Colgan 3407 CVR Transcript

[UALRATT]

http://www.ntsb.gov/events/2009/Buffalo-NY/AnimationDescription.htm

 

[RAIMnotavailabl]

Experience and good experienced trainers doing the training.

When will the corporate types in all transportation industries understand that safety comes from training and experience of training.

They need to pay people enough, put money into mx and make the experienced people want to stay.

I left aviation in 2006 and drove 18 wheelers cross country. Same job as flying but your bed is right behind you.

This sort of thing awakens old memories of my time flying and wrenching on airplanes that led me to leave the industry. I rarely ride in the back of the AL tubes anymore.

Be safe out there.

 

[CEO silly sap]

I'm going to go re-read fly the wing by Capt Webb.

I can stall an airplane at 200kts, but the angle of attack has to be just right.

 

[jehtplane]

Where did you go to school to say Airspeed isn't what you want during a stall? Please don't tell me your another Colgan Pilot?

Uh, you can stall an airplane at any airspeed.

 

[WSurf]

I'm going to go re-read fly the wing by Capt Webb.

I can stall an airplane at 200kts, but the angle of attack has to be just right.

Yep, ever wing has a angle of attack that will stall the wing. But if you have a airspeed that will continue to allow flow over the wing and attach to it then it will fly.

Hell a F-15 will climb straight up as long as it has the power to keep a certain Airspeed. Once that speed falls he has one option and thats the lower the AOA to help keep that Speed to keep the wings flying.

I think we can all agree that in this situation "Colgan" that the AOA shoulda been lowered to increase the speed to allow for air flow attachment over the wing.

And yes you can do an accelerated stall in a plane. But its still a matter of airflow over the wing.

 

[UALRATT]

Duh! By lowering the pitch aren't you increasing Airspeed? Yes Airspeed is what you want! If that means lowering the nose you do it. Sorry I didn't make it simplier for you.

I'll be the ref here and give this round to Tool Crab who is ABSOLUTELY right, that it is AOA that must be reduced to recover from a stall. Aerodynamics 101 - an airplane will stall at any airspeed, configuration, weight, etc, etc. These are all variables in this equation. AOA is the only constant. Surf, maybe a refresher course before you carry your next passenger.

I hate the internet...

 

[UALRATT]

Yep, ever wing has a angle of attack that will stall the wing. But if you have a airspeed that will continue to allow flow over the wing and attach to it then it will fly.

Hell a F-15 will climb straight up as long as it has the power to keep a certain Airspeed. Once that speed falls he has one option and thats the lower the AOA to help keep that Speed to keep the wings flying.

I think we can all agree that in this situation "Colgan" that the AOA shoulda been lowered to increase the speed to allow for air flow attachment over the wing.

And yes you can do an accelerated stall in a plane. But its still a matter of airflow over the wing.

You are confusing energy and aerodynamics...

 

[WSurf]

I'll be the ref here and give this round to Tool Crab who is ABSOLUTELY right, that it is AOA that must be reduced to recover from a stall. Aerodynamics 101 - an airplane will stall at any airspeed, configuration, weight, etc, etc. These are all variables in this equation. AOA is the only constant. Surf, maybe a refresher course before you carry your next passenger.

I hate the internet...

LOL, I wasn't arguing lowering the AOA. I was saying that you have to get Airspeed (airflow) over the wing fast during a stall. And yes lowering the AOA does that. And you do have to sacrifice Altitude for that.

I hate the internet..

 

[WSurf]

You are confusing energy and aerodynamics...

Correct, I haven't instructed in over 10 years. Ty

 

[TCAS]

Hell a F-15 will climb straight up as long as it has the power to keep a certain Airspeed. Once that speed falls he has one option and thats the lower the AOA to help keep that Speed to keep the wings flying.

There is just so much wrong in the above statement I don't even know where to begin to start.

With respect to an aerodynamic stall, angle of attack and airspeed...

An airfoil will stall when it reaches or goes beyond its critical angle of attack. The wing will become unstalled by decreasing the angle of attack to an angle less than its critical angle of attack.

Airspeed, in conjuntion with angle of attack, will determine the amount of lift that is generated by the wing. No air over the wing, no lift. Airflow over the wing will give it lift. Increasing the angle of attack will give the wing additional lift until the angle of attack reaches its critical angle of attack. When critical angle of attack is reached the wing stops producing lift regardless of the amount of airspeed.