Colgan pilot group

[suupah]

Opinions?

 

[suupah]

Though noble sounding Can it actually work? Lets say that it is totally the initiative of the pilots that this thing is being created. Will the Colgans be receptive? How many times have pilots brought issues up to the CP just to have them ignored by Management? Why would that change now?

We could start a list of grievances pilots have brought up against our work rules that the CP presented to Management just to have it slapped down and that list would be longer than one of our tree killing global warming producing dispatch releases. What makes you think things have magically changed now?

I have had a positive experience at Colgan in terms of the great people i work with, the great flying that we do and the career advancement opportunities that are available to me here. But as far as negotiating work rules, compensation and QOL issues it has been made very clear that Management carries a very big stick and you don't want to poke your head out of your gofer hole.

 

[lear24]

it has been made very clear that Management carries a very big stick and you don't want to poke your head out of your gofer hole.

Sounds like management has you guys exactly where they want you. Time to organize. Everyone at Colgan should read the book "confessions of a union buster" and watch for parallels between the book and your own experience. Compare and contrast, talk amongst yourselves. Good luck!

 

[Chamo]

This move is simply a move of desperation...IF ALPA hadnt been knocking at colgans door, this group wouldnt even exist...I love the experience ive gotten flying in this company and the crews ive met...but management is totally in a different dimension than their pilot group and the still cant figure out the "why" we would unionize...the Pilot Committe they propose is symbolic and at any moment can be dissolved and/or ignored...Plus we know that both of the front runners have theire own agenda with the company (Next -in-line chief pilot and one who upgraded about 20 spots out of seniority)...dont drink this KOOL-AID

 

[Gfunk27]

the timing of this committee is just too suspicious, could have used this committee to negotiate the q-400 payscale.

 

[YMICFI]

Alpa

What is (not really) amazing to me is this committee wasn't formed until there was talk of bringing ALPA on the property. Why is the company so concerned about the pilot group now? Because we are looking for representation. They know that they will be required to negotiate a legally binding contract with a grievance procedure. It takes away the direct control over the pilot group and let's them treat us however they wish. They don't want to lose that.

To say that this pilot committee would be able to do anything meaningful for us is simply false. Once they have ALPA defeated, believe me, this committee would go away. It is just a union-busting tactic on management's part. It would hold no legal authority and would be just another arm of management meant to give the pilot group a "warm fuzzy" that we actually matter to management.

We need a professional representative group behind us with decades of leadership...ALPA. They can provide so many services for all of us.

Educate yourselves and you will see the truth...we need ALPA at Colgan as soon as possible. No matter where you are on this issue, send in your cards. That gives you the right to vote in the upcoming election. Whether you want to vote yes or no or even for another group. First, educate yourself and get the facts on what ALPA can do for us. Ask questions!

 

[vtchaz]

You all are missing something

What is (not really) amazing to me is this committee wasn't formed until there was talk of bringing ALPA on the property.

This committee isn't a company organized thing. It is started by PILOTS who are against a Union and are hoping to provide people with an alternative. Once they get the support they need behind them they will approach management.

Does this change how you feel about it now that you know it wasn't formed by the company but by your fellow pilots?

Think about it.

 

[Chamo]

This committee isn't a company organized thing. It is started by PILOTS who are against a Union and are hoping to provide people with an alternative. Once they get the support they need behind them they will approach management.

Does this change how you feel about it now that you know it wasn't formed by the company but by your fellow pilots?

Think about it.

THEN WHY HAS MANAGEMENT BEEN HOUNDING EVERY FORMER CHICAGO EXPRESS PILOT FOR A GLIMPSE AT THEIR COMITTEE HANDBOOK? THIS IS ALL IN MANAGEMENTS BEST INTEREST

 

[DrewBlows]

The first step in this process would be to survey the pilot group in a quest to determine what changes they wish to see made. As a means of accomplishing that end, we request that each pilot submit a list of three main concerns that they would like to see addressed. We will then compose a master list consisting of the main requests, and distribute them to said pilot group for a majority approval. Once that is accomplished, we can commence negotiations with management to effectuate what we believe will be immediate changes, without the expense and hassle of a union. This committee is extremely dedicated, driven, and excited to effect positive, real change within the next few weeks. We ask that Pilots take our role seriously, and, in so doing, that they submit only realistic and obtainable requests. After the initial phase of negotiations the members of the board, upon request, will step down and new members will be selected by standard vote from the pilot group.

