Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
  • Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
  • Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
  • Share the passion for aviation
  • Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun

Colgan/PCL Coffee Talk.. (Speculation)

Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
  • Invite your friends
  • Share the passion of aviation
  • Friendliest aviation community on the web
what was it in april/may... 2.5 million in penalties. 3rd week of june I heard 1.5 million ALREADY for the next quarter. that comes off the bottom line, or off of profit.

i don't remember how many millions 9E made last year, but they are already in the hole 4+ and the year is not over. staffing looking forward does not correct until the end of the year then DCI comes in.

they are furloughing office workers and are not backfilling other positions. sit in on a budget meeting and you will know why...
 
To be quite honest, Pinnacle cannot staff our airline. A recent recruiting trip netted 1 hire.
ROFLMAO!!!

I really need to get to an AIR, Inc conference... not to look for a job, but just to watch the PCL booth.

Wonder how many regionals will survive the current upswing as they can't find any pilots to fill the void? That's what happens when you keep hiring 300 hour wunderkids from puppy mills... Can't upgrade for 3+ years, then you only keep them for another 2-3 years before they move on.

Maybe they'll figure it out one day. The gravy days for regional management are OVER... at least for a while until the industry implodes again.
 
ROFLMAO!!!

I really need to get to an AIR, Inc conference... not to look for a job, but just to watch the PCL booth.

Wonder how many regionals will survive the current upswing as they can't find any pilots to fill the void? That's what happens when you keep hiring 300 hour wunderkids from puppy mills... Can't upgrade for 3+ years, then you only keep them for another 2-3 years before they move on.

Maybe they'll figure it out one day. The gravy days for regional management are OVER... at least for a while until the industry implodes again.


the problem is multi-faceted. no only for PNCL but for everyone. Some regionals "get it", PNCL doesn't and I don't think they will. I was fortunate to observe several hiring sessions. My .02

1. some regionals actually offer decent signing bonuses, 1st day employment with travel, insurance, single hotel rooms, and a contract. PNCL does not, they cannot compete. You wouldn't be surprised how many complete OE then bolt for someone actually offering something.
2. the days of 2K and better candidates are long gone, getting 1 out of 20 is considered good. the average candidate is under 1500 with NO turbine time
3. Asking a 800 hour CFI jet aerodynamics on tech questions is just stupid then disqualifying them because they don't know the answer is even worse.
4. begging a guy to come to an interview 3 days later and then disqualifying them because they forgot to copy their medical (they have it in their pocket though) and then sending them packing is also stupid.
5. the bottom line should be... are they trainable and would they be a good employee. finding the perfect candidate really is 1 out of 15 or 20.
6. get them into class fast, you wait and someone else gives them a better offer. One regional offers on the spot and gets you into indoc that day or the next day.
7. make the process enjoyable and informative. It is where the company has to sell itself to the candidate, not the candidate selling themselves to the company.

The only draw PNCL has is for locals or those who WANT the domiciles, quick upgrade for those with time, and those who only want to work for the red tails otherwise there is little else to draw them. This is why FO attrition has mgmt concerned. FO's are leaving in droves in either lateral moves (contract, money, commute), corporate (home more) or to the fractional's (more money). It is not about the equipment, any 1500TT pilot can find a jet job these days.

one last thing before I get off my soapbox. hire the 600 hour pilot, you will own them for 6-8 months before they realize their mistake and bolt for greener pastures. At least you get 6-8 months of productivity out of them. Some of them may respect you for giving them a chance and may actually ride it out. the one thing PNCL does have over others, after a year at PNCL you can break the 13-14 days off, everyone else still cannot touch that.

Puppy mills, they have the regionals by the short ones. Most of them are now demanding the airlines finance the mills. think about it, the mills have the product and will "sell" the product to the highest paying bidder. The mills have to work hard to get someone in the door, the regionals can help that by subsidizing the training cost.

the really scary part is... the kid who woke up today and said... mom, dad.. I want to be an airline pilot! and 8 months later they are in the right seat of a RJ... now that is scary!
 
9E is bleeding money due to penalties from NWA. 7 figure penalties. they don't have much wiggle room to play with extra expenses unless someone else is paying for them.

Question? Labor is mostly a pass through cost, is it not? If so, wouldn't they be better off signing a contract and passing the labor cost on to NWA and DAL. That would help the staffing problem and save the seven figure penalties. When will they get it? When will they react to the changing times?
 
Pinnacle's contract doesn't work like that.

Their ASA with NWA is a fee-per-departure structure. Training isn't pass-through...
 
Pinnacle's contract doesn't work like that.

Their ASA with NWA is a fee-per-departure structure. Training isn't pass-through...

I believe training is pass through, but I was refering more to wages and benefits. Example, new contract, new wages and benefits. Still payed by NWA and DAL. It is cost plus, with exception of fuel and a few other things. But labor is a cost plus, I am pretty sure.
 
ALL the regionals are going to be in a crunch very soon. The $#!tbag outfits are going to suffer the most.

as for now I need another BRWESKI
 
anyhow? Dont you mean anywho?
Last time I checked, a Cherokee is an aircraft and CFI is a rating.
But Im not qualified on the Holiday Inn Express aircraft or have a 9.6 rating on hotornot...whatever the heck that means.
ACTUALLY the CFI is a CERTIFICATE, the Cherokee is a native American Indian, and your instrument ticket is a RATING. FYI. ;-)
 
I believe training is pass through, but I was refering more to wages and benefits. Example, new contract, new wages and benefits. Still payed by NWA and DAL. It is cost plus, with exception of fuel and a few other things. But labor is a cost plus, I am pretty sure.

Under the new ASA, training is no longer a pass-through cost. Pinnacle pays for that all by themselves. Labor costs are also only partially pass-through. The ASA stipulates that NWA will pay for labor costs that aren't in excess of the "industry average" based on the average of all publicly traded regional jet operators. So, if the new wages exceed that average, then Pinnacle has to pick up the extra.
 
Under the new ASA, training is no longer a pass-through cost. Pinnacle pays for that all by themselves. Labor costs are also only partially pass-through. The ASA stipulates that NWA will pay for labor costs that aren't in excess of the "industry average" based on the average of all publicly traded regional jet operators. So, if the new wages exceed that average, then Pinnacle has to pick up the extra.
That's what I thought, just didn't know for certain...
 

Latest resources

Back
Top Bottom