. In which case, you're f'd.
• Contract fight slogs on.

And so forth. This contract fight will take at least 3 years, probably more like 5, and the advantage will be for the company as union leadership quits to get the f out of here as fast as they can. And save your pennies, because if this doesn't go to a strike, ALPA isn't doing it's job.

Good luck. For the life of me, I don't know why you wouldn't try to get on somewhere else.

Why dont you leave Mesa then and lets not here the sob story! "I cant afford the pay cut" "Going to the bottom of the list" Blah Blah Blah.........
1. Save some cash and bail, its only 1st year pay that sucks.
2. If the schedules are soooo bad at Mesa then it will be better QOL even on reserve at another place.
3. You are one of the ones allways beotchin and do nothing and wont quit so the rest or us can escape your contageous pi$$ poor attitude.
4. Last but not least, its not our fault you tried to make a career out of a "stepping stone airline" You must be an idiot! Do all of us FOs a favor and quit so we can upgrade and move on to a real airline!

To answer the original question, Ive been here 2.5 years and Yes there areallot of problems. I have chosen to bit the bullet and "do what i have to do" to get the time and move on. If it ever looks like I wont get that dream job, well, I can tell you for sure that I wont stay and be a crusty old bitter CA like Soverytired, that I can promise you!

Remember the best regional is the one that hires you, get your time get out, take it for what it is and dont believe everything these bitter fools say. Id say they are right about 1/2 the time and deffinately dont believe these guys who work at the so called "better" regionals, they havnt been here, they dont know. Plus they are so proud of them selfes for being a Sky West/Republic/Eagle pilot, their heads are so swollen the cant see strieght. Give me a break you are the same underpaid regional biatch as me.

Ok now smite away boys.......................

 

[CX880]

And this is based on your years of experience at CJC or just from what you have read here?

Look at the pay scales dude.

 

[CX880]

For what? A call from Fedex, Southwest?

Till they have an offer from a better regional.

 

[vtchaz]

Look at the pay scales dude.

This is why pilots are their own worst enemies...if all you do is look at payscales, then you're destined to make all of the wrong decisions and be miserable. Good luck.

If you want serious info about Colgan PM me.

 

[Beantown]

BS you wont even sit reserve unless you bid CLT or PHX

Not true. Flew with an FO yesterday in IAD (by far our most Jr FO base) and he was hired in 7/06 and is still sitting RSV. Sat in the JS with an IAD ERJ FO that has been on RSV over a yr. (he's interviewing at RAH this week).

Bottom line is what ever you choose don't come to Mesa. You will regret it I PROMISE YOU. -Bean

 

[Kream926]

BS you wont even sit reserve unless you bid CLT or PHX

re-read that again and report your findings...

 

[Kream926]

i know its not part if the salary but you also gotta think per diem and credit time...not just flight time....

 

[pdub20s]

Is there really a trainging contract?

 

[poorpilot83]

Don't go to Mesa if they give you the Beech or Dash.

Yeah you wouldn't want to actually fly and have a quicker upgrade

 

[fried chickens]

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnsonrod
Don't go to Mesa if they give you the Beech or Dash.

Don't go unless they give you the props. Quicker upgrades means you'll probably leave mesa as a Capt trying to move up rather than as a f/o leaving to make a lateral move.

 

[Beantown]

How about just don't go to Mesa. Its really that simple. -Bean

 

[Soverytired]

Why dont you leave Mesa then and lets not here the sob story! "I cant afford the pay cut" "Going to the bottom of the list" Blah Blah Blah.........

Last but not least, its not our fault you tried to make a career out of a "stepping stone airline" You must be an idiot!

The question was what to expect at Mesa. I answered as honestly as possible. For some bizarre reason, you chose to make this personal, when you could have disputed my points on the merits (I admittedly painted the bleakest picture possible) Then again, I suspect you're not really that familiar with what the average line pilot goes through.

For what it's worth, had I been asked this question 3 years ago, my answer would have been completely different, and very pro-Mesa. Yes, pro-MESA. Alas, things have changed greatly in that time.

• You suggest that all regionals are basically equal: this is demonstrably untrue.

• You suggest any pilot who thinks Mesa should be anything other than a five-plus year pilot purgatory is a fool. This is so wrong, on so many levels, I doubt you're even a pilot. It leads me to the only possible conclusion:

Management plant (or naive bootlicker extraordinarie ). 3 posts, poor spelling, on flightinfo (of all places !) to praise Mesa. I've seen this type of post from XX.

For your sake "pilot", I hope your plan to get up and out in less than 5 years works out for you (and your home life survives intact). God knows what will happen if you, say, bust your captain ride, or another 9/11 happens and airlines stop hiring for 5 years, or they continue hiring but don't hire you . . . well, I hope you grow a spine and a brain and start thinking about how some very small changes could make Mesa a much better place.

Then get ready to fight for them, because sure as ALPA is looking to improve life at Mesa, the party on the other side of the table will be perfectly happy to do the opposite if it saves them a few bucks.

 

[andym037]

Well guys, i got an offer to interview with both companies.. I've read their info on APC. But i want to know what the employees who work for them think. What are they hiring into right now? QOL? I know Mesa contract in up for renewal in Sept.,how will that change things?etc. etc... Thanks for your guys help

They're both pretty undesirable (I'm being polite) companies. I would suggest not going to either. Wait until something better comes along. Having said that, of the two... I'd say Colgan is the lesser of two evils. Mesa is the worst company on earth. Avoid them like the plague. You'd be better off flying Cessnas.

 

[Soverytired]

Is there really a trainging contract?

Training contract? Yes.

$10,000 for CRJ, pro-rated over the course of your first year, and I believe the clock doesn't start running until you finish IOE.

 

[30West]

Till they have an offer from a better regional.

What exactly is a "better" regional? That's a very subjective description and it means alot of different things to different guys.
The worst possible thing you can do in this business is "wait".

 

[borntwofly]

Colgans bad and getting worse (been there). Mesa, I have been told, will treat you in ways that Colgan mgmt never dreamed up. The industry is changing rapidly. If you are flying right now, work harder at getting offers and wait. Something else better will come along soon. Network!!