In other words, don't ask for anything that will cost the company more.

If the company was really interested in having happy employees why hasn't it already taken care of the pilot's issues. I'm sure you guys have issues that wouldn't cost the company a dime (every airline does), but it takes a union busting committee to address them?

 

[Visceral]

This committee isn't a company organized thing. It is started by PILOTS who are against a Union and are hoping to provide people with an alternative. Once they get the support they need behind them they will approach management.

Does this change how you feel about it now that you know it wasn't formed by the company but by your fellow pilots?

Think about it.

Absolutely not. You can't polish a turd and make it look like a diamond.

 

[Prop2Jet]

You can also buy into the whole pilot group thing to, just don't expect anything because they have not proposed anything to us. Also, it is a bit late gang for an internal committee. The only reason they care now is because ALPA is on the grounds. Other than ALPA we will still have the same work environment with this committee. Instead of sending in my cards I sending out my resumes! C yahs

 

[Prop2Jet]

Strike the last sentence !

 

[Kaman]

I'm sure many of you are versed in the old cliche`, "divide and conquer"? Well, this is exactly what is happening before your very eyes with the creation of their site. Whatever the motivation of these two individuals is, I cannot imagine that they are so niave to think that they are really improving working conditions, pay or benefits at Colgan Air.
Everyone, myself included was shocked at the sale of Colgan to Pinnacle Air Holdings. And you know what? Even after all the ludicrous parties, aircraft orders and "warm n' fuzzy" letters from the boss in HEF things have fundamentally not changed! I say this tongue in cheek, because change is something that the Colgan managment is not something they are particularly good at. Status quo is the order of the day...
One can look at this "new" effort to "help" our pilot group by our "brethern" pilots in a variety of ways. I am going to err on the side of caution and brand it as a managment effort at union busting at it's finest (read that as UGLY). The reason I am erring on the side of caution is first and foremost I don't know or recognize a single name on the list save one...D.B. who rumor has it is on the short-list to be the next CP. I spent a good majority of my adult life putting my life in the hands of other people in the military. And, I had no problem doing it whatsoever. This however, is a whole new ballgame and I ain't so trusting of strangers anymore. I'm even less trusting of management.
Look, many of us have enjoyed and still enjoy a cordial relationship with many of the Colgan family. I personally find them to be hard-working and frugal people. However, this is BUSINESS and in the final analysis the all mighty dollar (PCL Holdings, Inc. stock price) is what the Colgan management now answers to. They were given the job to maintain the present cost structure and fundamental principles of operation that they have used for years. It was fine and dandy as little as two years ago. However, since the IAH operation started things have changed rapidly at Colgan from a size and revenue point of view.
Colgan Air is faced with perhaps it's biggest and best year depending on how the next few months go. Colgan Air's pilots are without exception one of the the MOST PRODUCTIVE in the airline industry. We've done it at the expense of days off, long hours of uncompensated time and are facing more of the same. WE can make it better, but not with the current tactics being used by those in opposition to the ALPA movement. They would do better to vote NO in a democratic election than to continue the foolish path they have decided to follow.
Perhaps the worst thing in this whole mess is that managment loves it! And, yes they will concede a few items...Maybe a dime more in per diem, or a two hour reserve call-out. BUT, I wouldn't look for much that is going to touch the bottom-line! And, as is the case with many regionals Colgan is going to continue going to the rapidly drying well of "qualified" candidates versus recruiting the "best & brightest".
Finally, to the smartasses that have said that those people that want a union are lazy and don't want to work...I'd challenge anyone on the amount of open time that I've personally picked up in addition to "other" duties. Why do I do it? ONE...I'm not FRIGGIN LAZY! TWO...This is what I am trained to do (Believe me, this industry is enough to kill the joy of bursting on top at dawn in just about anyone...Pretty freaking sad considering that I've been around airplanes since I was an infant) and lastly I have a family and need the MONEY...One last thing...NO ONE is getting by on a checkride...At least on the Beech 1900...I dare the SOB that said that to come up to me in LGA and I'll tell you what I think of that comment. COWARD

