CFI Programs

[cookmg]

Thanks for all of the suggestions.

My first priority is to get quality instruction. I figure to be rather low time when I work on the CFI. I want to be sure that I am getting a quality education to compensate for any areas of weakness that low time pilots typically have. If this is the focus, then is the consensus that I should attend a large, well-established shool, like Flight Safety? My concern being that many FBOs don't train CFIs very often.

Also, I want to work as a CFI. Earning this rating will have some value to me of its own (i.e. a great accomplishment). However, I really want the CFI to begin a career in aviation. Therefore, where will I work? If you can find a school with a guranteed job, are there any gurantees on flight hours? "If you finish our program you will be hired as a CFI." (You will sit around making coffee and not get any students . . . thanks for the money though!)

 

[bobbysamd]

FSI

[T]hen is the consensus that I should attend a large, well-established shool, like Flight Safety? My concern being that many FBOs don't train CFIs very often.

A lot depends. It really boils down to instructor availability and quals. A flight instructor who has held his/her certificate for at least 24 months and has given at least 200 hours of instructor has to give you the training. I would guess that these days there are plenty of CFIs available at plenty of FBOs with those quals. You should do plenty of shopping around for schools.

If you can find a school with a guranteed job, are there any gurantees on flight hours . . . .

I can speak for FSI. New-hires who are school graduates don't start flying right away. They work their way up. They may work in dispatch or in scheduling. They teach ground school. I recall that new-hire FSI grads didn't fly until about six months after being hired.

The amount of flying that you will get very much depends on a place's student load. If you find a place that guarantees a job, it may be that the place "hires" you to hang around, but you won't get paid unless you fly. Just check it out carefully.

Hope that helps some more. Once more, good luck with your efforts.

 

[172driver]

If you choose Comair you must complete at least two ratings (CFI/II) before interviewing. The CFI training is outstanding although, as others mentioned, the work is done mostly by you and your books. You will prepare and present 22 briefs to different CFI's.

There is no guarantee of being hired but if you are hired you will start flying right away. CAA is in pretty good shape student wise right now because of the guaranteed airline interview at the end. FSI isn't as I understand -- 3:1 CFI: student ratio at CAA and closer to 1:1 at FSI.

The program is relatively expensive (around $10K for both ratings with a credit coming back for your MEI if you're hired) but definitely high quality. I wouldn't do it unless you're pretty sharp and very motivated. If so, you stand a very good shot at geting hired.

 

[cookmg]

Well, comair sounds very interesting. It seems they combine excellent training along with a shot at a good job. However . . . 10,000! Wow! That's up to three times the quote I've seen at other 141 schools . . . and as someone mentioned here, you could do it yourself part 61 even cheaper. And, there are no gurantees.

So, you have to be sharp and motivated? Does anyone have any specifics on what can get you hired at comair? Don't these situations end up being about politics? Can you work hard, do well, and earn that kind of job?

What's the reimbursment on the MEI?

What do you get for the 10K anyhow?

Thanks

 

[CooCooTim]

cookmg,
You might want to checkout www.ocflightcenter.com/ as well...
They operate out of KSNA. Good luck!

 

[fulcrum]

YOU GET WHAT YOU PUT IN IT

 

[172driver]

I'll try to answer your questions as honestly as I can. First, I agree $10K is a lot, perhaps too much, but the market seems to bear it.

First, you will go through a VFR/IFR proficiency course to get used to the area, Comair procedures, and standards, etc.

The CFI program consists of 40 hrs ground school, 22 ground briefs you give to various CFI's (these vary between 1 and 4 hrs in length), 18 flight lessons, in-house end of course. The quote is pretty realistic -- you will most likely team up with another student on the briefs, cutting the cost in half. The flight portion will probably run over budget a bit, depending on your performance. Right around $7000 I believe but check with the school.

CFI-I is basically a Part 61 course -- train to proficiency, 20 hrs ground school you pay for, 20 hrs free. Students finish it in anywhere between 12 and 40 flight hrs. It really varies depending on the rust. Quoted at $2500 or so.

