Colgan 3407 CVR Transcript

[Superpilot92]

link doesnt work anymore

this one does

http://www.foxnews.com/projects/pdf/buffalo_cockpit_transcript.pdf

 

[AMANSWORLD]

Overall a very sad deal indeed. However several things come to mind as far as the FAA and NTSB may look into more in depth.

Overall experience level of both pilots and will they increase standards. Which in my opinion they should. That being said you can bet Colgan's Training and Standards Department will be on the chopping block (maybe the whole company).

It has been a focus now of several individuals and aviation safety action groups to investigate these pilot factories and PFT airlines. And they should.

Unfortunately several people died because of a lack of experience and that is the bottom line.

 

[JSky26]

22:11:39.9

HOT-2 that's not much for uh back when you got hired.
22:11:42.5

HOT-1 no but uh out of that six and a quarter two hundred fifty hours was uh part
one twenty one turbine. multi engine turbine.
22:11:50.0

HOT-2 oh that's right yeah.

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From him talking about flying in Florida to this quote....it looks like the Capt. was a former Gulfstream dude. This isn't going to be pretty.....

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[LJ45]

Yes, at PDT on our Dash's we call for ToGo Power and then flaps to 5 degrees. Once a postive rate is established then the Gear is called up. Out of 1000' agl the 5 degree is retracted.

So with the stall warning still activated you retract the flaps?

 

[Patriot328]

So with the stall warning still activated you retract the flaps?

In some airplanes, yep? I haven't flown the dash of any series... I wonder if Colgan trains approaches to stall only, where maybe getting rid of flaps will reduce the drag more than the lift and allow the plane to accelerate in a more timely manner. Any Q drivers could speak up.


Most of the planes I've flown you leave the configuration alone until the stall event is over, then clean it up.

 

[RAIMnotavailabl]

What about messing with flaps at all with an iced up plane?

How about tailplane icing? I'm sure you all have seen the NASA video with the Twin Otter ice cube?

 

[Browntothebone]

HOT-2
I've never seen icing conditions. I've never deiced. I've never seen any—
I've never experienced any of that. I don't want to have to experience that
and make those kinds of calls. you know I'dve freaked out. I'dve have like
seen this much ice and thought oh my gosh we were going to crash.

 

[WSurf]

So with the stall warning still activated you retract the flaps?

Of course not. First off you should never, ever get into that situation. The only time in training we see the stick shaker is during a windshear recovery. Or if you are responding from a EGPWS warning for terrian. Another situation you shouldn't find yourself in.

The question was does the flaps come up before the gear? Yes they do in the dash on a go around.

However if your stalling, screw the gear and flaps. Airspeed is what you want. The airplane doesn't give a sh$t if the gear and flaps are out, it only knows it needs a certain Airspeed to fly. I think the FO was just trying to do somthing, but I think in recovery if she retracted the flaps it coulda made the problem worse. Once the flaps are retracted that stall speed is now even more increased.

Sorry if I anwered the question the wrong way the first time.

 

[WSurf]

What about messing with flaps at all with an iced up plane?

How about tailplane icing? I'm sure you all have seen the NASA video with the Twin Otter ice cube?

There are a few times if the ice is bad enough in the Dash that flaps 0 landing might be better.

But you rarely run into that. Again thats where experience comes in.

 

[TOOL CRIB]

Of course not. First off you should never, ever get into that situation. The only time in training we see the stick shaker is during a windshear recovery. Or if you are responding from a EGPWS warning for terrian. Another situation you shouldn't find yourself in.

The question was does the flaps come up before the gear? Yes they do in the dash on a go around.

However if your stalling, screw the gear and flaps. Airspeed is what you want. The airplane doesn't give a sh$t if the gear and flaps are out, it only knows it needs a certain Airspeed to fly. I think the FO was just trying to do somthing, but I think in recovery if she retracted the flaps it coulda made the problem worse. Once the flaps are retracted that stall speed is now even more increased.

Sorry if I anwered the question the wrong way the first time.

Airspeed is not what you want in a stall. You want a lower angle of attack, so push the stick forward. Unfortunately the ground sometimes gets in the way of doing that.

 

[WSurf]

Airspeed is not what you want in a stall. You want a lower angle of attack, so push the stick forward. Unfortunately the ground sometimes gets in the way of doing that.

Duh! By lowering the pitch aren't you increasing Airspeed? Yes Airspeed is what you want! If that means lowering the nose you do it. Sorry I didn't make it simplier for you.

 

[regionaltard]

Hopefully two pilots discussing their lack of experience before stalling a perfectly good airplane and killing a bunch of people will prompt a good hard look at this industry.

 

[MEXICANFLYBOY]

sad news!

 

[WSurf]

Where did you go to school to say Airspeed isn't what you want during a stall? Please don't tell me your another Colgan Pilot?

 

[Amish RakeFight]

From him talking about flying in Florida to this quote....it looks like the Capt. was a former Gulfstream dude. This isn't going to be pretty.....​

40 something Marvin gets tired of his cubicle and drops $30K for 250 hrs as a paid FO before hiring on at Colgan with 625 hrs. Why hasnt this come out in the media yet? The public should know about these shady PFT practices out there. It needs to stop for so many reasons.