Can ATC Declare Emergency?

[Vector4fun]

It's up to the controllers and Supes involved, but we generally roll the ARFF trucks any time there's any doubt. Some pilots get peeved a bit by that, but there's no reason to in my region. The ARFF guys like the practice. (Really!)


Any time we roll the trucks, there's a local form with the times and major details that gets filled out, and a local log entry. So long as no damage or injuries result, AND we don't have to close a runway for some time, or other major impact to the operation, then it won't go any further.

IF, a scheduled 121 operator has any kind of unusual incident, even if it's not an emergency, an order went out some time ago that we make a log entry and call it into the Regional Com Center. So far as I know, the ONLY reason for that is so if FAA gets a call from a pax or reporter some time later, the FAA Regional folks know what happened. I'll give a typical situation. MD80 taxis out for Dep, but then has to return to the gate to sort out a mechanical problem, we are supposed to call RCC to let them know. So we have to ask the crew for the nature of the problem and put it in the logs and make the call. Typically, the RCC couldn't care less, but they log it. It doesn't go much further, except a summary of all such incidents gets put out every week day or so. Nothing becomes of the info unless the FAA noticed an unusual pattern I suppose.
Same would apply to any 135 or 91 flight "of interest". Meaning, if we're aware of any VIPs on board or some such.

 

[avbug]

Indeed. At all times, do whatever is necessary to accomplish what you must.

The point of the thread, I believe, is that even when the pilot in command fails to address the seriousness of the situation, ATC may make that decision for the PIC. ATC may grant priority without any request or authorization from the PIC.

ATC may also provide priority handling, to include notification of emergency services, as ATC sees fit. You'll recall that during the Payne Steward incident, the crew certainly didn't request a fighter intercept, but they got it, twice, and until impact. ATC determined that an emergency condition existed and took appropriate action. Little or nothing could be done but watch the aircraft until it flamed out and began a terminal descent in that case, but ATC took the appropriate action of requesting the intercept.

Emergencies and situations requiring priority take many, many forms. Addressing each specifically in advance is impossible. A company may learn after the fact that something is wrong on an already departed flight; the company takes action to ensure the situation is handled. Perhaps requesting ATC to divert the flight, perhaps an intercept, perhaps notification of a mechanical or maintenance issue which has just come to light. That does happen. The crew certainly has the option of taking any action necessaryto deal with a situation that affects the safety of flight. ATC likewise has the option, and the duty, to deal with an emergency or priority situation as may be required...and ATC can and does do this.

I've been afforded priority by ATC, without my request, on quite a few occasions. A number of them have involved emergency type operations of one kind or another, and ATC provided me priority handling without my having to request it, simply because of my type of operation at the time. ATC has the option of requiring that a report be filed, but I've never had that request. The report to be filed is spelled out in 14 CFR 91.123(d).

 

[Moonfly201]

I've been afforded priority by ATC, without my request, on quite a few occasions.

Here's one that could have developed, but didn't;

Departing a Class C towered airport, shortly after leveling off at initial altitude.
Mooney 719 (my aircraft): Departure, Mooney 719 would like to return to the field.
Departure: Is there a problem?
Mooney 719: Negative, no problem.
Departure: Mooney 719, why are you requesting a return to the airport?
Mooney 719: Because I discovered that the keys to the rental car I just dropped off at the FBO are in my pocket.
Departure: Mooney 719, turn left heading 240 and report the field in sight.

 

[Lrjtcaptain]

Well, yes we have the authority to declare the emergency on behalf of the situation at hand.

I always ask an a/c if they need assistance when they call in with an issue. If so, then I will declare it an emergency situation, give it priority handeling and roll the crash and rescue.

I had an idiot last summer in a C210. 3 hour of fuel left, his entire family on board didn't want to declare an emergency even though his gear wouldn't come down. He said he was going to hold outside the airspace and try and solve the problem. Well, 10 minutes later nothing had changed, I had notified crash and rescue to standby. Once he was inbound, i rolled the trucks, the idiot never declared an emergency but i felt that one should definatly be called on this one. They all survived, but he landed, didn't shut down his engine, tore off part of the left wing so it was probably a good reason for me to call it on that. Some pilots just don't waant to delcare because of fear of FAA intervention, NTSB stuff, and paper work. Quite sad because technically we are not allowed to provide priority handeling unless its an emergency...

TWR this is Seminole 44Bravo, we just lost an engine.
Seminole 44bravo are you declaring an emergency?
Negative.
Seminole 44bravo roger, left traffic rwy 14, report on the downwind youll be number 10 for the runway.

 

[Flibmeister]

... technically we are not allowed to provide priority handeling unless its an emergency...

No, no, no, no, no! Whoever taught you that is an idiot. Ask him to show you where it says that in the 7110.65.

