Class Dates at Southern Air and Focus

[dutch747]

^^^^^^^^^^

Your are da man. Well said....

 

[GogglesPisano]

Nice post Feerless. Regional guys especially need to look past the "glamour" of widebody flying and realize that ACMI is a whole diferent animal compared to what they are used to.

 

[gear_yanker]

Freep:

Interesting post. I agree with some of what you've said, but not all. I got my first widebody non-sked job in the 80's and I've worked for a couple of the outfits on your list, so I hope you feel I'm qualified to comment further.

I think the differences between ACMI operators right now are huge. I can't understand why anyone would sign a training bond to work at a place like Southern. You can do the same sort of flying with about the same chance for a quick upgrade at Kalitta, but without a bond. Kalitta is getting the -400 and the unionized crews have just recently started working under a much improved contract (they actually traded away some improvements to get a massive raise for the 1st year crewmembers (good job!), whereas the Southern guys traded away 1st year deadhead pay to get more for themselves (shameful!). Pay some money out of pocket for a hotel during initial groundschool....maybe. But you can't really compare a few hundred dollar initial outlay to a $24,000/two year training bond.

Training bonds can be implemented for a variety of reasons. Southern doesn't type rate many newhire F/Os, so that really isn't the issue in this case.

It comes down to a management decision about improving conditions for the crews or keeping conditions the same and implementing a bond to make it very difficult for newhires to resign. Obviously, Southern chose the bond route rather than address some major crewmember issues, like involuntary loss of days off.

For the record, I think anyone who quits one of the outfits you named to go to one of the other outfits you named is crazy. It would be a lateral move, at best.

With that said, I would never give up my right to "vote with my feet" if things got really bad. But that's just what you do when you sign a training bond. The protections available to crewmembers in the Collective Bargaining Agreement do not apply to those in their first year at a company. The company can do whatever they want to you because they know you can't even quit as long as that $24,000 bond is hanging over your head!! They can take all your days off between bid periods and you'll be "on the road" for two full months. Don't like it? Tough sh!t....there's nothing you can do.

It's bad enough to be in this position as a F/O or F/E, but can you even imagine the pressure the company could apply to you as a Captain if you're still on probation AND covered by a training bond? That's exactly the position some guys will find themselves in if they sign the bond and accept a "Captain qualified F/O" position. If maintenance and fatigue really are your major concerns, imagine for a moment what a company could push a Captain to do if the guy/gal is still on probation and subject to a training bond. Scary!!

 

[dutch747]

Well said, gear_yanker.

 

[dakotaHC8]

I'm tired of arguing with you.

Why dontcha save us all a lot of time and tell us where you ended up moving to, so we all know the name of a perfect operation to apply to...???

C'mon. fess up.

 

[dakotaHC8]

Wait a sec, Gear Yanker...

You work for Kailtta, and you're giving people at any other ACMI crap...???

Are you serious...

The last thing I want to hear is some "pot" calling the "kettle" black.

Make yourself feel better about your own workplace (whichever version of the many Kalitta's out there you happen to be at) in some other fashion than knocking mine.

 

[gear_yanker]

