Boeing's big bet

[Midnight Flyer]

???

How the h#ll would the passengers know if it was a yoke or a sidestick if they were sitting in the back??

Idiot.

Douglass bird?? yeah right, go back to your RJ

 

[Orionflyer]

???

How the h#ll would the passengers know if it was a yoke or a sidestick if they were sitting in the back??

Idiot.

Maybe you missed my point (or the usual InstructorDude antics!!).

.... With Colgan, the presence of the yoke was not a contributing factor to the mishap. In fact, it was doing everything it could to alert it's user to the dire situation: shaking, pushing forward, probably buffeting.

With Air France, the fully deflected sidestick wasn't offering many clues as to the nature of the problem. The aural stall warning was intermittent because the engineers assumed that with AOA over 40 and airspeed under 60, the readings must be invalid ... when actually, those numbers pretty much describe a fully-stalled, transport class airplane.

Just my opinion, but I doubt that two pilots would ride a stalled airplane for 3 minutes down 35,000 ft with two yokes buried in their laps without clueing into the stall and at least letting go for a few seconds.

 

[waveflyer]

As said above, I have yet to meet a person who HAS FLOWN BOTH, but still chooses a yoke.

"IT'S THE ONLY ARGUMENT I NEED SHAWN!!!"

SS+1
yokes are just dumb in any airplane created after 1990.
Now I do want that sidestick to deflect naturally and certainly want moving thrust levers on autothrottles-
But weight and systems designed to fool the pilot into thinking it's operating in a way that it isn't.... Not so much.

I blame Age65 for the yoke decision

Geezers need yokes- if you're younger than 58 and can't handle a sidestick you need a new profession.

 

[instructordude]

Douglass bird?? yeah right, go back to your RJ

I am at a Major and have been for awhile.

 

[Andy]

.... With Colgan, the presence of the yoke was not a contributing factor to the mishap. In fact, it was doing everything it could to alert it's user to the dire situation: shaking, pushing forward, probably buffeting.

With Air France, the fully deflected sidestick wasn't offering many clues as to the nature of the problem. The aural stall warning was intermittent because the engineers assumed that with AOA over 40 and airspeed under 60, the readings must be invalid ... when actually, those numbers pretty much describe a fully-stalled, transport class airplane.

Just my opinion, but I doubt that two pilots would ride a stalled airplane for 3 minutes down 35,000 ft with two yokes buried in their laps without clueing into the stall and at least letting go for a few seconds.

OK, I understand what you were saying now.
I'd chalk up those issues to poor software programming, not yoke vs sidestick. I've always had an issue with the way that Airbus handles some things.
As for the stick shaker, that has to be programmed into fly by wire aircraft with yokes and the same can be done with sidesticks.

 

[FR8mastr]

The yoke is all about the feedback. When the autopilot is turning so is your yoke. The guy next to you is doing something on his side, you can see it on yours. the Boeing keeps you in the loop. This is the same reason for moving auto throttles, it is one more clue to what the heck is going on. Also that wonderful little red button that actually does turn the auto pilot off. It's all about pilots vs system managers. I am also willing to bet even with all the bravado, nobody in this country has ever needed that 120lbs capacity, for anything other than a flight bag.

If they made a side stick that did the same, bring it on.

 

[bpapaDC8]

I fly with 300 hour wonders in my right seat on the A320, I would rather have a yoke to be able to stay in the loop as FR8mastr said. Dual imput does not cut it in this situation.

 

[BrickTop]

I fly with 300 hour wonders in my right seat on the A320,

Wherever you are flying an AIRBUS with 300 hr pilots, puts YOU in an airline OPERATION to WONDER about.

 

[C601]

Wow another my yoke is bigger then your yoke thread /

 

[flyguy75000]

And it STILL has a yoke.

You do know that Boeing's goal was to achieve a common type for the 787 with the 777? Kind of a nice selling point to customers to reduce training costs, etc.......

The FAA/EASA may have had an issue with the two having different control set-ups. And like Fr8Master said, the engineers did not like the lack of visual feedback with a side stick and went with a control column way back wehn with the 777.

But does anything really matter except what the negotiated pay rates are going to be???

 

[eaglesview]

The yoke is all about the feedback. When the autopilot is turning so is your yoke. The guy next to you is doing something on his side, you can see it on yours. the Boeing keeps you in the loop. This is the same reason for moving auto throttles, it is one more clue to what the heck is going on. Also that wonderful little red button that actually does turn the auto pilot off. It's all about pilots vs system managers. I am also willing to bet even with all the bravado, nobody in this country has ever needed that 120lbs capacity, for anything other than a flight bag.

If they made a side stick that did the same, bring it on.

Another opinion by someone who obviously has not flown the bus. I and most people I fly with use "the little red button" all the time. Auto throttles come off too, flys nice.

 

[eaglesview]

You do know that Boeing's goal was to achieve a common type for the 787 with the 777? Kind of a nice selling point to customers to reduce training costs, etc.......

The FAA/EASA may have had an issue with the two having different control set-ups. And like Fr8Master said, the engineers did not like the lack of visual feedback with a side stick and went with a control column way back wehn with the 777.

But does anything really matter except what the negotiated pay rates are going to be???

Side stick transition takes 15 minutes tops. Yoke in the 787 was a poor desicion.

Agree with the last line though!!!