The paragraph below from the 7110.65 provides you almost infinite latitude in determining that an aircraft should be treated as an emergency (ie, given priority), regardless of whether the pilot asks for it (or even wants it). The italics are mine:

"10-1-1. EMERGENCY DETERMINATIONS

d. Because of the infinite variety of possible emergency situations, specific procedures cannot be prescribed. However, when you believe an emergency exists or is imminent, select and pursue a course of action which appears to be most appropriate under the circumstances and which most nearly conforms to the instructions in this manual."


In other words, if the guy in the Seminole tells you he's lost an engine, but is too stupid (or busy) to declare an emergency, then YOU do it-- by simply making him number one. No need to tell him you're doing it, just do it. If all goes well, that should be the end of it; if not, at least you did the best you could.

I once provided priority handling (causing short delays for a few airliners, and a go-around to another) which (I'm told) may have saved the life of a dog (inadvertently loaded as cargo, in a compartment that also had dry ice aboard). Not many pilots would declare an emergency in such a situation, for fear of repercussions-- but I could (and did) provide priority handling anyway, knowing that the worst that could happen is that some guy in the office wearing a tie might later say, "You did that for a dog?"

Nobody did, BTW-- and but if they had, I'd of said, "Yup, and proud of it."

No controller ever got in trouble for providing too much service, particularly to an aircraft that has any sort of problem-- but plenty have had their judgement questioned in the aftermath of an accident, because they didn't provide enough.

 

[PropsForward]

Not sure about the other FAA regions, but here in the Northeast whenever a pilot obtains any type of "priority handling" by ATC, the flight has been automatically declared an emergency by ATC. Those magic "I declare" words need not be uttered by anyone.

In many cases the pilot is not even aware of it unless he lands with the equipment on the runway. Or gets a phone call or visit from the local FSDO asking what happened.

And, it is mandatory (here in the NE) that EVERY emergency gets reported swifty by ATC to the local FSDO. Whether or not the words were ever mentioned.

So on climbout on a X/C flight, before you ask tower for a return to the runway due to a minor vibration you would like to check out on the ground, and tower gives you priority handling by telling the C-150 on downwind to continue, clearing you for landing, make sure you REALLY need to be on the front of the line. You will be getting contacted by a possibly not so friendly fed. Guaranteed. And if you tell him there was some type of mechanical problem, your A&P is next in line.

So if you take off, and realize you left your microwave pizza in the car you are better off to cancel IFR, turn around, pickup ATIS, and land as a normal inbound aircraft....

 

[Vector4fun]

I gave priority to a cherokee the other night that reported some breakers popping. It was night, and not real good vis, but the pilot didn't want to declare an emergency nor ask for any priority. I didn't care because the LAST thing I wanted was a "dark" cherokee wandering around in 3 miles vis at night looking for the ILS, which he might not even be able to track. Took three airliners for a 20 mile scenic tour of two counties at four thousand. Ah well, I didn't have to fill out an accident package!

 

[avbug]

And just as importantly, neither did the pilot of that Cherokee. Kudos to you.

 

[Moonfly201]

I would much rather be safely on thegroundwithequipment standing by that is not needed, then to be stuckinsidemya/c burning to death wishing that the equipment isstandingby.

So would most of us I'm sure.

But let's not assume that ATC provided assistance provided in absenceofthe pilot's knowledge or desires is going to save the day in verymanyinstances.

In my opinion the pilot should make the determination ifgroundassistance is required, or if being moved to the head of the lineis inorder for the safety of their flight. Not ATC. We have thatauthority,and it's called declaring an emergency.

Treating all pilots as idiots, because a small minority actuallyareidiots, is lowering the common denominator for everyone. And inthelong term the safety benefits derived by well intentionednon-requestedATC assistance may likely be cancelled out by futuremandatory ATCregulations. It's starting already, as when ATC declaresan emergencyon the pilot's behalf without the pilot even being madeaware of thedeclaration. Since anyone flying is potentially an idiot,we musttreat them all as such.

P.S. I apologize for some the typed words sticking together ... some type of software glitch on this site.

 

[Flibmeister]

It's starting already, as when ATC declaresan emergencyon the pilot's behalf without the pilot even being madeaware of thedeclaration.

FYI, this is nothing that has "started" recently-- ATC has had such authority for at least 30 years.

 

[350DRIVER]

Quite sad because technically we are not allowed to provide priority handeling unless its an emergency...

TWR this is Seminole 44Bravo, we just lost an engine.
Seminole 44bravo are you declaring an emergency?
Negative.
Seminole 44bravo roger, left traffic rwy 14, report on the downwind youll be number 10 for the runway.

Above scenario quite unlikely. Majority of controllers understand the difference between "technically" and "reality", be assured "technically" will take a backseat with 99% of the sharp controllers out there when put in a scenario as mentioned in your response.