Regards,

ex-Navy Rotorhead

 

[SeaCow]

This committee isn't a company organized thing. It is started by PILOTS who are against a Union and are hoping to provide people with an alternative. Once they get the support they need behind them they will approach management.

Does this change how you feel about it now that you know it wasn't formed by the company but by your fellow pilots?

Think about it.

Really, this not a company organized attempt at union busting? What rock do you live under, it's being ran BY OUR FUTURE CHIEF PILOT, a future management pilot, you really think he gonna have your best interest in mind? This hair piece warring butt kisser that’s got his head so far up the company butt ya need a switchback to find it, is just trying to put himself in a better position to become a puppet, to not stand up for his pilots. Oh, I don’t know too many pilots that are gonna pay outta pocket to start the website they have, seeing how most of use can barely buy bread. Don’t tell me this is not a company backed organization! If this Colgan Pilot Group thing goes through the only thing were gonna get is some more rough prison se#, maybe the group can have Company SPIT on it first!

 

[suupah]

This committee isn't a company organized thing. It is started by PILOTS who are against a Union and are hoping to provide people with an alternative. Once they get the support they need behind them they will approach management.

Does this change how you feel about it now that you know it wasn't formed by the company but by your fellow pilots?

Think about it.

I don't think this is right. I heard from someone that management asked the senior guys to create a commitee to see what we wanted. I am pretty sure management is involved.

 

[SeaCow]

Here’s an idea. Let’s start an Anti-Colgan Pilot Group website, oh that’s right I have no money nor do I have the Company backing me, so let’s start here. We could have, half story posts like they do, tell the story our way and we could give daily updates. I’ll start:
1 Apr 07
1400Z
The president’s hair piece was blown off!
Moments latter he was spotted running across the taxiway chasing it down.
1 Apr 07
1523Z
The Vice President’s (aka 5By5) FO’s ears pop as the vice shoe horns himself into the flight deck. (Hope the FO goes out the top first in an evac).
1 Apr 07
2300
Both President and Vice seen in Manassas doing maneuvers with management only seen on triple X websites!
Stay tuned for more daily updates!

 

[PCL_128]

This committee isn't a company organized thing. It is started by PILOTS who are against a Union and are hoping to provide people with an alternative. Once they get the support they need behind them they will approach management.

Does this change how you feel about it now that you know it wasn't formed by the company but by your fellow pilots?

Think about it.

Sorry, but I call BS. Who's paying for the website and other expenses? You expect me to believe that these "committee" leaders are paying for things themselves? Give me a break! This has the Colgan family written all over it.

 

[suupah]

Here’s an idea. Let’s start an Anti-Colgan Pilot Group website, oh that’s right I have no money nor do I have the Company backing me, so let’s start here. We could have, half story posts like they do, tell the story our way and we could give daily updates. I’ll start:
1 Apr 07
1400Z
The president’s hair piece was blown off!
Moments latter he was spotted running across the taxiway chasing it down.
1 Apr 07
1523Z
The Vice President’s (aka 5By5) FO’s ears pop as the vice shoe horns himself into the flight deck. (Hope the FO goes out the top first in an evac).
1 Apr 07
2300
Both President and Vice seen in Manassas doing maneuvers with management only seen on triple X websites!
Stay tuned for more daily updates!

OMG!! That is mean but kinda funny. I like DB. He is a cool Cat. Nothing personal but I am not so into the commitee.