Southern Training Agreement

TRAINING Reimbursement AGREEMENT

​

This Training Reimbursement Agreement (“Agreement”) is made as of the___day of_______2007 by and between Southern Air Inc. (“the Company”) and ________________________, who upon execution of this agreement will be hired by the Company for a crewmember position as a pilot or flight engineer on aircraft operated by the Company (“Candidate”).
RECITALS
WHEREAS, Candidate has successfully completed the Company’s pilot/flight engineer training program for which the Company has expended a large sum of money and and time, to qualify Candidate to operate as a crewmember, and,
WHEREAS, successful completion of the training program has enhanced the aeronautical skills and techniques of the Candidate; and,
WHEREAS, Candidate and the Company agree that the cost incurred by the Company for the training program provided to Candidate was Twenty Four thousand($24,000) Dollars:
NOW THEREFORE, the Company and Candidate, in consideration of the covenants and agreements contained herein and in further consideration of the benefits and advantages flowing from each to the other, covenant and agree as follows:
1.
The Company will be unable to realize the value of the training provided to Candidate under this Agreement unless Candidate accepts employment by the Company and continues to operate the Company’s aircraft in revenue service as a crewmember for the Company for a period of at least twenty four(24) months.. Therefore, if Candidate accepts employment with the Company and thereafter resigns, or otherwise voluntarily terminates Candidate’s employment with the Company, or is discharged for failing to comply with rules and regulations established by the Company at any time within twenty four (24) months of active service following the date on which the Candidate is hired by the Company the Candidate agrees that the Candidate will repay the Company the sum of Twenty Four Thousand ($24,000) Dollars, reduced by 1/24th for each full month of Candidate’s employment with the Company prior to the date Candidate’s employment terminates, Such debt shall be further evidenced by the execution of a Promissory Note.

2.​

The Company shall have the right to apply any wages or other sums due to the Candidate upon termination of the Candidate’s employment toward the amount owed by the Candidate to the Company pursuant to the terms of this Agreement, and Candidate hereby expressly authorizes the Company to retain such sums for that purpose. Candidate will pay the remaining outstanding balance of the Candidates training costs on the date of termination.

3.​

Should Candidate fail to make payment as described above, the Company is entitled to the costs, attorney fees and related expenses incurred by the Company in connection with the Company’s collection of the outstanding balance owed by the Candidate to the Company.

4.​

The twenty-fourth (24th) month active service period running from the Candidate’s hiring by the Company, the completion of which will extinguish Candidate’s financial obligations to the Company under this Agreement, shall include any periods of involuntary furlough. Should Candidate voluntarily resign or be justifiably discharged by the Company after return from furlough, the time-credit given under this paragraph shall be void and returned to the Company. The twenty-four (24) month active service period shall not include any periods of medical leave during which Candidate is unable to fly as a result of illness or injury.

5.​

The Company will absorb the cost of training provided under this Agreement if its business is terminated while Candidate is actively employed by the Company or if Candidate dies before the completion of the twenty-fourth (24th) month active service period described herein or loses medical qualification for a period of more than twenty-four (24) months.

6.​

Except as expressly provided herein, this Agreement does not alter any of the existing terms and conditions of Candidate’s employment with the Company, during the period of the Candidate’s employment with the Company. The existence of any claim that Candidate may have against the Company based upon either this Agreement or upon Candidate’s employment with the Company will not serve as a defense to the enforcement by the Company of this Agreement

7.​

If this Agreement or any portion of it is held not to be enforceable, under the law, the Agreement will be deemed to be modified only to the extent necessary to be enforceable under the law.

8.​

This Agreement as well as the related Promissory Note shall be interpreted under the laws of the State of Connecticut. If Candidate fails to repay any amounts due under this Agreement and the Company is required to initiate legal action to collect the amount due, Candidate hereby expressly:
(a) Agrees to submit to jurisdiction and venue in the courts, state and federal, of Fairfield County, Connecticut for all purposes related to enforcing this Agreement and Promissory Note, regardless of Candidate’s residence at that time; and
(b) Consents to accept service of process as well as any pleading or motion related to enforcing this Agreement by the Company mailing, hand delivering, or overnight expressing a copy to the Candidate’s address.
For the purposes of service, the Candidate’s address shall be the last known address on file with the Company, and Candidate further agrees to inform the Company promptly and in writing of any and all change of candidate’s address, including those subsequent to Candidate’s resignation or discharge..

9.​

If Candidate’s employment with the Company is terminated and repayment is invoked in accordance with the provisions of this agreement and the Company agrees to accept monthly payments from the Candidate in lieu of a lump sum payment of the sum owed by the Candidate should the candidate fails to make timely monthly payments, the Company may elect to accelerate the unpaid balance of the sum due and declare the same payable at once on notice and demand.