I sure hope you don't put "technically" before common sense when you are forced with that in real life.

Vector4fun, nice job- I have seen this practice quite often by many controllers, most will extend the helping hand whenever a pilot may be in need.

3 5 0

 

[PropsForward]

...removed...

 

[PropsForward]

Some pilots just don't waant to delcare because of fear of FAA intervention, NTSB stuff, and paper work. Quite sad because technically we are not allowed to provide priority handeling unless its an emergency...

TWR this is Seminole 44Bravo, we just lost an engine.
Seminole 44bravo are you declaring an emergency?
Negative.
Seminole 44bravo roger, left traffic rwy 14, report on the downwind youll be number 10 for the runway.

Yeah, this is unfortunate. While you want a balance between serious emergencies, and emergencies where the pilot is over-reacting, it seems the majority of conversation on this topic is not to declare unless death is imminent and this is unfortunate.



I heard of a CFI that ran scenarios across his students, quizzing them if they would declare in that situation. His efforts were actively discouraging his students from ever declaring except for catastrophic situations. Very unfortunate.

 

[350DRIVER]

Nothing unfortunate about it. If the pilot needs to get the aircraft back on the runway in a rather quickly manner then regardless of whether or not he does declare then the controllers should speed the process up, which usually does take place 99% of the time. Declaring or not, doesn't really matter.. Most controllers will bend over backwards for a pilot that needs the help should he be in a position where he needs to get down asap. It has more to do with common sense, urgency, and doing one's best to aid a pilot who needs help the most. I do not think the above scenario is quite likely as I have previously pointed out. Every single situation that I have seen/heard with regards to inflight problems the controllers diverted all aircraft away and gave the problem aircraft priority regardless of whether or not they have declared the emergency. A few magic words don't mean a whole lot when you look at the big picture. If you need to get down then simply advise atc, cope with the problem, and do your best to get down asap. Not all situations will require you to declare an emergency and it would be foolish to start preaching that any problems one would have then without a second thought he should declare one.

3 5 0

 

[PropsForward]

Nothing unfortunate about it. If the pilot needs to get the aircraft back on the runway in a rather quickly manner then regardless of whether or not he does declare then the controllers should speed the process up, which usually does take place 99% of the time. Declaring or not, doesn't really matter.. Most controllers will bend over backwards for a pilot that needs the help should he be in a position where he needs to get down asap. It has more to do with common sense, urgency, and doing one's best to aid a pilot who needs help the most. I do not think the above scenario is quite likely as I have previously pointed out. Every single situation that I have seen/heard with regards to inflight problems the controllers diverted all aircraft away and gave the problem aircraft priority regardless of whether or not they have declared the emergency. A few magic words don't mean a whole lot when you look at the big picture. If you need to get down then simply advise atc, cope with the problem, and do your best to get down asap. Not all situations will require you to declare an emergency and it would be foolish to start preaching that any problems one would have then without a second thought he should declare one.

3 5 0

Yeah, I agree. The perception of ATC to pickup on the pilots problem and clear the way is great. I'm just saying that a lot of pilots reason for not declaring is a fear of getting in trouble and this has cost a lot of pilots their lives, granted they have most likely put themselves in the emergency they find themself in (like fuel exhaustion) and the issue does need to be addressed with the pilot after they are safely down. Just a real delicate balance.

 

[350DRIVER]

If the circumstances dictate that the situation is indeed an emergency then by all means declare it. The only thing that I am saying is that those magic words aren't going to get the problem aircraft back on the ground any sooner. When human life is hanging in the balance then "fear" of anything else other than death or serious bodily injury or harm shouldn't even be considered or contemplated. The last thing that should ever be on a pilot's mind is the potential of facing possible action against their tickets should they need to declare. Some circumstances and situations dictate it to be a true "emergency", others do not. It is ultimately up to the PIC to make that determination. Anyways, I think the controllers do a superb job handling these situations for the most part and they realize it is better to be down here than up there when something goes sour and south that is not desirable.

ATC will also bend over backwards when you are doing med flights with organs or patients onboard where it is time critical to get to where you need to get to. 99.9% of the time I was cleared direct destination with no delay enroute or upon arrival at the destination airport. Most controllers understand that the dying patient in the back could one day be a family member or that heart or liver that is on it's way could just as easily be for one of their family members.

 

[dseagrav]

What happens if ATC himself has an emergency? Fire in the cab, coffeemaker failure, etc?

 

[Vector4fun]

Hey, you don't want to see me vector without coffee. It aint pretty.....

 

[minitour]

Hey, you don't want to see me vector without coffee. It aint pretty.....

Oh, that's easy. Just start giving out holding instructions...

-mini

 

[skydiverdriver]

Yes they can, and so can your dispatcher.