Cape Air Grounds Fleet

[CE402]

Good call by the company to play it safe...

http://news.bostonherald.com/localRegional/view.bg?articleid=1006195

 

[Taildraggaah]

Hats off to them for being prudent and proactive with this safety issue. Do they have future plans to replace the 402s?

 

[Fred Rogers]

I couldn't get that link to open. What happened?

 

[flifo81]

Try this one:

http://ack.net/planegrounding061307.html

 

[zawillif]

From Dan Wolf's company message:

There seems to be an "abnormally fast wear problem with the counterweights on the crankshafts". They are replacing all the counterweights on all the engines. Starting Thursday they will be having 10 aircraft per day finished. Should be back to full capacity by early next week.

 

[Golden Falcon]

Yeah good on them...failure of one of those really makes a mess of things there was a bogus parts issue with some of those and associated hardware years back wonder if it resurfaced???

 

[Mesabi Miner]

I think Cape Air had a wing spar issue with the 402's a few years back as well. Required massive inspections as I recall. Great airline though. I spend alot of time on the Cape and not seeing the sky filled with the 402's would be disheartening. Jumpsat on them as well; they were very hospitable. I wish them the best of luck.

MM

 

[ackattacker]

"abnormal wear" is one way to put it. "Parts shooting holes through the cowling" is another. Things that make you go hmmm. Good job to the pilots involved.

 

[Way2Broke]

"abnormal wear" is one way to put it. "Parts shooting holes through the cowling" is another. Things that make you go hmmm. Good job to the pilots involved.

The rumor that I heard was that the the engineers from Lycoming inspected some of the engines and found that the power setting that Cape Air uses in their SOPs is causing a vibration that could be causing alot of the failures. Apparently the power setting of 27in/21rps/90pph (85 now I think) is not found anywhere in the P.O.H. for a cruise setting, nor is the high speed cruise of 29.5in/2450rps/120pph. Although these setting are "approved" by the manufacturer. Best of luck finding and solving the problem.

Is Island Air or Nantucket Shuttle doing any extra inspections? Obviously they all operate their 402s in a very similar way.

 

[Mesabi Miner]

The rumor that I heard was that the the engineers from Lycoming inspected some of the engines and found that the power setting that Cape Air uses in their SOPs is causing a vibration that could be causing alot of the failures. Apparently the power setting of 27in/21rps/90pph (85 now I think) is not found anywhere in the P.O.H. for a cruise setting, nor is the high speed cruise of 29.5in/2450rps/120pph. Although these setting are "approved" by the manufacturer. Best of luck finding and solving the problem.

Is Island Air or Nantucket Shuttle doing any extra inspections? Obviously they all operate their 402s in a very similar way.

My buddy runs his own aircraft maintenance shop at the Chatham Airport, right down the road from Hyannis. Your above statement is absolutely correct. He said he's talked with a few people over there and it's apparently not the engine's fault, but instead the power settings and practices of operating well outside of TBO.

MM

 

[zawillif]

The rumor that I heard was that the the engineers from Lycoming inspected some of the engines and found that the power setting that Cape Air uses in their SOPs is causing a vibration that could be causing alot of the failures. Apparently the power setting of 27in/21rps/90pph (85 now I think) is not found anywhere in the P.O.H. for a cruise setting, nor is the high speed cruise of 29.5in/2450rps/120pph. Although these setting are "approved" by the manufacturer. Best of luck finding and solving the problem.

Kinda true, but some details missed. First off the engines are Continental engines, not Lycoming.

Second, the power and fuel settings Cape Air uses are specifically designed to operate out of normal range for TBO extensions. Awhile back after they standardized their procedures they began tweaking the power settings and fuel flow. When the TBO came up on a specific engine they sent it back to Continental, who disassembled it and miked all necessary parts. When it was shown that the engine was operating normally with no wear they were authorized a TBO increase of 10%. They continued to to this until the TBO had been extended a great amount (can't recall the exact numbers). That is how they arrived at the current power settings and fuel flows. It was all done professionally and through Continental and FAA scrutiny and approval.

 

[Way2Broke]

Ya... Continental... thats what I meant. Sometimes I type faster than I think. (TSIO520VB to be exact) Either way good for them for doing the safe thing here.

TBO is 2700 hours at Cape Air. I have a feeling that will change.

 

[Prop2Jet]

just MEL it..... Man......

 

[Way2Broke]

I just read that Island Airlines is honoring Nantucket Airlines tickets since the Nantucket Airline side of Cape Air was shut down today. I guess the rumors about Island Air and Cape Air really being one company might be true after all.

 

[Holy Shiite]

What is the real problem here? Counterweights do not "wear" They are part of the reciprocating assembly(crankshaft) that balances the engine and come in contact with no moving parts with the exception of oil splashing around. It seems to me a more likely problem is that the crankshaft fails and splits itself in half or a few pieces. Does anyone know the real cause of failure of these engines? HS

 

[Berkut]

Counterweights do not "wear" They are part of the reciprocating assembly(crankshaft) that balances the engine and come in contact with no moving parts

They are moving parts, and they do have bushings that wear.