10.​

This Agreement constitutes the entire understanding between the parties relating to the rights herein granted and the obligations assumed. Any oral representations of or modifications to this instrument shall be of no effect unless they are in writing, signed by both parties, and state explicitly an intent to modify this Agreement.

11.​

Failure to enforce any provision or obligation under this Agreement shall not constitute a waiver thereof, or serve as a bar to the subsequent enforcement of other provisions or obligations under this Agreement.

12.​

Candidate by Candidate’s execution of this agreement hereby accepts employment by the Company and agree to be bound by the terms of this agreement..This Agreement is not an employment contract and shall not be interpreted as a promise by the Company to employ Candidate for any length of time.
IN WITNESS WHEREOF, the parties hereto have executed this agreement as of the date set forth above.


________________________
Candidate


Southern Air Inc.

By:________________________

 

[gear_yanker]

Wait a sec, Gear Yanker...

You work for Kailtta, and you're giving people at any other ACMI crap...???

Who said I work for Kalitta? I did say Kalitta is a much better choice if someone is looking for a 747 job.

 

[Dream2fly]

So do u work for Southern or Not?

No, not at all. But I do have a problem when a management cheerleader comes on a public forum and tries to misrepresent the current situation at Southern.

Southern is not the place to work if you have any other options at all. You can fly the 747 somewhere else that upgrades just as fast. What's the difference? The other places DON'T REQUIRE YOU TO SIGN A TRAINING BOND!! And some of the other places even have a proper union and a contract with teeth. Southern has become an employer of last resort. Better than nothing, if you're already unemployed.

Your numbers concerning Captain qualified F/Os represent those hired prior to the training bond. The experience level of those hired since the implementation of the bond is much lower. There are just not many highly experienced guys around who are willing to soil the profession by signing a training bond to get a job at a bottom-feeder outfit like Southern.

The next time you say I don't know anything about Southern, I'll publish the full text of the training "agreement" for everyone to see. I bet that would slow the number of guys willing to travel to CT at their own expense. And I bet your "daddy" in Norwalk might not be too happy with you either.

So, Do U work for Southern or Not?
If yes- if you are not happy then leave!!!
If No - There are many people trying to enjoy what they have so Please be cool.
You don't have to tell me and other guys How my company is like.
Go yank the gear somewhere else.

I am trying to enjoy what I have.

 

[Dream2fly]

WOW I am impressed!!!

TRAINING Reimbursement AGREEMENT


This Training Reimbursement Agreement (“Agreement”) is made as of the___day of_______2007 by and between Southern Air Inc. (“the Company”) and ________________________, who upon execution of this agreement will be hired by the Company for a crewmember position as a pilot or flight engineer on aircraft operated by the Company (“Candidate”).
RECITALS
WHEREAS, Candidate has successfully completed the Company’s pilot/flight engineer training program for which the Company has expended a large sum of money and and time, to qualify Candidate to operate as a crewmember, and,
WHEREAS, successful completion of the training program has enhanced the aeronautical skills and techniques of the Candidate; and,
WHEREAS, Candidate and the Company agree that the cost incurred by the Company for the training program provided to Candidate was Twenty Four thousand($24,000) Dollars:
NOW THEREFORE, the Company and Candidate, in consideration of the covenants and agreements contained herein and in further consideration of the benefits and advantages flowing from each to the other, covenant and agree as follows:
1.
The Company will be unable to realize the value of the training provided to Candidate under this Agreement unless Candidate accepts employment by the Company and continues to operate the Company’s aircraft in revenue service as a crewmember for the Company for a period of at least twenty four(24) months.. Therefore, if Candidate accepts employment with the Company and thereafter resigns, or otherwise voluntarily terminates Candidate’s employment with the Company, or is discharged for failing to comply with rules and regulations established by the Company at any time within twenty four (24) months of active service following the date on which the Candidate is hired by the Company the Candidate agrees that the Candidate will repay the Company the sum of Twenty Four Thousand ($24,000) Dollars, reduced by 1/24th for each full month of Candidate’s employment with the Company prior to the date Candidate’s employment terminates, Such debt shall be further evidenced by the execution of a Promissory Note.