Then you interview. No politics involved, they are simply looking for solid CFI's. They try to model it after an airline interview (written test, oral board interview). They will look at your training record, attitude, time it took to complete the courses, personality, etc. Basically, they try to filter out the students who had MAJOR difficulties, if you know what I mean.

As far as the MEI credit, you'd have to contact them for the exact amount. They pay the full MEI ($4500 or so) for those who go through the whole program, pro rate those who come in with ratings. I would guess you'd get about $2000 back.

I guess the major selling point and the reason we have students, even at these prices, is the airline interview. I don't want to sound like an admissions rep but where else are pilots being hired at 1000/100? At an excellent airline, no less.

I will warn you though -- many students who come from the outside are blown away by the pace and standards they are held to. Some do very well and others drop out very quickly. Depends on student aptitude, work ethic, and quality of previous training.

Hope this helps. Let me know if you have any more questions.

 

[EMcx2]

The preceding advertisement has been paid for by Comair! 172Driver must be a sales counselor because even the people who have gotten through the "program" would not describe it in such glowing terms. I’ll bet it’s Ron.

Let’s tell it the way it really is…..
If you are coming from outside, the minimum price for the initial CFI is $11,000 plus. The VFR/IFR proficiency alone is $4,000. The ground school, which is a waste of time, is $1,200. So the minimum is close to $12,000 if you are perfect. On the other hand, it is not unusual for students at Comair to take 50 flight hours to earn an initial CFI. 50!!
CFII…They quote a price for 5 flight hours to complete the program. Well it turns out; the syllabus contains a minimum of 15 hours of flight time. Oh, and by the way, the CFI group manager said that the average time to complete the CFII was 27 hours! Twenty-seven hours of flight time to do a CFII!!! I know people who have spent more than 20,000 dollars just to get a CFI/CFII. People have spent 70,000 plus dollars earning all of their ratings.
While we are at it, let us mention a couple of other highlights….
Beat to hell airplanes at ridiculous prices.
Complete lack of control of your own schedule.

It is true that many of the students who come from outside of the program drop out. That’s because having been other places they quickly realize they are being exploited and get out before they waste to much money.

Let me give you something else to think about. Lets talk about why everybody goes to Comair; a chance to go right into a RJ. Comair puts pictures of them every where and on everything. Well, before you get to fly a RJ, you have to get hired as a flight instructor.
If you are hired as an instructor, you have to give 800 hours of dual instruction before you can interview with the airline. That is equivalent to training three people from 0 time through their instructor ratings. Let us assume that all three of those students are hired as instructors. Comair academy now needs at least 9 students to keep those CFI’s busy. For those 9 students to be hired, the school now needs 27 new students. Under different circumstances, this same scheme is called a pyramid club. Sorry…I got carried away but the math doesn’t lie. Over time, only one out 3 people will even make it to flight instructor.

The quality of your life is determined by the quality of your decisions….choose carefully.

 

[172driver]

I am not going to be the CAA defender here and I'm certainly not a sales rep. But...EMcx2 sounds like he/she couldn't hack it. I believe I mentioned that many people struggle with the high standards. However, many people make it through the program right on or even under the quotes. I was one of them.

It is probably true that 1/2 to 1/3 of the students who start the program don't finish it as a CAA CFI. Others can say better than I whether or not this is true of most schools/FBO's. How many private students at your school ended up working there? Not everybody is cut out to be a professional pilot.

They quote a price for 5 flight hours to complete the program. Well it turns out; the syllabus contains a minimum of 15 hours of flight time.

Untrue...the CFI-I is quoted at 15 hrs, just like the syllabus.

Oh, and by the way, the CFI group manager said that the average time to complete the CFII was 27 hours! Twenty-seven hours of flight time to do a CFII!!! I know people who have spent more than 20,000 dollars just to get a CFI/CFII. People have spent 70,000 plus dollars earning all of their ratings.

This is true. However, it all comes down to proficiency.