 

[Way2Broke]

So are they back up and running or is everyone sitting at Uno's drinking beers?

 

[BFE]

Lycoming says it's not their fault?....Weird!


About 15 years ago had lifters go out in a Lycoming engone. Lycoming said it was rust build-up due to lack of use and they were not at fault.

We posed the question: What power setting does rust build up on the lifters? The plane was used for flight instruction and flown 4 hours a day.

Lycoming then fixed the problem.

 

[ackattacker]

Lycoming says it's not their fault?....Weird!


About 15 years ago had lifters go out in a Lycoming engone. Lycoming said it was rust build-up due to lack of use and they were not at fault.

We posed the question: What power setting does rust build up on the lifters? The plane was used for flight instruction and flown 4 hours a day.

Lycoming then fixed the problem.

Ummm, they are Continental engines. And nobody is ducking blame (yet). The jury is still out on what caused the counterweights to fail. All the talk about power settings is just talk... pure speculation. When they do figure it out you I would not be surprised to see an emergency AD.

In other news, nearly all the engines have been repaired and Cape Air is operating a normal schedule. Apparently they were able to manufacture a special tool which enabled them to replace the parts without removing the engine from the aircraft.

 

[Skaz]

spoke to Gene Smith, no plans to EVER change the C402's, their whole infrastructure is set up around them....

 

[Skaz]

Any Cape Air pilots on the forum ? Could you please post some info about what its like living in one of hte Caribbean bases?

Is the pay enough to live on
Housing
Cost of living
Do you rotate to other bases
How often do you rotate, if you do
Spouse
Work for significant other
Activities
etc
etc

Thanks in advance

 

[belchfire]

What is the real problem here? Counterweights do not "wear" They are part of the reciprocating assembly(crankshaft) that balances the engine and come in contact with no moving parts with the exception of oil splashing around. It seems to me a more likely problem is that the crankshaft fails and splits itself in half or a few pieces. Does anyone know the real cause of failure of these engines? HS

You are incorrect.

While all of the 4 cylinder engines I can think of have fixed counterweights, all of the 6 bangers on aircraft that I can think of have dynamic counterweights that are mounted on bushings and float.

In 1999 there was an AD (AD 99-19-01) that affected many of the TCM factory OH'd O-470 and 520 series engines due to wear in the die that was used to press counterweight bushings into the crankshaft. The die was putting a small mark on the mounting surface that was just the right depth to damage the nitriding on the crankshaft resulting in stress cracks forming. These cracks would lead to crankshaft failure at something over eighty hours TSMO.

 

[Way2Broke]

spoke to Gene Smith, no plans to EVER change the C402's, their whole infrastructure is set up around them....

Gene Smith is only a recruiter for Cape Air, nothing more nothing less. He has absolutely no say in the fleet strategies of the company. Unfortunately, 402s can not fly forever even though they are great planes.

I heard that like other piston 135 operators Cape Air is canceling flights because of lack of staffing. I also heard that upper management is calling line pilots begging them to work days off. Could this have anything to do with the extremely low starting pay of 12.81 a hour at a 35 hour a week guarantee. Sure, most lines are 40 hours a week, but even at 40 hours a week first year pay for a CAPTAIN (The Job Requires an ATP AMEL) at this company is 26,665 a year, with no company paid medical, or vacation days. Try living on Cape Cod on that kind of pay.......

The current hiring situation dictates much hire pay scale to attract qualified applicants to a PIC piston job. Or for that matter any PIC job.

 

[pinoyatc]

You know you have a pilot shortage when there are planes sitting on the ramp and [SIZE=-1]Boston-Maine Airways is flying for you out of EWB...
[/SIZE]

 

[Palerider957]

just MEL it..... Man......

Yeah, no $hit. Just do the ASA thing and put stickers all over the cockpit.....solves everything.

 

[Way2Broke]

You know you have a pilot shortage when there are planes sitting on the ramp and [SIZE=-1]Boston-Maine Airways is flying for you out of EWB...
[/SIZE]

Boston Maine has pilots? Long live the Jetstream junkies!

 

[ackattacker]

Gene Smith is only a recruiter for Cape Air, nothing more nothing less. He has absolutely no say in the fleet strategies of the company. Unfortunately, 402s can not fly forever even though they are great planes.

I heard that like other piston 135 operators Cape Air is canceling flights because of lack of staffing. I also heard that upper management is calling line pilots begging them to work days off. Could this have anything to do with the extremely low starting pay of 12.81 a hour at a 35 hour a week guarantee. Sure, most lines are 40 hours a week, but even at 40 hours a week first year pay for a CAPTAIN (The Job Requires an ATP AMEL) at this company is 26,665 a year, with no company paid medical, or vacation days. Try living on Cape Cod on that kind of pay.......

The current hiring situation dictates much hire pay scale to attract qualified applicants to a PIC piston job. Or for that matter any PIC job.

I can confirm all this is true. I would like to add that in addition to low starting pay, Cape Air has not given their "traditional" (but not contractual) yearly pay increase to current pilots despite posting a significant profit. I guess they feel low pay and low staffing levels are unrelated.