2.​

The Company shall have the right to apply any wages or other sums due to the Candidate upon termination of the Candidate’s employment toward the amount owed by the Candidate to the Company pursuant to the terms of this Agreement, and Candidate hereby expressly authorizes the Company to retain such sums for that purpose. Candidate will pay the remaining outstanding balance of the Candidates training costs on the date of termination.

3.​

Should Candidate fail to make payment as described above, the Company is entitled to the costs, attorney fees and related expenses incurred by the Company in connection with the Company’s collection of the outstanding balance owed by the Candidate to the Company.

4.​

The twenty-fourth (24th) month active service period running from the Candidate’s hiring by the Company, the completion of which will extinguish Candidate’s financial obligations to the Company under this Agreement, shall include any periods of involuntary furlough. Should Candidate voluntarily resign or be justifiably discharged by the Company after return from furlough, the time-credit given under this paragraph shall be void and returned to the Company. The twenty-four (24) month active service period shall not include any periods of medical leave during which Candidate is unable to fly as a result of illness or injury.

5.​

The Company will absorb the cost of training provided under this Agreement if its business is terminated while Candidate is actively employed by the Company or if Candidate dies before the completion of the twenty-fourth (24th) month active service period described herein or loses medical qualification for a period of more than twenty-four (24) months.

6.​

Except as expressly provided herein, this Agreement does not alter any of the existing terms and conditions of Candidate’s employment with the Company, during the period of the Candidate’s employment with the Company. The existence of any claim that Candidate may have against the Company based upon either this Agreement or upon Candidate’s employment with the Company will not serve as a defense to the enforcement by the Company of this Agreement

7.​

If this Agreement or any portion of it is held not to be enforceable, under the law, the Agreement will be deemed to be modified only to the extent necessary to be enforceable under the law.

8.​

This Agreement as well as the related Promissory Note shall be interpreted under the laws of the State of Connecticut. If Candidate fails to repay any amounts due under this Agreement and the Company is required to initiate legal action to collect the amount due, Candidate hereby expressly:
(a) Agrees to submit to jurisdiction and venue in the courts, state and federal, of Fairfield County, Connecticut for all purposes related to enforcing this Agreement and Promissory Note, regardless of Candidate’s residence at that time; and
(b) Consents to accept service of process as well as any pleading or motion related to enforcing this Agreement by the Company mailing, hand delivering, or overnight expressing a copy to the Candidate’s address.
For the purposes of service, the Candidate’s address shall be the last known address on file with the Company, and Candidate further agrees to inform the Company promptly and in writing of any and all change of candidate’s address, including those subsequent to Candidate’s resignation or discharge..

9.​

If Candidate’s employment with the Company is terminated and repayment is invoked in accordance with the provisions of this agreement and the Company agrees to accept monthly payments from the Candidate in lieu of a lump sum payment of the sum owed by the Candidate should the candidate fails to make timely monthly payments, the Company may elect to accelerate the unpaid balance of the sum due and declare the same payable at once on notice and demand.

10.​

This Agreement constitutes the entire understanding between the parties relating to the rights herein granted and the obligations assumed. Any oral representations of or modifications to this instrument shall be of no effect unless they are in writing, signed by both parties, and state explicitly an intent to modify this Agreement.

11.​

Failure to enforce any provision or obligation under this Agreement shall not constitute a waiver thereof, or serve as a bar to the subsequent enforcement of other provisions or obligations under this Agreement.

12.​

Candidate by Candidate’s execution of this agreement hereby accepts employment by the Company and agree to be bound by the terms of this agreement..This Agreement is not an employment contract and shall not be interpreted as a promise by the Company to employ Candidate for any length of time.
IN WITNESS WHEREOF, the parties hereto have executed this agreement as of the date set forth above.


________________________
Candidate


Southern Air Inc.

By:________________________

WOW, I am impressed....
You know so much about the company so U had to prove that U are the MAN.....
So Unprofessional.